Multiple Myloma - Hemp Oil = quackery

[RiaX]

I read an interesting article a while back regarding this hemp oil business. Basically it boiled down to the fact that while they have had some success in certain trials with THC they also have had the same results with things like broccoli (can't remember exactly, but is was a veggie). I will see if I can find that site again.

That would be interesting. Though most of the THC trials have about 20 to 60 patients in trial, their findings are not statistically significant. They also compared to a saline placebo. There are no decent comparisions to THC against any commercially available product.

If you can find the link it would be much appreciated though.

I can assure you that I have zero qualifications or professional experience in any field involving this particular subject matter

Then dont act like you do because you preaching nonsense and someone might actually take your advice.

And if I did, I would not be trumpeting it at every opportunity, as information should stand on its own merits

It does you choose to ignore it. You have no rationale in the use of cannibis in cancer patients as an analgesic, it has no proper supporting evidence. If you had cancer pains and all you had was saline and weed, then yes use the weed.

I hope you aren't too stupid to understand those big scientific phrases

You would be surprised how people think they know the definition of something when they know next to nothing about it. I can say I know evolution or gravity but to a professor in biology or in physics they will show me how little I know. Pharmacology is just as complex

 

[F4bio]

That's bad news f4bio, sorry to hear about your mom :-(

Feel as though I'm living a nightmare tbh. But gotta be strong(and smile when I see her!!!) and not crush her hope at all costs.

 

[F4bio]

The whole truth about cannabis and cancer:
- it alleviates chemotherapy nausea
- it stimulates appetite
- help with constipation
- it help patient relax

That is all.

\\

Thanks. My desperation to have her well again has clouded my better judgement.

 

[Swa]

OP, take RiaX's utterances with a pinch of salt.

With you on this one. While not as good as the stronger pain killers cannabis has a lot of merit. Funny how he would ignore what 1000's of doctors have to say but refer to some selective research only he has access to. Hemp is however not cannabis. True it has the potential to interfere with treatment but so does green tea ffs.

Argumentum ad populum means jack and you know this

And yet you have no problem using it when it supports your view... :erm:

ever wondered why people who have defeated cancer always end up getting another one? it only takes one cell ... just ONE cell

And a chemo drug that causes cancer.

 

[copacetic]

Then dont act like you do because you preaching nonsense and someone might actually take your advice.

I most certainly do not, what are you talking about?

While we are throwing insults about, get your ****ing grammar in order, if you want anyone to take you seriously. Christ...

It does you choose to ignore it. You have no rationale in the use of cannibis in cancer patients as an analgesic, it has no proper supporting evidence. If you had cancer pains and all you had was saline and weed, then yes use the weed.

I would appreciate it if you can point out where I am strongly advocating for cannabis to be used as an analgesic in cancer patients?

 

[RiaX]

Feel as though I'm living a nightmare tbh. But gotta be strong(and smile when I see her!!!) and not crush her hope at all costs.

This is probably the best thing you can do. Its normal for you to want to try anything and everything to help your mum, I can be quite blunt and offensive at times but its for the best. The quicker you understand its out of your hands the better for both her and yourself.

Everyone has lost someone dear to cancer hence why people get so emotional over it. I will tell you what I tell my patients who pour their money down the herbal route and waste it. If it was a real working solution it would be available in pharmacies, doctors would prescribe it and all the cancer patients will use it.

Its the same as "immune boosters", they dont literally boost your immune system if they did every patient with HIV in the world would be on it - so you see there are no quick fixes in the medical world for severe cases like this.

What is she using for the pain atm ? morphine ? and what type of antineoplastic (drug) is she on?

 

[RiaX]

With you on this one. While not as good as the stronger pain killers cannabis has a lot of merit. Funny how he would ignore what 1000's of doctors have to say but refer to some selective research only he has access to. Hemp is however not cannabis. True it has the potential to interfere with treatment but so does green tea ffs.


And yet you have no problem using it when it supports your view... :erm:


And a chemo drug that causes cancer.

Green tea wont effect drug distribution because it doesnt have an extremely lipophilic psychoactive compound in it.

