Landlord claiming my whole deposit

[RedViking]

My Landlord is awesome. She always discuss the rent with me first before it increases and will never increase it to an amount I can't afford. If I fix something, she refunds me. If something major needs attention, she makes sure it is sorted. When lockdown hit us and many didn't get an income or had to support family to survive, she send me a mail to ask if we can afford the rent as she is willing to reduce it so she can at least pay the rates.

Sadly many landlords like this are also being taken advantage of.

So yeah, it is a two way relationship. The biggest issue is the stupid useless agents. Glad I don't have to deal with that crap.

 

[TofuMofu]

I've NEVER left a rental with holes and marks on the walls...You should be leaving it as you got it.

Last rental I moved out of was painted out completely by us and we closed up holes that the previous renter left as well.

That being said, I never want to rent a place ever again...landlords are so all over the place...some leave you the hell alone and others are always being problematic.

 

[zerocool2009]

I've NEVER left a rental with holes and marks on the walls...You should be leaving it as you got it.

Last rental I moved out of was painted out completely by us and we closed up holes that the previous renter left as well.

That being said, I never want to rent a place ever again...landlords are so all over the place...some leave you the hell alone and others are always being problematic.

Hats off to you that you repaid! Not alot of tenants think like that

 

[airborne]

So turns out the RHT is an bad as the landlords.

Got our court date, landlord said he would be out of the country, luckily they ignored that because there he was. (Just another attempt to continue to enrich himself with our money)

Somehow, inexplicably, they awarded him costs (which he never paid) to cut a hedge (despite it being maintained by a professional garden service every two weeks) and crazily 4 months rental increase that he "forgot to charge us" - despite emails showing he agreed to keep the rent the same.

The law is an ass... And tribunals are made up of the same idiots as the rest of government. Unfortunately even if everything is on your side - its still a coin flip, because their word is final unless you fancy going to the high court to get a real judge involved (not worth it for a few k, of course!). It genuinely felt like the chair didn't consider the fact that with no entry inspection and nothing brought up on exit inspection that the landlord could just make stuff up and that was okay?

For the scunmy landlords out there. Lesson is - dont pay back desposits... It will take the RHT 2 years to sit and you can earn good interest and only be made to be pay back 3% (and all along you can make up bogus stuff until the actual day of court and they will listen to and consider it).

I think I stand by my initial advice. Go in hard as you aint getting fair treatment. Possession is 9 tenths.

Having come out the other end what do you reckon is the best way to deal with a landlord in the situation you found yourself in?

It seems he had you with your balls in a vice and he knew it.

But then again I wonder if he was disclosing all the rental income to SARS. Many dodgy landlords don't disclose their rental income fully if at all, maybe a little anonymous tip off would get some equitable pay back?

 

[TofuMofu]

Hats off to you that you repaid! Not alot of tenants think like that

I just think that if it was my place, I would want it in as good a shape as handed it over to a tenant.

 

[zerocool2009]

I just think that if it was my place, I would want it in as good a shape as handed it over to a tenant.

Correct! Its a 2way street!

 

[Gozado]

I just think that if it was my place, I would want it in as good a shape as handed it over to a tenant.

I wonder if this is fair to the tenant. Some things just do wear out from normal use, so I think it depends in part upon how long the tenant lives there.

If paintwork, inside, (which belongs to the landlord as an inherent part of the building) can be said to have a lifespan of about 10 years, then surely if a tenant lives there for 10 years the tenant shouldn't have to pay anything at all towards the landlord's re-painting?

For tenants who leave after 1 year, or after 4, the assessment should be how much they've "used up" paintwork. If it looks as if it will continue to last for the remaining usual years (in this example 9 years, or 6 years) of its usual lifespan, then should the tenant still pay to make it all new? Or only have to pay for repainting if they've caused the paintwork's lifespan to be reduced? Or pay a proportion in relation to the duration of their tenancy?

 

[TofuMofu]

I wonder if this is fair to the tenant. Some things just do wear out from normal use, so I think it depends in part upon how long the tenant lives there.

If paintwork, inside, (which belongs to the landlord as an inherent part of the building) can be said to have a lifespan of about 10 years, then surely if a tenant lives there for 10 years the tenant shouldn't have to pay anything at all towards the landlord's re-painting?

For tenants who leave after 1 year, or after 4, the assessment should be how much they've "used up" paintwork. If it looks as if it will continue to last for the remaining usual years (in this example 9 years, or 6 years) of its usual lifespan, then should the tenant still pay to make it all new? Or only have to pay for repainting if they've caused the paintwork's lifespan to be reduced? Or pay a proportion in relation to the duration of their tenancy?

Wear and tear is fine, but if the tenant made holes in the wall or the kids drew on the walls or the dog ripped out he carpets, then then tenant needs to fix it.

 

[Gnome]

So turns out the RHT is an bad as the landlords.
<snip>

I feel like maybe we aren't getting the full story here

Somehow, inexplicably, they awarded him costs (which he never paid) to cut a hedge (despite it being maintained by a professional garden service every two weeks) and crazily 4 months rental increase that he "forgot to charge us" - despite emails showing he agreed to keep the rent the same.

So you were there and you point this out and they just ignore it?

