Richard Dawkins demonstrates the evolution of the eye

[DrJohnZoidberg]

So I tell bad jokes not even one lol post

Meh, needs some work

 

[CommonSense]

@ be.plato

I want to know WHY do you reject evolution. What is the exact point which you reach when you go.... "hmm, that might be so, but past this point NO way!" Can you quantify that for me please. It's a simple question.

Please tell me, because in response to my earlier post you replied as such:

I don't believe that atheism is connected with evolution. Sure, many atheists agree with evolution but then again so do some religious people.

If you do not equate atheism with evolution, then in the name of all that is holy, WHAT exactly is your objection? Or were you just trolling?

This thread is about Evolution. It is not about "How life began". The two topics are separate.

So even if you are a creationist, why is evolution such an abhorrent idea to you?

Further, you dropped this diamond:

=The scientific discoveries will eventually led us all back to God anyway. But that's just my personal opinion.

You say that, but your actions seems to show differently. If you believe so, then why could evolution not lead you back to your god anyway?

These threads sure make for confusing reading sometimes.

 

[RiaX]

Because god is a subjective concept dependant on the mind. No scripture was written by god they written by men. Some are followers others are explorers.

The more rational you get the more ludacrous god becomes. Evolution is a problem because in scripture god molded mankind as a perfect being in his own image. Evolution, wrt the orgin of species, states that man is a derived primate through natural selection. Also they are main undereducated as they have never bothered to seek information as their scripture contains all the "answers". Most don't even realised that evolution and orgins of life are different concepts and complex. Abiogenesis is often included as a part evolution when it is not.

They also don't understand the core basic definition of evolution. Adaptation mutation diseases via genetics are all forms of evolution. They often misguided by made up fractionations of the concept of evolution viz macro and micro which is nonsense in that context.

The mentality is sepcial and can borderline a psychiatric delusional psychosis. See although never knowning the the people of the time even though they are aware the basic average knowledge was almost nonexistant. If I tell a christian tomorrow my friend woke up from the dead they will never believe it. Even if its possible (cardiac resus - those people that wake up in morgues. Strange not a single one met god) however a book almost 2000 year old diluted with exaggeration over time is plausable. You cannot reason with people like this. If you could there would be no religious people left

 

[Necuno]

Your contributions to this thread:

Troll much?

**** ! that means the villagers might burn me

Troll much? He barely manages any worthwhile posts.

I'm hurt

 

[Techne]

Because god is a subjective concept dependant on the mind. No scripture was written by god they written by men. Some are followers others are explorers.

Every concept is a subjective concept. When your father talks to you your brain generates a subjective image. It is a subjective conscious experience. I am not sure what you think is so significant about this trivial point.

The more rational you get the more ludacrous god becomes.

You have no evidence for this assertion since there is no empirical measure of "rationality". You provide no argument either. Ad hominems are logical fallacies btw.

Evolution is a problem because in scripture god molded mankind as a perfect being in his own image.

Evolution poses no problem for the view that humans are created in the image of God. I don't know why you even think so...

Evolution, wrt the orgin of species, states that man is a derived primate through natural selection.

Humans have a common ancestor with other primates. In other words, humans and other primates share accidental origins. This does not imply that humans are not created in the image of God. Perhaps you have some argument?

Also they are main undereducated as they have never bothered to seek information as their scripture contains all the "answers". Most don't even realised that evolution and orgins of life are different concepts and complex. Abiogenesis is often included as a part evolution when it is not.

They also don't understand the core basic definition of evolution. Adaptation mutation diseases via genetics are all forms of evolution. They often misguided by made up fractionations of the concept of evolution viz macro and micro which is nonsense in that context.

Silly generalizations :erm:. Sweeping Generalisation = logical fallacy.
And you are wrong, distinctions between macro and micro evolution are valid scientific concepts no matter how YECs and IDers abuse these concepts.

The mentality is sepcial and can borderline a psychiatric delusional psychosis. See although never knowning the the people of the time even though they are aware the basic average knowledge was almost nonexistant. If I tell a christian tomorrow my friend woke up from the dead they will never believe it. Even if its possible (cardiac resus - those people that wake up in morgues. Strange not a single one met god) however a book almost 2000 year old diluted with exaggeration over time is plausable. You cannot reason with people like this. If you could there would be no religious people left

Again, ad hominem is a logical fallacy. Read up about the concept. Try not to fall for it again .

 

[SaiyanZ]

Because god is a subjective concept dependant on the mind. No scripture was written by god they written by men. Some are followers others are explorers.

The more rational you get the more ludacrous god becomes. Evolution is a problem because in scripture god molded mankind as a perfect being in his own image. Evolution, wrt the orgin of species, states that man is a derived primate through natural selection. Also they are main undereducated as they have never bothered to seek information as their scripture contains all the "answers". Most don't even realised that evolution and orgins of life are different concepts and complex. Abiogenesis is often included as a part evolution when it is not.

