New satellite network will make it impossible for aeroplanes to go missing

graybeard

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Misleading heading unfortunately. It is just extending the global, space-based ADS-B facilities. If an aircraft's transponder is switched off, damaged or disabled (so it cannot report its position), it will STILL "go missing".
 

ekske1

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Misleading heading unfortunately. It is just about extending the global, space-based ADS-B facilities. If the aircraft's transponder is switched off, damaged or disabled, it will STILL "go missing" without any location.
Here we had hope for MyMissing soon™
 

ArtyLoop

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Misleading heading unfortunately. It is just about extending the global, space-based ADS-B facilities. If the aircraft's transponder is switched off, damaged or disabled, it will STILL "go missing" without any location.
Yup, very misleading. I was chatting to someone on Whatsapp involved in this project from last week already, and I just had to smile and chuckle when I read that headline. That publish button, they just love to push it. I am sure that if the forum journalists engaged deeper and in a more meaningful way with the members, they'd be able to get some news that is really worth something and that would in return raise revenues.
 

graybeard

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Something easy for the uninitiated to understand and remember when it comes to things like this: "No emission, no position."
 

Geoff.D

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Misleading heading unfortunately. It is just extending the global, space-based ADS-B facilities. If an aircraft's transponder is switched off, damaged or disabled (so it cannot report its position), it will STILL "go missing".
Another badly researched article. It does not mention the existing system (ADS-B) that is already in existence and this builds on that, nor does explain why the new satellites will enhance the existing systems.
Instead, it goes for an emotional headline to attract clicks, using a word such as "impossible" which can never ever be true.
 
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Cius

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Well, whatever it is and however far along it is we still lose commercial jetliners now and then, and the tech to fix that problem has been around for ages. I have never understood why we still have this issue this far down the road of GPS technology? So hopefully it largely sorts out the accidental loss craft at least if not the highjacked and turned off the transponder variety.
 

Geoff.D

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Well, whatever it is and however far along it is we still lose commercial jetliners now and then, and the tech to fix that problem has been around for ages. I have never understood why we still have this issue this far down the road of GPS technology? So hopefully it largely sorts out the accidental loss craft at least if not the highjacked and turned off the transponder variety.
One of the reasons is the incredibly involved legal and regulatory processes involved with ICAO, as well as, the supposed "costs" involved and the airline industry's general resistance to anything that increases operational costs.
Even now the date for the aircraft the "must" be fitted out accordingly is only 2020. Not to speak of many other aircraft that may not ever be fitted out by regulation/law. It is pathetic, but that is how these things work. The $ still counts for more than human life.
 

Segg

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For a proper but brief explanation (for SA at least) read here

South Africa’s air navigation service provider Air Traffic and Navigation Services (ATNS) has signed an agreement with Aireon to receive its space-based Automatic Dependent Surveillance-Broadcast (ADS-B) service to monitor air traffic in the Johannesburg and Cape Town Flight Information Regions.

These regions cover approximately 10 percent of the world’s airspace. ATNS on Monday said the agreement will allow for 100 percent air traffic surveillance in those areas through Aireon’s satellite-based service scheduled to be operational in 2018.
These systems can still be turned off by the crew, and most aircraft require the upgrade to begin with.... Hardly foolproof and won't stop a suicidal crew member from pulling a disappearing act like MH370

See the attached AIC from the SACAA
 

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eg2505

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For a proper but brief explanation (for SA at least) read here



These systems can still be turned off by the crew, and most aircraft require the upgrade to begin with.... Hardly foolproof and won't stop a suicidal crew member from pulling a disappearing act like MH370

See the attached AIC from the SACAA
honestly though, does the average flight crew know how to disable the ADS/B and "go dark" ?
unless your a aircraft mechanic or skilled in aircraft IT systems.

I just dont think its that easy to be done, especially as it was mentioned when mh370 vanished
that its not a simple thing to disable the beacon, and completely go dark.
 

ToxicBunny

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honestly though, does the average flight crew know how to disable the ADS/B and "go dark" ?
unless your a aircraft mechanic or skilled in aircraft IT systems.

I just dont think its that easy to be done, especially as it was mentioned when mh370 vanished
that its not a simple thing to disable the beacon, and completely go dark.
Of course the average flight crew would know...
 

Segg

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honestly though, does the average flight crew know how to disable the ADS/B and "go dark" ?
unless your a aircraft mechanic or skilled in aircraft IT systems.

I just dont think its that easy to be done, especially as it was mentioned when mh370 vanished
that its not a simple thing to disable the beacon, and completely go dark.
You either turn the transponder off, or pull the circuit breaker - both of which are in the cockpit

A proper system should have a battery backup to power a separate tracker in the event of the aircraft's power supply being shut down for whatever reason, but from my understanding this isn't a thing, as in normal operations the only reason something like that would be turned off is due to a fault (which could lead to an electrical fire for example) and this is much more likely to occur than a suicidal pilot
 

SauRoNZA

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Yeah erm the satellite networks for this ALREADY EXIST and in most cases the hardware is fitted to the planes by Boeing and Airbus (who also build the satellites) as part of the purchase order.

The problem is that the cheap and nasty airlines don't want to keep them actively online because that costs them money...and when has people's safety ever been a priority unless mandated by a government?

They can turn this **** on RIGHT NOW but they choose not to.
 

Segg

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Yeah erm the satellite networks for this ALREADY EXIST and in most cases the hardware is fitted to the planes by Boeing and Airbus (who also build the satellites) as part of the purchase order.

The problem is that the cheap and nasty airlines don't want to keep them actively online because that costs them money...and when has people's safety ever been a priority unless mandated by a government?

They can turn this **** on RIGHT NOW but they choose not to.
100% correct, but this system is designed to rely on "surveillance" equipment that is already compulsory to use, most airlines are of the opinion that they shouldn't have to pay for the same thing twice (tracking) - overflight & navigation fees are p0e$ expensive - and they expect to get their pound of flesh by paying these fees I.E the authorities should know where an aircraft is at all times
 
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