It genuinely felt like the chair didn't consider the fact that with no entry inspection and nothing brought up on exit inspection that the landlord could just make stuff up and that was okay?

What did he say in his "judgement" about that?

I mean literally this is in the act?

(5) At the expiration of the lease, the landlord must arrange a joint inspection of the dwelling at a mutually convenient time to take place within a period of three days prior to such expiration, with a view to ascertaining if there is any damage caused to the dwelling during the tenant’s occupation: Provided that—
(a) failure by the landlord to inspect the dwelling in the presence of the tenant as contemplated in this subsection, is deemed to be an acknowledgement by the landlord that the dwelling is in a good and proper state of repair and the landlord will have no further claim against the tenant; or
(b) should the tenant fail to respond to the landlord’s request for an inspection as contemplated in this subsection, the landlord must, within seven days from the expiration of the lease, inspect the dwelling in order to

source

I would literally quote that at him. Or did the landlord claim there was a mutual inspection?

 

[Matt91]

Squatters have more rights than landlords, get an old biddy to move in for a month and stay another month rent free.

 

[Gnome]

Squatters have more rights than landlords, get an old biddy to move in for a month and stay another month rent free.

Sadly a very common trend in most countries in the world. The US has the other extreme were a landlord can just pitch up and throw you out.

There has to be a balance but what SA, UK, etc. has is just completely crazy

 

[richjdavies]

I feel like maybe we aren't getting the full story here



So you were there and you point this out and they just ignore it?



What did he say in his "judgement" about that?

I mean literally this is in the act?


source

I would literally quote that at him. Or did the landlord claim there was a mutual inspection?

Too late. Its not just the landlord. We quoted that at the tribunal...

I am at a complete loss as to what they were thinking awarding him the three things they did - and that after taking 2 years!!! Yes 2 years!!! To pay us back a cent of our 66,000 rand deposit.

I was really expecting them to throw the book at him. At one point they even turned to.him and said his lease was archaic, not in keeping with the CPA and used the wrong terms and he needs to get better legal advice... But still somehow we got pretty much everything he wanted...

I'm gunna go with the one member who was asleep through half of it (not kidding), just flipped a coin to decide each point. Either that or they decided South African Landlord vs dirty foreigner... Keep it in the country...

Ps - the tribunal even calculated the interest incorrectly... didnt compound it..

Anyway. Rant over. I've got better things to do with my time. If I'd have known it would take 2 years and many hours of time and worry (not the 90 days promised) I would have bent over, lubed up and settled on day 1.

 

[richjdavies]

My Landlord is awesome. She always discuss the rent with me first before it increases and will never increase it to an amount I can't afford. If I fix something, she refunds me. If something major needs attention, she makes sure it is sorted. When lockdown hit us and many didn't get an income or had to support family to survive, she send me a mail to ask if we can afford the rent as she is willing to reduce it so she can at least pay the rates.

Sadly many landlords like this are also being taken advantage of.

So yeah, it is a two way relationship. The biggest issue is the stupid useless agents. Glad I don't have to deal with that crap.

Ps - my one BEFORE the problem one and current one now = AWESOME! Just like the above.

Last week gate was giving us issues. One whatsapp - tells me contact X... 3 hours later gate fixed, invoice straight to landlord.

I think a good guide to a good Landlord - tradesmen like them and are good tradesmen.

If your landlord has a bad paint job when you move in, call it quits and expect problems for the next 13 months.

 

[competentblob]

To pay us back a cent of our 66,000 rand deposit.

Wait what

 

[richjdavies]

Wait what

Been there done that. Cape Town is expensive... Big house, nice area. 2 months...

 

[Gnome]

Too late. Its not just the landlord. We quoted that at the tribunal...

I am at a complete loss as to what they were thinking awarding him the three things they did - and that after taking 2 years!!! Yes 2 years!!! To pay us back a cent of our 66,000 rand deposit.

I was really expecting them to throw the book at him. At one point they even turned to.him and said his lease was archaic, not in keeping with the CPA and used the wrong terms and he needs to get better legal advice... But still somehow we got pretty much everything he wanted...

I'm gunna go with the one member who was asleep through half of it (not kidding), just flipped a coin to decide each point. Either that or they decided South African Landlord vs dirty foreigner... Keep it in the country...

Ps - the tribunal even calculated the interest incorrectly... didnt compound it..

Anyway. Rant over. I've got better things to do with my time. If I'd have known it would take 2 years and many hours of time and worry (not the 90 days promised) I would have bent over, lubed up and settled on day 1.

So how much was he awarded after all this?

 

[richjdavies]

So how much was he awarded after all this?

He still had to pay back deposit plus 3 percent interest, minus 2500 for hedge and R1000 for paint and I think it was 8k for the 8% increase (that we didnt agree to) for the 3 months over the original lease.
We did win half of our claim for the 4 days that he agreed NOT to charge us rent whilst he replaced the roof (after 6 months of one room flooding every time it rained...not a joke).

So all told ... Hes made quite a few K from waiting and playing dumb.

If you're ever looking for a place in Newlands, Cape Town and a certain Mr Allen (sometimes known as Rod, sometimes as Jon) is self listing his place... You have been warned (agents didn't even want to work with him!)