Octotel Cape Town Southern Suburbs Issue - Timeouts in Claremont/Kenilworth/Rondebosch area

AfriNatic

Afrihost Rep
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Nov 18, 2016
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5,412
Hi Budza, Public IP, not static (I wish), CGNAT its a new move ISP's are doing to save cost then they blame the IPv4 shortage, while there is a growing shortage, there has also been a massive reclaim of IPv4 over the years.

Usually you can request to stay on or be assigned a public addy, which I did as I have some home automation, CCTV and various other services i.e. game server or two and writing howtos / tutorials for systems and setups and I use it to test logic from time to time.

In Colocation space you can buy or rent static IP's for super cheap, anywhere from R39 to R50+ per month single, or batches of IP's.
Also keep in mind with other DSL services ending there are many available IPv4's to ISP's at a cost...

Friends have been joking with me for a few years that I should look at setting up a small ISP business and bolt it on to what I do...perhaps it is a good time to look into it lol.

I am actually very surprised there aren't more peeps taking issue with them losing their public IP's and the freedom it gives on the internet... also it allows your ISP to police you a ton more behind a NAT'd network.
Also if you have a fancy firewall setup i.e. pfsense, sohpos etc... it will break and cause all kind of isues as by default they block private networks / NAT'd networks to protect you from peeps spying i.e. packet captures on a NAT'd network is much easier for the ISP (intercept packets from your network and read them).

Hi,

I have responded to your email.

The IP changed because your router changed.

If only a block of IPv4 IP addresses actually cost R39 per IP. DSL is being discontinued slowly but Openserve fibre has grown significantly.
 

Go†h_Li†e°²

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Joined
Mar 28, 2005
Messages
116
Hi,

I have responded to your email.

The IP changed because your router changed.

If only a block of IPv4 IP addresses actually cost R39 per IP. DSL is being discontinued slowly but Openserve fibre has grown significantly.
Regarding the router change, I change my router from time to time when testing things and what this has done historically is just change public ip, it doesn't put me in a NAT'd pool "automagically".

Regarding Static IP's I can forward you quotes from upstream providers if you like.
I believe Axxess your sister company does static for R39.
 
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eddief1

Expert Member
Joined
Feb 26, 2008
Messages
1,324
Hi Budza, Public IP, not static (I wish), CGNAT its a new move ISP's are doing to save cost then they blame the IPv4 shortage, while there is a growing shortage, there has also been a massive reclaim of IPv4 over the years.

Usually you can request to stay on or be assigned a public addy, which I did as I have some home automation, CCTV and various other services i.e. game server or two and writing howtos / tutorials for systems and setups and I use it to test logic from time to time.

In Colocation space you can buy or rent static IP's for super cheap, anywhere from R39 to R50+ per month single, or batches of IP's.
Also keep in mind with other DSL services ending there are many available IPv4's to ISP's at a cost...

Friends have been joking with me for a few years that I should look at setting up a small ISP business and bolt it on to what I do...perhaps it is a good time to look into it lol.

I am actually very surprised there aren't more peeps taking issue with them losing their public IP's and the freedom it gives on the internet... also it allows your ISP to police you a ton more behind a NAT'd network.
Also if you have a fancy firewall setup i.e. pfsense, sohpos etc... it will break and cause all kind of isues as by default they block private networks / NAT'd networks to protect you from peeps spying i.e. packet captures on a NAT'd network is much easier for the ISP (intercept packets from your network and read them).

While frustrating for you the reality is your use case is actually rare, only a few % of ISP's subs actually "need" a public to do what they need to do - which is stream netflix,etc. :) For example mobile has always been CG-NAT.

The margins on these ISP accounts are also extremely thin these days as they getting squeezed by the FNO's, so added costs if not necessary are avoided.

The ending of DSL does not free up IP's per say. They just get re-assigned to the ISP's LNS for FTTH, which as you know is exploding.

It all sounds simple - but at the scale these ISP's run on it's everything but
 

eddief1

Expert Member
Joined
Feb 26, 2008
Messages
1,324
Regarding the router change, I change my router from time to time when testing things and what this has done historically is just change public ip, it doesn't put me in a NAT'd pool "automagically".

Regarding Static IP's I can forward you quotes from upstream providers if you like.
I believe Axxess your sister company does static for R39.
But can those IP's be assigned to Afrihost's ASN?
 

Go†h_Li†e°²

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
Messages
116
While frustrating for you the reality is your use case is actually rare, only a few % of ISP's subs actually "need" a public to do what they need to do - which is stream netflix,etc. :) For example mobile has always been CG-NAT.

