New Jersey driver crashes car after passing out from wearing N95 mask

bwana

MyBroadband
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Feb 23, 2005
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77,047
This happed more than three months ago - someone's scraping the barrel.

And some governments have mandated this practice.
Which governments have mandated the wearing of N95 masks while driving?

EDIT: Debunked
However, experts confirm that the mask could not have been a factor.

“There is no risk of hypercapnia (CO2 retention) in healthy adults who use face coverings, including medical and cloth face masks, as well as N95s,” Dr. Robert Glatter, an emergency physician at Lenox Hill Hospital, New York, told Healthline. “Carbon dioxide molecules freely diffuse through the masks, allowing normal gas exchange while breathing.”
 

pouroverguy

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Then they are wearing them ineffectively. If it is a proper mask that is properly enclosed then you CANNOT wear them for hours and hours without any breathing issue or headaches or slowly poisoning yourself thanks to carbon dioxide inhalation.

You are talking bs, I am from a medical family and I know first hand even during extended surgeries that the surgeon will briefly remove the mask every 30 or 60 minutes.

If you have no obstruction to breathing then you may as well not wear a mask. It is a fact that you do restrict the flow of oxygen wearing quality masks correctly, not sure why you even try dispute this. Most people during covid19 is either wearing useless cloth masks ie. no obstruction at all or the other common joke is people wearing masks only over their mouths with their noses exposed.

The issue with quality masks is also not restricted to less oxygen inflow but also the build up of carbon dioxide inside the mask that you slowly start to re-breath and this is also part of why it is common to slowly get a headache if you wear it for too long duration continuously.
Honestly not sure where to even start with this. Just 2 things - cloth masks do help stop the spread. And I could wear my N95 mask on a shift today, and take pics of my sats before and after a few hours, but it really wouldn't convince you any different. If you think wearing a mask causes carbon dioxide retention, then you clearly have zero understanding of lung and renal physiology - which is fine, it's not your field - but please don't question all the experts that do say wearing a mask causes no health problems with Oxygen/Carbon Dioxide.

 

pinball wizard

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If you think wearing a mask causes carbon dioxide retention,
Yeah, I was listening to Prof Ross Tucker explain how little carbon dioxide would be trapped in the mask to be breathed in and it's laughable that some muppets still complain about it or suggest it's giving them even a headache.
 

abzo

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What affects your breathing more between wearing a mask and having someone kneel on the side/back of your neck? Or do they equally not affect your breathing?
 

pouroverguy

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Yeah, I was listening to Prof Ross Tucker explain how little carbon dioxide would be trapped in the mask to be breathed in and it's laughable that some muppets still complain about it or suggest it's giving them even a headache.
Your lungs and kidneys are amazing. Carbon Dioxide plays a critical role in Acid-Base balance in the body - it needs a very narrow pH range of 7.35-7.45 to function properly. If CO2 goes up even slightly, your brain automatically causes you to start breathing faster to get rid of it. Conversely, there are illnesses where your brain will literally slow your breathing down intentionally, to retain carbon dioxide to compensate for too alkaline a pH (A condition called metabolic alkalosis).
 

pouroverguy

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At the moment my wife looks like she's in a space suit whenever she's in theater. She has her fitted N95, the face screen thing, multiple layers of clothing, etc. Hell, even just in the hospital she's always wearing her N95.
Yup, everyone at Groote Schuur wears masks all the time for hours on end - have not seen one person faint yet, or complained of headaches or anything.
 

Messugga

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Yup, everyone at Groote Schuur wears masks all the time for hours on end - have not seen one person faint yet, or complained of headaches or anything.
The missus spends a few days a week at Kalafong and the same deal goes there. Standard practice at the government hospitals, at the very least.
 

konfab

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It doesn't affect the oxygen or CO2 content going into your lungs.
However, what it does do is make your lungs work harder.

To use an analogy. Putting a filter in front of a pump won't change the composition of the water molecules, but the pump will need to work harder.

