Peter de Villiers, Yay or Nah?

[Cantera]

it is still not comparable, he worked with amateurs who turned pro, its a entirely different mindset... wake up?

I agree.

 

[Cantera]

timgaul, you are blinded and inlove with Jake White. Do you forget the games where everybody was calling for Jake's head?

Did you forget how the team he coached lost 49 - 0 to the Wallabies?

JW was no coaching god.

 

[semiautomatix]

:erm: I differ there from you. a) No to Morne steyn b) No to brussouw

Those two played a HUGE part in us beating the lions and in the first and second test against the ABs.... But like you said say it enough times and it might come true

And de Villiers decision not to play Frans Steyn when it was obvious how well he had been doing. All coaches make mistakes, and they're not always as fatal as you would believe. There isn't always only one player for a position that is the best in that position. Sometimes you luck out and sometimes you strike out.

 

[semiautomatix]

I agree.

So you agree Kitch had it much harder, yet did so much better? In fact you agree that the only reason de Villiers (and indeed, White) did well at all is the structures that supported them and has nothing to do with their ability?

 

[Morgoth]

Oh, so now it's gone from he didn't coach in the professional era to he only coached in the "professional era from when Morgoth says its okay to be called the professional era"?

Don't throw out facts if the can be reputed, and don't get upset when they are. There goes your credibility.

ok, how thick is your skull honestly?

Look at the team he won the world cup with and those 14 wins, ALL of them were amateurs who just started their professional careers, who probably trained 1 -2 days a week now you are comparing it with someone who has to coach our current team being a 24/7 job?... what a retarded statement...

honestly if you can't grasp something as simple as this then maybe yours credibility shouldn't be at question?

 

[JustAsk]

I feel like I'm having a discussion with a brick wall.

Btw, Cantera, people on this forum are entitled to their opinion, as are you. No need for the name calling.

Oh, and Jake White has BOTH (yes, I bolded it!) a World Cup and Trinations under his belt. So he has won the hardest of the hard and then some.

NOT TRUE.

He got one.Eddie Jones won the World Cup.

Can you spot the real coach?

 

[Morgoth]

So you agree Kitch had it much harder, yet did so much better? In fact you agree that the only reason de Villiers (and indeed, White) did well at all is the structures that supported them and has nothing to do with their ability?

no the two eras should be looked at respectable, we achieved good things in both times, it is nothing more then that. now grow up please.

 

[semiautomatix]

timgaul, you are blinded and inlove with Jake White. Do you forget the games where everybody was calling for Jake's head?

Did you forget how the team he coached lost 49 - 0 to the Wallabies?

JW was no coaching god.

If I am blinded and in love with Jake White then clearly you have a fetish for ranting loons with bushy 'taches. You yourself have just pointed out that de Villiers is only as good as the support structures, including coaching staff, and as such only plays a small role in the actual development of the team.

 

[Devill]

I feel like I'm having a discussion with a brick wall.

Btw, Cantera, people on this forum are entitled to their opinion, as are you. No need for the name calling.

Oh, and Jake White has BOTH (yes, I bolded it!) a World Cup and Trinations under his belt. So he has won the hardest of the hard and then some.

His tri nations was won with a 50% winning % PDV = 5/6

And de Villiers decision not to play Frans Steyn when it was obvious how well he had been doing. All coaches make mistakes, and they're not always as fatal as you would believe. There isn't always only one player for a position that is the best in that position. Sometimes you luck out and sometimes you strike out.

PDV left Frans steyn out so he could find a replacement for him come the next bok test..... Frans is going to France

 

[semiautomatix]

no the two eras should be looked at respectable, we achieved good things in both times, it is nothing more then that. now grow up please.

Morgoth, you do realise this is a forum where people debate on a mature level and are entitled to their own opinion? Just because some disagrees with our point of view is not reason to tell them, in that lovely colloquialism you use to "grow up". Now if you can't handle the challenges of healthy debate and do not have the emotional maturity to post in a reasonable fashion then maybe you should go somewhere else.

 

[semiautomatix]

NOT TRUE.

He got one.Eddie Jones won the World Cup.

Can you spot the real coach?
<a href="http://tinypic.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i30.tinypic.com/2hy8krp.jpg" border="0" alt="Image and video hosting by TinyPic"></a>

There, there JustAsk. Here's a lollipop. Who's a good boy?

 

[Morgoth]

Morgoth, you do realise this is a forum where people debate on a mature level and are entitled to their own opinion? Just because some disagrees with our point of view is not reason to tell them, in that lovely colloquialism you use to "grow up". Now if you can't handle the challenges of healthy debate and do not have the emotional maturity to post in a reasonable fashion then maybe you should go somewhere else.

it is one thing to debate, and one thing to just argue for the sake of argue, your guilty of the later.

 

[semiautomatix]

His tri nations was won with a 50% winning % PDV = 5/6

So now its gone from winning the hardest competition in rugby to "winning the hardest competition in rugby only in a manner that is acceptable to Devill"? You can't dilute you argument in such a fashion and in the same point argue the exact same thing. Either we are discussion winning the Trinations or we are discussing win% ratios.

PDV left Frans steyn out so he could find a replacement for him come the next bok test..... Frans is going to France

Again, if you tell yourself something enough times, I suppose it becomes true in your mind.

Oh, and hahaha

 

[semiautomatix]

it is one thing to debate, and one thing to just argue for the sake of argue, your guilty of the later.

I believe you were the one that brought that point of view into play and I was disputing it. That is called debate, you know two opposing points of view. I honestly believe it, and obviously so do you, so in the same move I could claim you are merely arguing for the sake of arguing. Maybe you're in the wrong place?

Now unless you have anything further to add to the point you posted perhaps you should move on?

 

[JustAsk]

Again, if you tell yourself something enough times, I suppose it becomes true in your mind.

you should know kid.

 

[Devill]

So now its gone from winning the hardest competition in rugby to "winning the hardest competition in rugby only in a manner that is acceptable to Devill"? You can't dilute you argument in such a fashion and in the same point argue the exact same thing. Either we are discussion winning the Trinations or we are discussing win% ratios.

No I was merely pointing out that PDV did it better Please try and disprove this. JW did win it but PDV won it with a better % to boot

Again, if you tell yourself something enough times, I suppose it becomes true in your mind.

Yeah I mean trying to find a replacement fullback before your goes away for a year is not logical at all .... Can see Why you love Jake "My beer fetcher" White

 

[semiautomatix]

No I was merely pointing out that PDV did it better Please try and disprove this. JW did win it but PDV won it with a better % to boot

Fair enough, and no I won't dispute it, but it doesn't make it any more or less of an achievement, in my opinion.

Yeah I mean trying to find a replacement fullback before your goes away for a year is not logical at all .... Can see Why you love Jake "My beer fetcher" White

Have we forgotten all the way back to Saturday where Frans Steyn actually did play? This tells me de Villiers realised his mistake and realised he may not be able to win this thing without Frans Steyn?

 

[semiautomatix]

you should know kid.

Eddie Jones? 'nuf said.

 

[Cantera]

So you agree Kitch had it much harder, yet did so much better? In fact you agree that the only reason de Villiers (and indeed, White) did well at all is the structures that supported them and has nothing to do with their ability?

Kitch had it easier. Its hard not calling you insane, when you post comments like this.

 

[Cantera]

You yourself have just pointed out that de Villiers is only as good as the support structures, including coaching staff, and as such only plays a small role in the actual development of the team.

Please quote me where i said that.