They also don't understand the core basic definition of evolution. Adaptation mutation diseases via genetics are all forms of evolution. They often misguided by made up fractionations of the concept of evolution viz macro and micro which is nonsense in that context.

The mentality is sepcial and can borderline a psychiatric delusional psychosis. See although never knowning the the people of the time even though they are aware the basic average knowledge was almost nonexistant. If I tell a christian tomorrow my friend woke up from the dead they will never believe it. Even if its possible (cardiac resus - those people that wake up in morgues. Strange not a single one met god) however a book almost 2000 year old diluted with exaggeration over time is plausable. You cannot reason with people like this. If you could there would be no religious people left

I agree with all of this. Good post.

 

[Necuno]

I agree with all of this. Good post.

Because god is a subjective concept dependent on the mind.

The more rational you get the more ludicrous god becomes.

Lol. Yet the mind is too rational for god

 

[RiaX]

Macro and micro evolution in the context of "i see bacterial resistance hence micro-evolution" "i dont see apes turning to man hence no macro-evolution" see those two statements... they are often the product of the misunderstanding of the concept.

Evolution is evolution. Evolution occuring in a mirco-organism is abrv. as micro-evolution (drug resistance). Evolution occuring in a complex multicellular organism like a human being is abrv. as macro-evolution for example sickle cell anemia and resistance to glycoprotein 41 on HIV-1 capsid, expressing a massive change in the system.

As to your reply to my subjectivity im afraid you not understanding what I meant there. My father talking to me is much different, I can see and I can hear him speak. God not so much.

You have no evidence for this assertion since there is no empirical measure of "rationality". You provide no argument either.

I dont have to provide an arguement im assuming you theists have a memory that can last more than 10 posts.

Genesis is completely wrong, every single word in it. All it shows is people writing stories with the knowledge of their time.

Since you ID people love arguing with the eye lets go with the eye. Compare the eye to a digital camera, a digital camera is intelligently designed, it has this:

PERFECT storage
ZOOM
Detail (macroshots)
night shots (like taking pictures of the sky)
and it can be controlled at will.

something my normal eye does not have. I cannot control the iris in my eye. My eye cannot zoom, I cannot activate nightvision and I cant store images with such detail (hence why we invented cameras in the first place)

This does not imply that humans are not created in the image of God.

We live in a little place called the solar system. In the solar system there are 8 planets, 5 dwarf planets (with more comming) and over 180 moons and countless of asteroids, these all orbit the sun which is A SINGLE STAR. One of 200 billion stars each with its own system in our milkyway galaxy. And our milkyway galaxy is one of 100s of billions of galaxies

and you claim that god whom is said to create all of this is going to mold YOU in his image ? ... a tad arrogant dont you think. Its like saying hmmm Im going to buy a pet hamster I need the ENTIRE country of australia to keep it in

Evolution poses no problem for the view that humans are created in the image of God. I don't know why you even think so...

First it was genesis, then ID, keep conceding ground there will be none left sooner or later and the designer will hide in the last digit of pi

Again, ad hominem is a logical fallacy. Read up about the concept. Try not to fall for it again .

Not really. Still waiting for jesus ? he is not comming back because he is dead.

 

[Techne]

Macro and micro evolution in the context of "i see bacterial resistance hence micro-evolution" "i dont see apes turning to man hence no macro-evolution" see those two statements... they are often the product of the misunderstanding of the concept.

Evolution is evolution. Evolution occuring in a mirco-organism is abrv. as micro-evolution (drug resistance). Evolution occuring in a complex multicellular organism like a human being is abrv. as macro-evolution for example sickle cell anemia and resistance to glycoprotein 41 on HIV-1 capsid, expressing a massive change in the system.

Thanks, you are making my point for me. Glad we can agree that "distinctions between macro and micro evolution are valid scientific concepts no matter how YECs and IDers abuse these concepts".

As to your reply to my subjectivity im afraid you not understanding what I meant there. My father talking to me is much different, I can see and I can hear him speak. God not so much.

My point being, in an attempt to model reality as it is, your brain generates these subjective images of your dad while he is talking to you. It is subjective. What is objective is the concept of "your dad". We both can understand/intellectually abstract this concept and I can accept the view that you have a father i.e. your father really exists. I don't ever have to meet him in person. Same goes for any other concept.

I dont have to provide an arguement im assuming you theists have a memory that can last more than 10 posts.

If you claim that "The more rational you get the more ludacrous god becomes" then you need some kind of evidence or some kind of argument. Otherwise it is a pretty useless ad hominem fallacy.

Genesis is completely wrong, every single word in it. All it shows is people writing stories with the knowledge of their time.

This a pretty bold claim. I disagree. An important aspect of Genesis is that humans (and other things) are created. Humans, specifically, are created in the image of God. I think it has that right at least.

