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greg_SA
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What about a safer 2nd hand car? That would be my choice...
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New car sales in freefall
- Thread starter Bona Botse
- Start date
What about a safer 2nd hand car? That would be my choice...
Smooth Criminal
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Ever tried getting insurance on a car >5 years old?
adamr
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i think car sales in general, used or new. I think people are generally just not willing to spend period. As people noticed i change my cars pretty often and never have i struggled to sell a car like now. The market is def in a slump
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+1 but OMG! - only in SA will people buy at over inflated prices and only in SA will people gloat at the troubles of these car maufacturers. Reading economic news in Europe and to a lesser extent in N.America, government and people seem to be rallying around their car manufacturers to support local jobs, local brands ect.
I think that part of the reason for this is that international car manufacturers seem to act in a way that conforms to some economic sense and not the exact opposite way. Prices in Europe on new cars have decreased by 15-20%, whereas here the exact opposite is true. Demand goes down, prices should also come down if the supply is kept constant, but not here. Here we just raise prices and hope for the best. Personally, I think that if 30-40% of dealerships close down due to this stupidity, it will maybe finally open the manufacturers and dealers eyes, forcing them to lower prices to some half decent levels...
mic_y said:
what half decent levels? They should drop it to more than half as the consumer has suffered far to long
Well, that would be really nice... but even a 20-30% drop on the before-latest-increase prices would be awesome... but unless people stick to not buying, this will not happen. I actually wonder how long the dealers could survive with the current conditions... Hopefully they don't have such great cash reserves. And since credit is still quite hard to come by these days, that is the only thing that is keeping them afloat.
Bona Botse
A little insight goes a long way
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Vehicle sales carnage
and there's more
i'm starting to think that the local car manufacturers are having a stare-down contest with the economy to see who will blink first
and there's more
http://www.wheels24.co.za/Content/N...e4a651/02-06-2009 11-06/Vehicle_sales_carnage
i'm starting to think that the local car manufacturers are having a stare-down contest with the economy to see who will blink first
What is concerning is that people have not really changed their habits. No better value for money cars at the top of the list. For how many years has the BMW3 and MB C been in the top 10? Even the Polo is still pricy and the more premium choice.
Compare here, a third world country with very expensive cars compared to income versus Australia (cars are way cheaper - especially compared to income):
April 2009
Top Selling Cars in April 2009 Australia
1. Holden Commodore
2. Mazda3
3. Toyota Corolla
4. Ford Falcon
5. Hyundai i30
6. Toyota Yaris
7. Hyundai Getz
8. Subaru Forester
9. Toyota Camry (4 cyl)
10. Mitsubishi Lancer
11. Subaru Impreza
12. Toyota Kluger
13. Toyota Aurion
14. Toyota RAV4
15. Kia Rio
16. Mazda2
No BMW or MB! Granted some of the Commodores and Falcons can be spec'd to be luxurious but most are pretty ordinary sedans or lower. No other luxury or very premium choices.
If I was a dealer, I would not be too concerned. Just wait it out for a couple of months and the volumes will be back up. The buying patterns/tastes certainly haven't changed.
It seems South Africans have a problem with cars.
Compare here, a third world country with very expensive cars compared to income versus Australia (cars are way cheaper - especially compared to income):
April 2009
Top Selling Cars in April 2009 Australia
1. Holden Commodore
2. Mazda3
3. Toyota Corolla
4. Ford Falcon
5. Hyundai i30
6. Toyota Yaris
7. Hyundai Getz
8. Subaru Forester
9. Toyota Camry (4 cyl)
10. Mitsubishi Lancer
11. Subaru Impreza
12. Toyota Kluger
13. Toyota Aurion
14. Toyota RAV4
15. Kia Rio
16. Mazda2
No BMW or MB! Granted some of the Commodores and Falcons can be spec'd to be luxurious but most are pretty ordinary sedans or lower. No other luxury or very premium choices.
If I was a dealer, I would not be too concerned. Just wait it out for a couple of months and the volumes will be back up. The buying patterns/tastes certainly haven't changed.
It seems South Africans have a problem with cars.
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2CentsWorth
Senior Member
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That would amount ot price fixing and that is illegal. They can "recommend" a retail price though and as a consumer you can negotiate around that.
Fazda
Honorary Master
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A recommended retail price list is sent out to dealers every month, by the factories. They then have a small leeway, usually a maximum of 10% depending on model.
If you overstep the mark as far as discounting is concerned, particularly with VW Dealerships, your dealership will be removed from you by VW. Ask any VW Dealer Principal how tight his rein is being held by Uitenhague!
The prices ARE fixed withinn a specific window!
I am so at car dealerships, instead of them reducing new car prices, they increase them. WTF??? A few months ago I saw the price of a new Golf Tenacity standing at around R78 K but not it's around R82 K, same with a Toyota Prius, a few months back the price was R270 K but now it's R330 K, why? I don't get it.....
at car dealerships, instead of them reducing new car prices, they increase them. WTF??? A few months ago I saw the price of a new Golf Tenacity standing at around R78 K but not it's around R82 K, same with a Toyota Prius, a few months back the price was R270 K but now it's R330 K, why? I don't get it.....
Mila
Honorary Master
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I am so
+10
They can all co cry me a river. Shame poor idjits..
PetrolHead
Well-Known Member
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- Apr 28, 2009
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- 191
I suggest you get a 2nd hand car from a reputable used car dealership.
There are many 09 merc, bm's, polos, etc that have very low mileage selling for a fraction of the price of a car fresh off the production line.
