Proteas vs West Indies: 2014/15

[Drifter]

My top 6 that I would like to see tomorrow...

Amla
QdK
Faf
AB
Miller
JP

If AB is rested then RR comes in and bats at 3.

Not bad, but i honestly think RR is out of his depth on the international stage.

 

[Mike Hoxbig]

Not bad, but i honestly think RR is out of his depth on the international stage.

I don't think that he's not suited for it, he's played some decent knocks. I think that he has a technical issue where he plays the ball too early, especially early on in his innings...

 

[MickeyD]

Not bad, but i honestly think RR is out of his depth on the international stage.

As I've said before... it has been unfair on him to ask him to open the batting, something he is not accustomed to, even at provincial level. And no player will refuse the opportunity to play for his country!

PS. also remember that we can only use players selected in the squad.

 

[ZCFOutkast]

Opening and being aggressive is high risk, no doubt about it. Looking at the Aussie openers, Finch and Warner have similar / slightly worse records than QdK. But getting off to a positive start is imperative nowadays...we can't post competitive totals if we start with a low risk plodder. It puts too much pressure on the guys coming in next.

No side has got the perfect team going into to the WC...opening is a common issue as well as back of the innings bowling.

That home series when QdK (&Amla&AB) tore into India, I reckon guys like Finch,Warner&Watson would've done th esame at far much quicker. It set him up, but context is important.

Amla & RR were going "ok" against a very very poor WI attack. They also botched the PP in that game, and up until the first wicket fell - close to 40 overs later - they were doing only 6RPO.

When AB came along he made it look like we had been watching a 1950 Test match for the first 38 overs. Imagine if he had aggressive batsmen before he came in, and what the score would've been like. In the first 10 overs they scored about 50 runs. And it's common knowledge that RR is a far more aggressive batsman than QdK. No one in that Proteas can match his power. Even he could'nt speed things up. After getting in they still batted rather "slow".

I just feel there's no aggression upfront, while most teams will average 80-100/1-2 in the first 10 overs. Of the favourites, I just don't see the Proteas matching that to be honest. 60/0 at best but that's about it. 20-40 runs is a lot to make up.

Guys, generally England is considered to be the most boring side in world cricket, but they've tried lots of guys as openers - Ali, KP, Bell, Lumb, Kieswetter, Hales, Prior, Wright and even Trott I think. Even in tests the've done a few things. In parts it's worked for them, sometimes it hasn't.

When have we ever shown imagination? What have the Proteas ever tried? QdK was having a stinker opening and they waited until he scored some runs and that's been used to give the impression that he's ok again. Forgetting the long opening struggles he had before came right initially. Even as fans "we're" not exactly innocent either because we suggest guys like Elgar there.

Anyway we'll see what happens, I just think early wicket (QdK most probably), keep Faf in there alongside Amla, tighten things a bit, and you'll have the game in the bag by the time the next wicket comes in.

 

[Noob-Noob]

Snip.

So you saying QDK is not aggressive?, have you watched him play?, he gets out for being to damn aggressive.

 

[ZCFOutkast]

How many runs are we expecting from the openers in the 1st 10 overs? Are we looking for 70-80/2 or happy with 45-50/0.

There are too many variables in my opinion to say how many runs is acceptable. Personally, I would love it for the top 3 (#, QdK, Blaf) to create a platform in 25-30 overs to enable AB, Miller and co to up the scoring rate.

I have always sensed that we're the only side who seemingly have a plan, yet forget that our Test side is in many ways our ODI&T20 side efectively, while other teams have their plans too.

What that means is pretty much everyone knows what we're thinking, how we'll go about it and the average fan knows pretty much how to combat it. I laugh everytime I listen to Dravid (and Smith) on that Contenders on Cricinfo because all the Proteas' weaknesses are rolling off his tongue. But then again even the average fan making a comment also shares them.

QdK has been found out hence his struggles later on. Sides will expect AB&Miller to be the ones tasked with upping the scoring rate and they've both come short quite a number of times in that position. Even though AB was po
sessed to say we're better than them after a pasting.

In ZIM after the Aussies got rid of the rust we couldn't chase down a big total.

Recent tour to Australia is proof enough of al lmy concerns. Early wicket after the top 3 (Amla, QdK&Faf) had wasted lots of overs despite very few runs on the board. AB&Miller were contained so much that their impact was never going to be enough for the win.

This exact same thing will play itself out over again during the CWC, and the questions will still read "what went wrong".

Pound for pound we don't stand a chance against this if we bump into it --> Finch, Warner, Watson, Smith/Clarke, Maxwell, MMarsh/Bailey, Haddin, Faulkner. I'm not even sure we stand a chance against this either if we bump into it --> Guptil, BMac, Williamson, Taylor, Anderson, Ronchi, Vettori.

 

[Stefanmuller]

QdK is ideal as opener. He is naturally agressive, drives well and clears the inner ring well especially on the on side which is what you want from an opener. He scores many boundaries early on when the field is up.

QdK vs RR I would back QdK to score quicker. What adds is that he has confidence having international centuries behind his name and being in the test squad. He has nothing to prove to justify his place - not the case with RR who has to play with that in the back of his mind. You have to play for the team rather than your own spot in the team.