The margins on these ISP accounts are also extremely thin these days as they getting squeezed by the FNO's, so added costs if not necessary are avoided.

The ending of DSL does not free up IP's per say. They just get re-assigned to the ISP's LNS for FTTH, which as you know is exploding.

It all sounds simple - but at the scale these ISP's run on it's everything but
I honestly don't see it to be such a rare use case, obv IMO.
Mobile has not always been CGNAT, I have setup hundreds of installations for SMB's even SME's using public IP's on Mobile networks in the past, this may have changed since.

One of the biggest factors, again IMO, was for ISP's to prevent SMB's and SME's using what they consider home use products for business.

"The ending of DSL does not free up IP's per say. They just get re-assigned to the ISP's LNS for FTTH, which as you know is exploding." This is exactly what I meant and literally frees up those IP's for Fiber solutions.

Thank you for the feedback it is always great to also have more input and things to consider.

I was toying with the idea of starting up an ISP business, starting off small (obviously running at a loss or close to a loss for a few years) where I offer one link/product and it can be used for home use, business whatever but the support will be the same as if it was enterprise. South Africa is seriously lacking great products and support, but as you say at scale things are always different.
 
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Go†h_Li†e°²

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Mar 28, 2005
Messages
116
We have native IPv6 support on our network since about May 2021.
I know, it is very cool that you guys have taken the plunge!
Its just that the rest of the world needs to catch up now lol

I would deff be keen to use IPv6 its just that most services i.e. game servers, CCTV etc do not support it yet.
 

eddief1

Expert Member
Joined
Feb 26, 2008
Messages
1,324
I was toying with the idea of starting up an ISP business, starting off small (obviously running at a loss or close to a loss for a few years) where I offer one link/product and it can be used for home use, business whatever but the support will be the same as if it was enterprise. South Africa is seriously lacking great products and support, but as you say at scale things are always different.

You will need to run at a loss as FNO's have minimum billing requirements. if you can get away with only being on one FNO and that FNO covers your clients then you lucky and it's easier.

Regarding selling a single product - that is tricky as once again some FNO's will not install a home line in a business and of course the business lines are quite a bit more expensive and don't share the same speed profiles, so a single product is not optimal.

and now the crux, no matter how dedicated you are to servicing your clients - when their fibre goes down or has loss you at the mercy of the FNO and their inefficiencies and will have to follow the same procedures as all other ISP's to log faults, etc - as you can see on the forum it's the biggest challenge the ISP's have - the FNO's.

so the question has to be asked, what makes you think you gonna be able to get better service out of the FNO's than say Afrihost who have dedicated teams begging FNO's the entire day?
 

Go†h_Li†e°²

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
Messages
116
You will need to run at a loss as FNO's have minimum billing requirements. if you can get away with only being on one FNO and that FNO covers your clients then you lucky and it's easier.

Regarding selling a single product - that is tricky as once again some FNO's will not install a home line in a business and of course the business lines are quite a bit more expensive and don't share the same speed profiles, so a single product is not optimal.

and now the crux, no matter how dedicated you are to servicing your clients - when their fibre goes down or has loss you at the mercy of the FNO and their inefficiencies and will have to follow the same procedures as all other ISP's to log faults, etc - as you can see on the forum it's the biggest challenge the ISP's have - the FNO's.

so the question has to be asked, what makes you think you gonna be able to get better service out of the FNO's than say Afrihost who have dedicated teams begging FNO's the entire day?
I will have to investigate which FNO's, I do have a few contacts to "refresh".
A few years back I had access to ICASA licenses that allowed me (the companies I was the CIO/CTO for at the time) to roll out my own fibre networks. I should have dived deeper then lol.
I may still have some access / opportunities there, but will have to think on it as it will not be my core business.

Technically it would not just be one product but more a VAS to other products and services that I do (so not just fibre / connectivity services).

Regarding service delivery, I am well aware of the systemic poor service across the board especially in South Africa, I can tell you horror stories of how big CO's will leave you hanging with SLA's in place where you lose hundreds of thousands per hour, but I assume you are well aware of this and you have first hand experience.

It is a volumes game, and my few potential clients does not motivate any FNO, Network operator etc to expedite any issues..

There is however options like full transparency / disclosure without violating none disclosure agreements but most business's lock these down screwing over everyone downstream.
 
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IOPS

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2016
Messages
502
Just me or have things gotten better over the last week or two?
Below is a constant ping to my gateway, it's been really poor since September-ish.

Screenshot 2021-11-18 at 15.14.13.png
 
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