I have a bit of a fun anecdote about this. I sprained my ankle a few weeks ago, so I have not been able to run. For anyone on discovery vitality, this is a problem as you need to get a certain number of exercise events per week. To get 300 points, you need to have an average heartrate above a certain threshold for at least 30 minutes. I have an old exercise bike from my father in law which has a faulty friction control, so it is effectively peddling against nothing.

So, one morning, I tried to get my points by going on a run around the complex, after 3 laps my ankle was on fire, so I had to limp back home and get on the bike. No matter how fast I peddled, I couldn't get my HR above 156 BPM to qualify for 300 points. It was sitting happily at 140. So, I had a brainwave, I put my buff on whilst I was inside on the bike. Within 3 minutes my HR was at 160 bpm and I got the points.

It is quite a fun experiment to try if you have a smartwatch that can measure your heart rate. Do an exercise with a mask and without one.

If you look at the photos here:

On the pulse oximeter, her BPM has gone up slightly. (Yes I know there is heart rate variability to take into account).

Back to this story:
A New Jersey driver crashed head-on into a pole — after passing out from wearing an N95 mask for hours, police said Friday.
Firstly, if you have been driving a vehicle for hours, you are going to already be exhausted, adding a mask to that will only make it worse. So, I don't think it would be too unreasonable to think that he simply lost concentration because of the combination of driving for hours and wearing a mask.

But the more important thing to take from this is this:

The LPPD responded to a lone occupant single car motor vehicle crash yesterday.
Why the hell is he wearing a mask when he is the only person in the car? That is like wearing a condom when you jerk off.
 

supersunbird

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Wearing a mask when not doing anything physically strenuous is not a problem, even walking is fine, but start doing something more strenuous and you will definitely start feeling it (say like carrying a ladder 1,5 km) and have to take the mask off now and then for a bit.

Wearing a mask while driving alone in a car... why?
 

GoofySmurf

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Masks do not affect your Oxygen saturation. Doctors are wearing them for hours on end with no issue.
It does decrease the oxygen level, take an oxygen meter and put the N95 mask on the inlet. It clearly shows a decrease in oxygen levels.

Even a more rudimentary experiment, take a sheet or a blanket and go and stand on the back of a bakkie while driving. You will notice that the blanket puffs up like a parachute. This indicates air being trapped by the blanket/sheet. The air that is trapped is air/oxygen that was not able to pass through the sheet/blanket. That means there is less air behind the blanket/sheet due to the sheet/blanket obstructing the air/oxygen.

The n95 masks are just a denser material thus blocking more air/oxygen.

"My brother's aunts husband is a doctor and he works 12 hour shifts with it on" is hardly a scientific argument.

Fact is that you have to breath harder to get the same amount of oxygen through the N95 mask.
Fact is if you don't adjust your breathing while wearing the mask you will start feeling out of breath and dizzy if you continually wear the mask for long periods.

The fact that doctors adjusted their breathing for the 3 protective masks on average that they wear is by no means an indication that it does not decrease the amount of air/oxygen able to get through.


RIP basic science.
 

GoofySmurf

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Messages
1,072
It doesn't affect the oxygen or CO2 content going into your lungs.
However, what it does do is make your lungs work harder.

To use an analogy. Putting a filter in front of a pump won't change the composition of the water molecules, but the pump will need to work harder.

I have a bit of a fun anecdote about this. I sprained my ankle a few weeks ago, so I have not been able to run. For anyone on discovery vitality, this is a problem as you need to get a certain number of exercise events per week. To get 300 points, you need to have an average heartrate above a certain threshold for at least 30 minutes. I have an old exercise bike from my father in law which has a faulty friction control, so it is effectively peddling against nothing.