 

[ZCFOutkast]

So you saying QDK is not aggressive?, have you watched him play?, he gets out for being to damn aggressive.

Look at his strike rate whenever he's fallen cheaply

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...re;template=results;type=batting;view=innings

Edit: More precise link
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...ns;template=results;type=batting;view=innings

 

[Beavis]

snip

We probably thinking about two different Qdk here, ye opposition and what not will always be used in discussions... if's and but's and when's and what nots.. lol, your reasoning is not valid based on if's.... it is about the moment and opportunities you get, you can not be selective of who you bat against...

Qdk made the international ODI team 2014 (that means if you are not sure, out of all the openers in the world they chose him to be one of them based on 2014 form), or you think the selecters on that panel is also missing your theory, which I have no clue what it is actually? Move him down the order? NOPE!!

But.... at the end as stated previously, selection is made, if he is fit we need to support them and not wait for them to fail for which ever reason.... Come on Proteas!!

 

[Noob-Noob]

Look at his strike rate whenever he's fallen cheaply

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...re;template=results;type=batting;view=innings

Edit: More precise link
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...ns;template=results;type=batting;view=innings

Outcast, do you actually watch cricket?, or do you base your judgments purely on stats?
QDK is one of the most aggressive batman we have, pretty sure Russel told him to take it easy. hence the low SR on his low scores.

 

[ZCFOutkast]

Qdk made the international ODI team 2014

The criteria overlaps years.

In 2014 these are his stats from a series perspective:
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...pan;template=results;type=batting;view=series

And if you look deeper you'll see he managed to come right 1 out of 5 times in a series or 1 out of 3 times in a series

13 of those 19 matches were really ugly! That's my concern. It means the team virtually did not get off to a good start most of the time he was there.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...an;template=results;type=batting;view=innings

Essentially, you can't win a war with him in that position. Maybe the odd battle once in a while, but not a war. As we all know the CWC is akin to a war. Can't afford to switch off for more than one game. Those series were won inspite of him. That for me is the concern.

 

[ZCFOutkast]

"... pretty sure Russel told him to take it easy. hence the low SR on his low scores.

Hahaha I almost fell off my chair. Ok enough about QdK. (I'll wager will a couple of guys though that he won;t open for the whle tournament.)

I enjoy watching QdK. I know he's aggressive and always looks to score. Except he looks completely overwhelmed against competent bowling.

 

[MickeyD]

Hahaha I almost fell off my chair. Ok enough about QdK. (I'll wager will a couple of guys though that he won;t open for the whle tournament.)

I enjoy watching QdK. I know he's aggressive and always looks to score. Except he looks completely overwhelmed against competent bowling.

I get nervous watching QdK batting for the first 5/6 overs...

Once he has overcome that, I settle down.

 

[Noob-Noob]

I get nervous watching QdK batting for the first 5/6 overs...

Once he has overcome that, I settle down.

You Gotta have faith....
www.youtube.com/watch?v=lu3VTngm1F0

 

[MickeyD]

You Gotta have faith....
www.youtube.com/watch?v=lu3VTngm1F0

[video=youtube;z9nkzaOPP6g]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9nkzaOPP6g[/video]

 

[Stefanmuller]

Lets hope QdK is playing tomorrow and can get a big one and make everyone feel more at ease.

 

[Badprop_za]

Talking about "aggressive" opening batsmen.

Gayle - http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/51880.html
Amla - http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/43906.html
de Kock - http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/379143.html
Warner - http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/219889.html
B. McCullum - http://www.espncricinfo.com/newzealand/content/player/37737.html

Looking at stats, I don't think our boys have to stand back for anything.

Maybe it is time not to be so overly critical of our boys and start supporting them. Looking at the lineups of the other teams, we don't have to stand back for anyone. It depends on who wins those mini-battles / critical moments.

 

[Agent_Smith]

Lets hope QdK is playing tomorrow and can get a big one and make everyone feel more at ease.

Agreed. However, should he fail (which given that he hasn't played for a few weeks now is a distinct possibility) we shouldn't consider it the end of the world, nor heap scorn and derision on him.

 

[Mike7]

Talking about "aggressive" opening batsmen.

Gayle - http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/51880.html
Amla - http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/43906.html
de Kock - http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/379143.html
Warner - http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/219889.html
B. McCullum - http://www.espncricinfo.com/newzealand/content/player/37737.html

Looking at stats, I don't think our boys have to stand back for anything.

Maybe it is time not to be so overly critical of our boys and start supporting them. Looking at the lineups of the other teams, we don't have to stand back for anyone. It depends on who wins those mini-battles / critical moments.

The only one being critical is outkast.

The Amla/de Kock partnership is one of our strengths.

 

[Stefanmuller]

Agreed. However, should he fail (which given that he hasn't played for a few weeks now is a distinct possibility) we shouldn't consider it the end of the world, nor heap scorn and derision on him.

Of course not, but it would be great if he makes a good comeback. I have a good feeling about our WC chances. World cup games has a lot more pressure than normal games and the good thing is we have fresh players who wont carry the "choke" burden from prior failures.