New water restriction tariffs hit Cape Town: what you need to know

Rouxenator

Rouxenator

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Talking about pumping, nothing stopping them from pumping the Breederiver into Brandvlei - although that would solve this convenient problem.

Let's rather pump sewerage into the rivers.
 
Zoomzoom

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xrapidx

xrapidx

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Zoomzoom said:
It really pisses me off when people say stuff like this. Mazel tov for being rich enough to just toss this out there, but spare a thought for the millions who can't just go install a tank. And btw if you can just go and install a tank why the hell haven't you done so yet?
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Because I already put effort into saving municipal water, use limited well point water, and a grey water system - and spending money to make sure I'm properly prepared for collecting rain water next season - and now I must get penalized because the city has done nothing but marketing to conserve municipal water. Screw that.

And duh - I haven't done it yet because it hasn't been necessary - not exactly rocket science - why would I have put in a tank for municipal water if it wasn't necessary? :confused:

I'm not on this planet to give a **** about the millions - I'm here to make sure me and mine get through life ok. They get what they vote for, I'm not a charity.
 
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A

access

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Zoomzoom said:
It really pisses me off when people say stuff like this. Mazel tov for being rich enough to just toss this out there, but spare a thought for the millions who can't just go install a tank. And btw if you can just go and install a tank why the hell haven't you done so yet?
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spare a thought for the millions, lol, yeah no sorry, they keep smacking themselves in the face, had paracetamol today my empathy tank is in drought.
 
konfab

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Zoomzoom said:
It really pisses me off when people say stuff like this. Mazel tov for being rich enough to just toss this out there, but spare a thought for the millions who can't just go install a tank. And btw if you can just go and install a tank why the hell haven't you done so yet?
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As if a Jojo tank is really the definitive symbol of wealth :crylaugh:
 
yebocan

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Last night had our first taste of pressure reduction. Guess the new normal. All part and parcel of changing our behaviour when it comes to water.
 
Geoff.D

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konfab said:
As if a Jojo tank is really the definitive symbol of wealth :crylaugh:
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What is really a concern, A Jo Jo tank that costs R1500 in PTA turns into a cost of R 4500 when it gets to CT. Talk about living off the fear of others.
 
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Zoomzoom

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konfab said:
As if a Jojo tank is really the definitive symbol of wealth :crylaugh:
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You know what - if you don't have several grand lying around to put one in, yes it damn well is a wealth you haven't got.
 
itareanlnotani

itareanlnotani

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ambroseg1 said:
That is NOT what you said. You said they do not contribute at all.

And even now with your backtrack of them contributing negligibly, that is also nonsense. Just because they are poor, doesn't mean they don't spend money, as they need to eat, live, poop, pee, wash etc to survive. All this stuff costs money. The poor make up the majority of people in this country. They contribute quite a bit to the economy and to taxes (through VAT).
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Quantitively proven that monetarily no, they really don't.

See here - http://www.rollingalpha.com/2015/10/22/but-who-pays-south-africas-tax/

and note the rather concisely put -

You cannot indefinitely fine the privileged for being privileged;
If you do it for long enough, then the privileged will just take their privilege elsewhere;
You will alienate your tax base if you’re not offering real tangible benefits in return; and
If you’re relying on 1% of the population to be almost two thirds of your income tax base, then you had best get your spending in order. Because you are vulnerable, and they may leave.

The follow-up deals with your statement about VAT
http://www.rollingalpha.com/2015/10/23/how-south-african-indirect-taxes-are-paid/

Conclusion is clear (to use his results again) -
The top 10% contribute 71% of the total tax bill.
The top 20% contribute 85% of the total tax bill.
The top 30% contribute 91% of the total tax bill.

The net outcome is one in which most of the population receive more than they pay, and the main taxpayers pay a lot more than they receive.
 
Zoomzoom

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lsheed_cn said:
Quantitively proven that monetarily no, they really don't.

See here - http://www.rollingalpha.com/2015/10/22/but-who-pays-south-africas-tax/

and note the rather concisely put -

You cannot indefinitely fine the privileged for being privileged;
If you do it for long enough, then the privileged will just take their privilege elsewhere;
You will alienate your tax base if you’re not offering real tangible benefits in return; and
If you’re relying on 1% of the population to be almost two thirds of your income tax base, then you had best get your spending in order. Because you are vulnerable, and they may leave.

The follow-up deals with your statement about VAT
http://www.rollingalpha.com/2015/10/23/how-south-african-indirect-taxes-are-paid/

Conclusion is clear (to use his results again) -
The top 10% contribute 71% of the total tax bill.
The top 20% contribute 85% of the total tax bill.
The top 30% contribute 91% of the total tax bill.

The net outcome is one in which most of the population receive more than they pay, and the main taxpayers pay a lot more than they receive.
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That isn't the only way to look at it because you are ignoring spending. Spending drives the economy. It is the spending of the poor that gives the rich their wealth, so just because they pay more in tax, doesn't mean that the poor weren't the source of the wealth in the first place. Without 'poor' to work menial jobs, line factory production lines, clean the streets, collect rubbish etc the rich would not be rich and the country would grind to a stand still.

Try running a country with only the rich and see how far you get. Conversely the opposite is also true. Everyone is co-dependent in society and just because the poor may not directly contribute as much in tax does not mean that they aren't a force in the economy.
 
xrapidx

xrapidx

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Zoomzoom said:
wiithout 'poor' to work menial jobs, line factory production lines, clean the streets, collect rubbish etc the rich would not be rich and the country would grind to a stand still.

Try running a country with only the rich and see how far you get. Conversely the opposite is also true. Everyone is co-dependent in society and just because the poor may not directly contribute as much in tax does not mean that they aren't a force in the economy.
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Most menial tasks can be automated. Its why a lot of farmers are moving in that direction - they're tired of the "poor" destroying everything in their path every time they're unhappy.
 
yebocan

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yebocan said:
Last night had our first taste of pressure reduction. Guess the new normal. All part and parcel of changing our behaviour when it comes to water.
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So went from low pressure -Tues- to no supply -Wed- , so popped the city a Twitter msg. Yes area is affected by Phase1 restrictions/rationing.


Me :
can you give me the times that have been set as peak water usage periods + are disruptions spread evenly or targeted at particular suburbs? Sorry for all the qs but city info on this matter is rather bare.
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CoCT
The City cannot provide definitive timetables of the disruptions as the water systems must be managed flexibly to avoid damage to critical infrastructure. Any zoned outages will likely occur during peak water usage times in the mornings and evenings.
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The vagueness and lack of info on Phase1 is disturbing. Sounds to me the city does not have the ability, due to infrastructure limitations to implement rotational targeted restrictions/rationing, and particular areas will carry the brunt of their plan.
 
S

silkenphoenixx

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konfab said:
As if a Jojo tank is really the definitive symbol of wealth :crylaugh:
Click to expand...

Geoff.D said:
What is really a concern, A Jo Jo tank that costs R1500 in PTA turns into a cost of R 4500 when it gets to CT. Talk about living off the fear of others.
Click to expand...

Zoomzoom said:
You know what - if you don't have several grand lying around to put one in, yes it damn well is a wealth you haven't got.
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The cost of the tank isn't the only thing - I have an extra R1500 lying around, heck, I could even scratch out three times that amount. I could probably even afford to pay someone to install the right kinds of gutters so that rain could drain from the roof of the house into the tank.
What I can't afford is a house though, I live in a small flat in the southern suburbs with a tiny patch of garden shared between 36 flats, most of which is used for parking.

So while it's not the tank itself, the fact that you have space to put a tank kind of is a symbol of wealth in Cape Town.
 
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