Naledi Pandor blames 'legacy of apartheid' for attacks on African foreigners

[ShaunSA]

The legacy of Apartheid worked out just fine for her, with her R2.2m salary + benefits...

She didn't join the struggle to be poor.

 

[Fulcrum29]

Don't know if this has been mentioned, but I see Boko Haram is launching attacks on the SA Government and institutions... FUN TIMES!

The ANC will contract those Apartheid consultants which helped Nigeria turn the tide on Boko Haram.

The Boko Haram thing, however, is being carried away. One Nigerian on television threatened the attackers with Boko Harem and Man's Not Barry Roux tweeted it, then the whole thing snowballed through social media. Not to mention that it turned into the Boko Harem Challenge on social media.

 

[Corelli]

Just for interest sake. We were more tolerant to foreign refugees pre-1994, and since then we have become less tolerant.

One last point. Most of the foreigners here are willing to do jobs, that the locals want too much money for. As they are illegal, they are cheaper labour.

Go to Dubai and have a look at the Philippine workforce, or go to Japan and find both the Philippine and Chinese workforces.

If government was to stop more industries from closing due to cheaper options abroad and have a go at cheaper labour, and better transportation for it's locals (not having to pay most of your salary for expensive transportation), and if the unions can work on trying to create more jobs, than demanding larger salaries. Then we would be able to turn the country around and allow for more businesses to grow.

We can expand farming for more exports, we can manufacture more items. Businesses should be penalised for bringing in items from china, compared to manufacture it locally. I know a few businesses that's started up because they are tired of the cheap and junk imports from China and finding local quality better.

We should give businesses more incentives to buy local, yet allowing for local costs to be lower too.

 

[LazyLion]

So all you Xenophobic people, we just had an election earlier this year, why did you vote for a government that allows the foreigners in without proper border controls and why did you vote for a government that doesn't deal with drugs and crime?

 

[Polymathic]

Dude where did you get your history from? You forgot about the Egyptians, Kush (1000 years), Mali, Aksum, Carthaginia (Rome's biggest enemy), Great Zimbabwe to name but a few.

Actually a lot of the ancient African Empires were very rich and influential in trade between Europe and Asia too. Carthaginia was Rome's biggest enemy and almost sacked Rome (only to be defeated 20kms outside of Rome.)

7 Influential African Empires

From ancient Sudan to medieval Zimbabwe, get the facts on seven African kingdoms that made their mark on history.

www.history.com

Africa had great and still has great empires. Sure they didnt go invade one another and steal each other's riches as per the colonial times, but then again most of them just minded their own business and got on with trade.

Dude read my post properly.

If you do back to my original posts the point I was making was that West Africa, Southern Africa and to a slightly lesser extent East Africa were so isolated they might as well be seperate continents.

Sahara and Congo rain forests kept these regions isolated from each other and the rest of the world.

North Africa is basically a part of the Eurasian world in all practicality. Going through some of the empires listed.

The Mali Empire didn't extend out of West Africa nor did Greater Zimbabwe in Southern Africa.

Egypt like all of North Africa was connected and a part of the Eurasian world to slightly lesser extent the Kush of Sudan.

Aksum though Ethiopia is considered a part of East Africa today back then it was very much a part of the Eurasian sphere.

Carthage was a Phoenician (middle Eastern) colony which gained independence when Phoenicia it self was taken over by the Persians. Again a part of Eurasia.

 

[ForceFate]

How many Empires streched from West Africa into Southern Or East Africa before the colonial age?

The answer: 0

When you look at Eurasia (North Africa included) you had the Persian empire which connected northern Greece all the way to Northern India, the Greek Kingdoms which streched all the way to Central Asia which fought a war against China. Various Steppe empires which streched across Eurasia.

Empires existed but were not as large as the ones you listed. Africa was vast and sparsely populated relative to the regions you mentioned therefore, there was no incentive to go to war and capture large amounts of land.

 

[Corelli]

Dude read my post properly.

If you do back to my original posts the point I was making was that West Africa, Southern Africa and to a slightly lesser extent East Africa were so isolated they might as well be seperate continents.

Sahara and Congo rain forests kept these regions isolated from each other and the rest of the world.

North Africa is basically a part of the Eurasian world in all practicality. Going through some of the empires listed.

The Mali Empire didn't extend out of West Africa nor did Greater Zimbabwe in Southern Africa.

Egypt like all of North Africa was connected and a part of the Eurasian world to slightly lesser extent the Kush of Sudan.

Aksum though Ethiopia is considered a part of East Africa today back then it was very much a part of the Eurasian sphere.