My company (who helps independent dealerships administer their business professionally) has been supplying systems to the independant market for the past four years.
We have noticed that the used car dealerships who install professional administration systems tend to provide a better quality product to the public.
They keep their profits modest and their vehicles are reconditioned superbly.
Buy 2nd hand guys. You know it makes sense, but when you do, ask them what Dealership Management Systems they have in place, if they look at you with a blank stare on their face or tell you that they use a manual system, walk/run away as fast as you can because a dealer that does not administer professionally cannot manage professionally and poor management means poor vehicles.
If you take a look at some of my customers, you will see that there are guys selling to every level of the market. The difference btw them and other 2nd hand dealers is simply their commitment to professional admin which generally translates into reliable purchases.
There are many 09 merc, bm's, polos, etc that have very low mileage selling for a fraction of the price of a car fresh off the production line.
My company (who helps independent dealerships administer their business professionally) has been supplying systems to the independant market for the past four years.
We have noticed that the used car dealerships who install professional administration systems tend to provide a better quality product to the public.
They keep their profits modest and their vehicles are reconditioned superbly.
Buy 2nd hand guys. You know it makes sense, but when you do, ask them what Dealership Management Systems they have in place, if they look at you with a blank stare on their face or tell you that they use a manual system, walk/run away as fast as you can because a dealer that does not administer professionally cannot manage professionally and poor management means poor vehicles.
If you take a look at some of my customers, you will see that there are guys selling to every level of the market. The difference btw them and other 2nd hand dealers is simply their commitment to professional admin which generally translates into reliable purchases.
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If you overstep the mark as far as discounting is concerned, particularly with VW Dealerships, your dealership will be removed from you by VW. Ask any VW Dealer Principal how tight his rein is being held by Uitenhague!
Are they just lying?
So, is there really price fixing with new cars in SA?
Just a thought to report them. Spoke to a friend in OZ the other day, he finds the car he wants, colour, specs etc.
He mails 8 dealers of said brand.
Eventually he gets them hustling each other and gets about 11% off listed retail.
Please tell that we do not have price fixing in our market, total BS.
Surely this is anti competitive behaviour that can be reported to an ombudsman or something?
Seriously, is this true?
Are they just lying?
So, is there really price fixing with new cars in SA?
Just a thought to report them. Spoke to a friend in OZ the other day, he finds the car he wants, colour, specs etc.
He mails 8 dealers of said brand.
Eventually he gets them hustling each other and gets about 11% off listed retail.
Please tell that we do not have price fixing in our market, total BS.
Surely this is anti competitive behaviour that can be reported to an ombudsman or something?
Seriously, is this true?
Fazda
Honorary Master
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I was sales manager at Lindsay Sakers for a couple of years, and trust me when I say that the prices are fixed by the factory.
They even have ghost buyers paid by the factory, who try and squeeze more than accepted discounts from the sales people. You first get a rap over the knuckles and a warning. If it carries on you lose the dealership end of story.
There are ways of getting around the 10% max on some models, by giving the maximum discount then adding "extras" at no charge.
There are all sorts of creative accounting that go into car sales...another one, to get past some car schemes, a car is sold at a base model price, even though it isn't, then the customer is charged for extras which are on the car anyway.
Lovely business
Fazda
Honorary Master
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LOL, I'm not, that's why salesmen hate my guts when we start discussing discounts.
Not the most Kosher industry around when it comes to ripping off clients. I've worked for Toyota and GM as well, and it's much the same, but VW certainly has the DP's by the shorts when it comes to major discounts.
One way to get a decent discount if you simply want a new car is to wait a couple of moths after a particular model has been off the books, then hunt around for old stock.
There always IS old stock, because the idiots refuse to do decent discounts on runout models. Once a car has stood in the yard for a few months, and has cost the dealer money in terms of interest, the 10% max can suddenly waft away.
I got a brilliant deal on a Toyota RSi 4AGE motor, when they switched to the (slower) 1800. I picked one up at cost, plus it had been tarted up with different mags and tyres, in order to sell it.
So...if you're in the market for a Golf, for example, wait a couple of months for the floors to be filled with new ones, then start sniffing around for old stock...nice discount time
Agreed,
Personally I prefer second hand that has already depreciate over the first 18/24 months to make them "real price valuations" in my small brained context.
But seriously, they all do it (fixing)
This must be the only country that does it.
We cannot import a 4x4 from Japan, all new car prices are fixed in a discount range. A Tazz built here, shipped, with import duties cost less in of all places bloody OZ????
Cannot beleive no one has take this to task with????
Bloody CASATU should pick this up
Personally I prefer second hand that has already depreciate over the first 18/24 months to make them "real price valuations" in my small brained context.
But seriously, they all do it (fixing)
This must be the only country that does it.
We cannot import a 4x4 from Japan, all new car prices are fixed in a discount range. A Tazz built here, shipped, with import duties cost less in of all places bloody OZ????
Cannot beleive no one has take this to task with????
Bloody CASATU should pick this up
ettubrute
Expert Member
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- Aug 27, 2004
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Because SA in general holds esteem higher than cash flow... "If there is a new model, I must have it at all costs, because if I don't, my neighbor will, and I lose face"
Same happened when Telkom started with the 4Mbps roll-out. On this board, I asked people to not take the new package. If all had done so, Telkom would have been forced to drop the price... but what happened? Almost all the people shouting so hard that Telkom is shafting us, went out and upgraded!
as long as this behavior stays the same, we will be shafted...