So, one morning, I tried to get my points by going on a run around the complex, after 3 laps my ankle was on fire, so I had to limp back home and get on the bike. No matter how fast I peddled, I couldn't get my HR above 156 BPM to qualify for 300 points. It was sitting happily at 140. So, I had a brainwave, I put my buff on whilst I was inside on the bike. Within 3 minutes my HR was at 160 bpm and I got the points.

It is quite a fun experiment to try if you have a smartwatch that can measure your heart rate. Do an exercise with a mask and without one.

If you look at the photos here:

On the pulse oximeter, her BPM has gone up slightly. (Yes I know there is heart rate variability to take into account).

Back to this story:

Firstly, if you have been driving a vehicle for hours, you are going to already be exhausted, adding a mask to that will only make it worse. So, I don't think it would be too unreasonable to think that he simply lost concentration because of the combination of driving for hours and wearing a mask.

But the more important thing to take from this is this:



Why the hell is he wearing a mask when he is the only person in the car? That is like wearing a condom when you jerk off.
The little fact that you fail to add here is that yes you have to breathe harder to get the same amount of oxygen. If you continue with the same breathing "strength" that you are used to without the mask then you will have less oxygen due to the density of the material.

So yes you can get the same oxygen level while wearing a mask, however your lungs have to work harder to get the oxygen.

Allot of the breathing issues comes from people not adjusting their breathing patterns.

Simple science there is a denser area the air must travel through thus more energy is needed to get the air through the smaller holes. More energy = Harder breathing.

Thus if you have lung issues or weak lungs this will definitely decrease your oxygen level.

As they would say in Breaking Bad "Science b*tch"
 

Datura

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Oct 12, 2006
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46,595
Driving with a mask on?
Here in Moz you have to drive with a mask on even if you are alone in the car. Makes no sense. Ag half these guys stopped wearing masks a month ago. More worried about malaria around here than Covid.
 

konfab

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Messages
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The little fact that you fail to add here is that yes you have to breathe harder to get the same amount of oxygen. If you continue with the same breathing "strength" that you are used to without the mask then you will have less oxygen due to the density of the material.

So yes you can get the same oxygen level while wearing a mask, however your lungs have to work harder to get the oxygen.

Allot of the breathing issues comes from people not adjusting their breathing patterns.
And that would be the case if your breathing was controlled consciously. Fortunately, that isn't the case, as breathing is controlled by your subconscious nervous system based on things like the partial pressures of oxygen and carbon dioxide in the blood. This is why you won't measure the effect of a mask on the blood oxygen level, because the body is controlling it. The mechanism by which it is controlling it is with the strength and rate of breathing, all of which is "actuated" (I have to let the control systems engineer take over for a bit) by the diaphragm, which would require more oxygenated blood. This is why I wouldn't be surprised if the heart rate goes up.


As they would say in Breaking Bad "Science b*tch"
Except you missed the basic science of how the human body conducts respiration.
 

Nemoneiros

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Feb 14, 2012
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4,500
I've got sleep apnea. I know exactly when I need oxygen. I'm not sarcastic either.
I've got intense head aches and fatigue when it happens.
I doubt a person doesn't know.
Sure, tired at the wheel and falling asleep I can understand.
And rather easy to train yourself to read the signs if you do any type of breath retention exercises. It's not an occult mystery :rolleyes:
 

noxibox

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and yet doctors, nurses etc wear these (or even more protective versions) for 12 hours a day when on shift?
They don't. Research into mask use in the medical field regularly refers to the difficulty in getting staff to wear their masks for any extended period.
 

noxibox

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You won’t know if you’re about to run out of oxygen. One minute you feel fine and then you collapse.
It isn't lack of oxygen, but more like a buildup of carbon dioxide. That does creep up on you. The switch from being conscious to unconscious happens very quickly when it does happen.
 

noxibox

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How many docs wear N95 masks in the theatre?
They don't. The masks they wear aren't really meant to stop your breath or the accompanying vapour from escaping. They're there simply to block coughs and sneezes. They get thrown away after use.
 
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