My points arent argumentum ad numerium, go learn what that means. My arguements are taken straight out of a number of clinical journals written by people who are way more qualified than me and you on the subject. who use the scientific method to illustrate what they are saying

Reference your 1000 doctors. FROM A PROPER JOURNAL(S) like ive done on the previous page. Anyways you say evolution is a lie, so science is not your strong point

 

[Swa]

Green tea wont effect drug distribution because it doesnt have an extremely lipophilic psychoactive compound in it.

My points arent argumentum ad numerium, go learn what that means. My arguements are taken straight out of a number of clinical journals written by people who are way more qualified than me and you on the subject.

Argumentum ad populum. Sheesh you don't even know what you said. That's precisely the point. You just mention sources the rest of us don't have access to and dismiss the sources of others. We have no way of checking these sources to see if they really say what you claim and whether or not they are perhaps just cherry picked.

Reference your 1000 doctors. FROM A PROPER JOURNAL like ive done on the previous page. Anyways you say evolution is a lie, so science is not your strong point

And there you resort to something completely irrelevant again. What the hell are on about from a proper journal? Doctors are not from journals idjit.

 

[RiaX]

You just mention sources the rest of us don't have access to

Exactly. Medical research is costly you want the real stuff you have to buy it

And there you resort to something completely irrelevant again. What the hell are on about from a proper journal? Doctors are not from journals idjit.

Where do you think they do their CPD ? LOL

 

[porchrat]

Guys show some compassion. If there was ever a thread to avoid derailing it is this one.

 

[RiaX]

Guys show some compassion. If there was ever a thread to avoid derailing it is this one.

Im not the one derailing these threads. Its nonsense like this from "the specialists" of nothing stating things like (and then defending their rubbish like a high school debate in order to win)

What it very possibly will do is help with the pain as well as alleviate some of the horrible side-effects of the chemo. It is also very unlikely to interfere with ongoing treatment

When its utter nonsense, He doesnt even know how a drug moves in the body. If the cancer is within the CNS as well it would be extremely dangerous. You dont want the chemo that the oncologist is prescribing to be displaced and eliminated because the oncologist isnt going to expect random cannibis being given on the side line without him/her knowing. Im defending my points because this is a serious thing, if the OP was to take this advice his mum could end up in very bad shape.

Normally I wouldnt bother with it on the forum or real life. When patient claims to know something I leave them to it and I fix it when they run back 2 weeks later. In this case what will happen if she has a seizure and dies from cardiac arrest ?

I know everyone wants to be supportive and help but there are times when you must know when to STFU and leave it to the qualified people. Your 2c advice can be very damaging. Especially when you have 0 experience 0 qualifications 0 expertise and 0 access to reliable and peer-reviewed medical information .... the "I read so much about THC" yet he cant describe a single physiochemical property of it wont cut it here.

She has stage 3, she has hope. If she was terminally ill then yes you can do whatever you want to make the time left nice.

then goes all grammar nazi to discredit me - how pathetic.

Wanna use it to treat depression, PTSD or things where the patient's life is not in the balance then what ever go for it however here its a completely different situation. If you ask me presenting rubbish advice as viable options when the stakes are so high is disgraceful

 

[Swa]

Exactly. Medical research is costly you want the real stuff you have to buy it

Nonsense. Journals don't need to pay for articles or research. There's nothing substandard about freely available research. It's every bit as real as those articles you pay a fortune for. I'm assuming you're equating the cost of research to its reliability which besides being a fallacy itself does not relate to what it costs to access it.

Where do you think they do their CPD ? LOL

I do not need to reference doctors from journals. Assuming here you mean these doctors should publish their opinions themselves in journals. No they (most of them) have access to the same sources you do and have come to the conclusion based on that and treating patients. There are no journal references nor should there be.

But as Porch said this is not a thread to derail. The original question has been answered if you want to continue arguing irrelevant stuff you can do it on your own.

 

[RiaX]

Nonsense. Journals don't need to pay for articles or research

errr they do ? I write journal articles. My research leaders are editors of a couple journals. Stop sprouting rubbish.