Carthage was a Phoenician (middle Eastern) colony which gained independence when Phoenicia it self was taken over by the Persians. Again a part of Eurasia.

Firstly, the cradle of humanity was in Africa. So sad for you, and for Malema. We are all inherintly African. However to say that Carthage was Phoenician isnt exactly true. Some initially were from Turkey (ie Troy got sacked and the Trojans fled to Carthage eventually.) But over time they blended with the Africans there and whalaa. Mixed people.

Now during the colonial times and before the whites tried to say that the Africans were inferior, so they came up with statements that pyramids were built by aliens, and great zimbabwe was built by the romans. But this wasnt the case. It was built by Africans. In matter of fact you forgot the people of Kush, who during their decline became modern day Egypt. Africa had great nations. Most of their history was wiped out, and during colonial times history was changed to make Africa seems weaker than what it actually was. Sadly we lost a lot of cultural information, all because Europeans wanted crowns, jewelery and money for wars.

Evolution of modern humans

The origin of modern humans has probably been the most debated issue in evolutionary biology over the last few decades.

www.yourgenome.org

Then you gotto take into consideration that a lot of deforestation occured during the roman period. Before this the sahara was wait for it...grassland and some forests.

African humid period - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

We are not on the dry cycle. Africa changes between dry and wet every 41000 years.

 

[Corelli]

Wait funny. If you look at the evolution of modern humans, everyone came from South Africa initially. So I guess everyone is slowly coming back home? WELCOME WELCOME

 

[Polymathic]

Empires existed but were not as large as the ones you listed. Africa was vast and sparsely populated relative to the regions you mentioned therefore, there was no incentive to go to war and capture large amounts of land.

That's only true for Southern Africa. West Africa had several large empires, as well as several large empires empires around Ethiopia though Ethiopia kind falls under the Eurasian sphere.

Either way there wasn't much cultural and technological exchange between various regions in sub Saharan Africa

 

[Corelli]

10 African Civilizations More Amazing Than Ancient Egypt - Listverse

Unknown to most people, hundreds of smaller kingdoms have popped up throughout Africa's history, with some eventually growing into powerful empires. These

listverse.com

Africa was more happy with trading that fighting large wars against each other. In matter of fact the richest ruler ever was from Africa. Mansa Musa was worth $400 billion. Mali was one of the biggest trading partners of Venecia in the 1300s.

A lot of the history further south had been lost just like the history of several south american civilizations. We will never know what happened there. A lot seemingly kept in the libraries of Alexandria, but burnt down.

 

[Polymathic]

Firstly, the cradle of humanity was in Africa. So sad for you, and for Malema. We are all inherintly African. However to say that Carthage was Phoenician isnt exactly true. Some initially were from Turkey (ie Troy got sacked and the Trojans fled to Carthage eventually.) But over time they blended with the Africans there and whalaa. Mixed people.

Now during the colonial times and before the whites tried to say that the Africans were inferior, so they came up with statements that pyramids were built by aliens, and great zimbabwe was built by the romans. But this wasnt the case. It was built by Africans. In matter of fact you forgot the people of Kush, who during their decline became modern day Egypt. Africa had great nations. Most of their history was wiped out, and during colonial times history was changed to make Africa seems weaker than what it actually was. Sadly we lost a lot of cultural information, all because Europeans wanted crowns, jewelery and money for wars.

Evolution of modern humans

The origin of modern humans has probably been the most debated issue in evolutionary biology over the last few decades.

www.yourgenome.org

Then you gotto take into consideration that a lot of deforestation occured during the roman period. Before this the sahara was wait for it...grassland and some forests.

African humid period - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

We are not on the dry cycle. Africa changes between dry and wet every 41000 years.

Please stop with your strawman arguments.

That has nothing to do with the spread of technology and culture in the age of settled society. Well I'm referring to age of settled civilization, roughly 6000BC onwards.

I don't know where you getting your history from but Troy was at the time of its sacking either a part of the Hittite Empire or client kingdom to the Hittites during the bronze age. Maybe you confusing it with the Roman legend which states the first Romans were refugees from the Trojan Wars.

Carthage was Phoenician, they spoke Phoenician, wrote with the Phoenician script, sure they would of mixed with the native Berber population.

All of this has nothing to do with my original argument that the regions of Africa are so isolated from each other historical they are like different continents.

 

[Nanfeishen]

10 African Civilizations More Amazing Than Ancient Egypt - Listverse

Unknown to most people, hundreds of smaller kingdoms have popped up throughout Africa's history, with some eventually growing into powerful empires. These

listverse.com

Africa was more happy with trading that fighting large wars against each other. In matter of fact the richest ruler ever was from Africa. Mansa Musa was worth $400 billion. Mali was one of the biggest trading partners of Venecia in the 1300s.