Since you ID people love arguing with the eye lets go with the eye. Compare the eye to a digital camera, a digital camera is intelligently designed, it has this:

PERFECT storage
ZOOM
Detail (macroshots)
night shots (like taking pictures of the sky)
and it can be controlled at will.

something my normal eye does not have. I cannot control the iris in my eye. My eye cannot zoom, I cannot activate nightvision and I cant store images with such detail (hence why we invented cameras in the first place)

I don't know why you think I am an IDer. I am not, as I have said many times, I think it is bad philosophy and not science.
Anyway, I don't know why you and other people think imperfections in humans are a big deal for creationism or theism. Perhaps you have an argument for why you think this is the case?

We live in a little place called the solar system. In the solar system there are 8 planets, 5 dwarf planets (with more comming) and over 180 moons and countless of asteroids, these all orbit the sun which is A SINGLE STAR. One of 200 billion stars each with its own system in our milkyway galaxy. And our milkyway galaxy is one of 100s of billions of galaxies

and you claim that god whom is said to create all of this is going to mold YOU in his image ? ... a tad arrogant dont you think. Its like saying hmmm Im going to buy a pet hamster I need the ENTIRE country of australia to keep it in

It's a subjective assertion to think it is arrogant to believe this. Some people may think it is humbling and that there is no reason to think this is arrogant.

First it was genesis, then ID, keep conceding ground there will be none left sooner or later and the designer will hide in the last digit of pi

I don't think classical theists have to concede any ground when it comes to creation. Evolution does not negate creation and it does not relegate it to "the last digit of pi" (that was funny btw ).

Not really. Still waiting for jesus ? he is not comming back because he is dead.

Nice try at changing the subject lol. It does not change the fact that ad hominems are logical fallacies .

 

[abandonallhope]

PERFECT storage
ZOOM
Detail (macroshots)
night shots (like taking pictures of the sky)
and it can be controlled at will.

So why do we keep developing new and better cameras ?

Are there any cameras that can indicate whether a photo is beautiful or mediocre ?

 

[abandonallhope]

I honestly wonder what sort of person it is in real life interactions, because its internet personality is a truly vacuous and unpleasant thing to behold.

Stupid comment removed.

People in glass houses though... the nerve...

 

[porchrat]

Stupid comment removed.

People in glass houses though... the nerve...

Good choice. Regardless of the kind of insults being thrown at you that was uncalled for.

 

[copacetic]

Stupid comment removed.

People in glass houses though... the nerve...

Good choice. Regardless of the kind of insults being thrown at you that was uncalled for.

Damn, I'd love to know what was said.

Put it back, damnit, I don't mind.

*edit*

I must also point out, that while you no doubt view yourself as a paragon of virtue, kindness, and holy light, abandonallhope, all it takes is a bit of a trawl through your comments to get an idea of your character.

Yes, I was a bit blunt, but its an honest opinion.

I am perfectly comfortable with myself and my relations with other human beings. Feel free to say anything you like about me, I know what is true and what is not.

 

[porchrat]

Damn, I'd love to know what was said.

Put it back, damnit, I don't mind.

Doesn't matter. He clearly realised how stupid it was, either that or realised it could potentially have landed him in hot water, and removed it.

No harm no foul.

Next time I'm reporting it though. It was a pathetic comment. Don't say I didn't warn you for next time abandonallhope.

 

[abandonallhope]

Regardless of the kind of insults being thrown at you that was uncalled for.

Is that right ?

So he can call me whatever he likes, but responding in kind is just unfair ?

 

[abandonallhope]

I must also point out, that while you no doubt view yourself as a paragon of virtue, kindness, and holy light, abandonallhope

Please provide the posts from which you derived this summation.

all it takes is a bit of a trawl through your comments to get an idea of your character.

Not all of us spill our personal lives on an internet forum, you know much, much less about me than you think you do.

 

[porchrat]

Is that right ?

So he can call me whatever he likes, but responding in kind is just unfair ?

Report it rather. That is what the button is there for.

Besides I'd hardly call your response comparable.

If you think it was comparable then put it back, I will report it, and we will see what the mods have to say about it.

 

[copacetic]

Please provide the posts from which you derived this summation.

It's just a feeling I get. If I'm wrong, cool. I probably am. All I have to go on is how you interact here. This is obviously very easy to misinterpret.

Not all of us spill our personal lives on an internet forum, you know much, much less about me than you think you do.

I don't know anything about you, aside from what I can glean from your posts.

I don't like you much, in that context, but who cares? You're clearly not here to win a popularity contest.

 

[abandonallhope]

It's just a feeling I get. If I'm wrong, cool. I probably am. All I have to go on is how you interact here. This is obviously very easy to misinterpret.

I don't know anything about you, aside from what I can glean from your posts.

And what you gleaned is that I view myself as a "paragon of virtue, kindness, and holy light".

I'd still like to know from which posts you got that feeling.

 

[abandonallhope]

Report it rather. That is what the button is there for.

Besides I'd hardly call your response comparable.

If you think it was comparable then put it back, I will report it, and we will see what the mods have to say about it.

Reporting isn't something that would occur to me easily.

The rule is that if you want to dish out stupid comments, don't be surprised when you get a retort.