It's every bit as real as those articles you pay a fortune for

I dont pay for them. I have blanket access due to my lab status and my position in pharmaceutical research (similar to a medical student in university they also have blanket access)

you're equating the cost of research to its reliability which besides being a fallacy itself does not relate to what it costs to access it.

Are you really this stupid or are you pretending ? Money = more equipment, more experiments and hence stronger results.

I do not need to reference doctors from journals

I believe you have no idea what a journal is rofl

these doctors should publish their opinions themselves in journals

They do it quite often. Its letters to the editor. You should pick up a SAMJ one day

No they (most of them) have access to the same sources you do and have come to the conclusion based on that and treating patients

They DONT. They subscribe to journals within their field. Doctors in SA subscribe for SAMJ and the brittish journals and whatever specialist journal if they have an FC number. My access goes from medicine to pharmacology to chemistry and so on. I know a lot of Drs and Ive never come across one approving THC for anything so you pulling things out of your a** once again.

 

[maumau]

.......

ever wondered why people who have defeated cancer always end up getting another one? it only takes one cell ... just ONE cell

Really??????????? Always?????????? That's some of the biggest ****3 ever posted on this forum. And that's saying something.

 

[noxibox]

I'm up at this hour driving myself crazy googled multiple myeloma stage 3 stories and prognosis's. My mom was diagnosed with this dreadful disease and it's a particularly aggressive MM she's got, but they are treating it aggressively with chemo and radiation and I won't know for weeks whether she is responding. The pain she must be in is mind boggling (despite every form of the best pain relief). I stumbled upon this hemp oil cure something I'd laughed at before but now when really desperate I'm looking for anything to help.

http://phoenixtears.ca/

I can't seem to find anything to disprove it/indicate it would cause harm anywhere, is it worth a try or can I continue laughing at it (albeit more grimly this time) ?

I figured an IT forum would be filled with well informed people so it was worth asking here! That and I'm just plutzing (and my frantic googling isn't helping) in general as my family is very, very small.

Thanks

I'd speak to her doctor. For primary treatment I'd stick with what is proven to work, but even there you want two or more opinions because doctors don't necessarily keep up with medical progress and they may be fixated on their preferred treatment. In regard to using THC to help with side-effects you'd again want to consult with the doctors to rule out interference with the primary treatment, but in this case you also have to be looking out for signs the doctor is simply regurgitating the scaremongering propaganda that is de rigueur when discussing illegal drugs. Don't be fooled, doctors are human, they've been bombarded with the same scare tactics as everyone else their whole lives, even into medical school where it can be found in medical textbooks and heard in lectures. If a doctor claims it will interfere they should be able to give a specific, detailed explanation as to why and point you to evidence to support their assertion.

 

[copacetic]

Guys show some compassion. If there was ever a thread to avoid derailing it is this one.

Absolutely true, and I apologize for my brief interjection.

 

[copacetic]

I agree, of course, that this should and would be discussed with the doctors involved, bearing in mind the very pertinent points noxibox brought up.

 

[porchrat]

Absolutely true, and I apologize for my brief interjection.

Much appreciated. Thanks copa.

Now if the rest of you could please take a page out of this man's book that would be awesome.

 

[DJ...]

Much appreciated. Thanks copa.

Now if the rest of you could please take a page out of this man's book that would be awesome.

I suppose the argument is still quite relevant. And comedic therapy. I particularly enjoyed Riax's comment that "anyone going into remission will always get another cancer" to paraphrase. ROFL...

 

[porchrat]

I suppose the argument is still quite relevant. And comedic therapy.

I don't have a problem with a discussion of the efficacy of this hemp oil stuff, that is totally on topic and pretty much what the OP was asking for.

I'm talking about the entire posts devoted to the costs behind research publication, that is totally off topic and needs to stop. In some ridiculous light hearted thread I can understand it but not here, this thread is different. The OP is distressed and looking for help in what is a very stressful circumstance.

I particularly enjoyed Riax's comment that "anyone going into remission will always get another cancer" to paraphrase. ROFL...

Yea I will give you that, that was hilarious.