A lot of the history further south had been lost just like the history of several south american civilizations. We will never know what happened there. A lot seemingly kept in the libraries of Alexandria, but burnt down.

Trading ? Yes ! , trading in slaves. There was nothing magnificent about that.
Mansa Musa being a kingpin in slavery as well, when he travelled to Mecca he took along 12000 slaves.
The ones who travelled south were those avoiding becoming slaves.

 

[lkswan747]

If the local folk would stop being lazy, destructive and unproductive, maybe, just maybe, companies would consider hiring them. In my opinion, the foreigners being targeted are more than willing to work for a decent wage and are productive and do not turn to the militant unions everytime they demand 12%+ increases with ridiculous perks. What I am trying to say is that perhaps the local worker should do some introspection and ask the question as to why does the foreigner have a job but I don't. One has to ask the question as to why do the majority vote the ANC into power despite the fact that they have not created sufficient jobs for the masses, despite their idle promises! No one esle is to blame for the xenophobic attacks except for the ANC government. Government created the porous borders that allows illegal immigrants to pour into our country. Government created a culture of bribery and corruption which allows police and customs to allow the foreigners into our country. Enough said, as I could carry on and on.
Stop blaming apartheid for all your Uckfups

 

[TheChamp]

If the local folk would stop being lazy, destructive and unproductive, maybe, just maybe, companies would consider hiring them. In my opinion, the foreigners being targeted are more than willing to work for a decent wage and are productive and do not turn to the militant unions everytime they demand 12%+ increases with ridiculous perks. What I am trying to say is that perhaps the local worker should do some introspection and ask the question as to why does the foreigner have a job but I don't. One has to ask the question as to why do the majority vote the ANC into power despite the fact that they have not created sufficient jobs for the masses, despite their idle promises! No one esle is to blame for the xenophobic attacks except for the ANC government. Government created the porous borders that allows illegal immigrants to pour into our country. Government created a culture of bribery and corruption which allows police and customs to allow the foreigners into our country. Enough said, as I could carry on and on.
Stop blaming apartheid for all your Uckfups

Foreigners are willing to work for anything and that is the reason employers prefer them, they are easily exploitable. Menial jobs are not complicated, working as a teller at PicknPay is a straightforward job, it does not matter who you put there the output would be the same, pass the products along the scanner, process a payment, easy as that.

When did locals become lazy? who was working in those jobs before foreigners came along? it is our people and not foreigners who built this country and made it what it is, the mere fact that foreigners choose to come here is testament to that, our people made this country a better place for the whole of Africa.

It's very nonsensical to now tell us that we are lazy and cannot work, just tell it like it is, foreigners are willing to work for next to nothing because they are desperate.

 

[ForceFate]

Foreigners are willing to work for anything and that is the reason employers prefer them, they are easily exploitable. Menial jobs are not complicated, working as a teller at PicknPay is a straightforward job, it does not matter who you put there the output would be the same, pass the products along the scanner, process a payment, easy as that.

When did locals become lazy? who was working in those jobs before foreigners came along? it is our people and not foreigners who built this country and made it what it is, the mere fact that foreigners choose to come here is testament to that, our people made this country a better place for the whole of Africa.

It's very nonsensical to now tell us that we are lazy and cannot work, just tell it like it is, foreigners are willing to work for next to nothing because they are desperate.

This^

 

[lkswan747]

Foreigners are willing to work for anything and that is the reason employers prefer them, they are easily exploitable. Menial jobs are not complicated, working as a teller at PicknPay is a straightforward job, it does not matter who you put there the output would be the same, pass the products along the scanner, process a payment, easy as that.

When did locals become lazy? who was working in those jobs before foreigners came along? it is our people and not foreigners who built this country and made it what it is, the mere fact that foreigners choose to come here is testament to that, our people made this country a better place for the whole of Africa.

It's very nonsensical to now tell us that we are lazy and cannot work, just tell it like it is, foreigners are willing to work for next to nothing because they are desperate.

So there are no desperate South Africans??

 

[TheChamp]

So there are no desperate South Africans??

There are, plenty of them, that's why there was always someone to do the most lowly job long before foreigners arrived in their numbers from other African countries.

 

[nightjar]

 

[D4N]

More like Naledi Pander

 

[Milano]

There are, plenty of them, that's why there was always someone to do the most lowly job long before foreigners arrived in their numbers from other African countries.

You are always pining for the good old days before the ANC flooded SA with foreigners.