Russo-Ukrainian War - 2022 Edition Part 1

[NarrowBandFtw]

Now what you need to acknowledge is that the initial invasion was a failure

you read an entire op-ed talking about what if Putin's true goal lies elsewhere and that is what you take away from it?!?

if Kiev was not the true goal, how was there any failure?

Armies do not fall back when things are going to plan

if that was true why are there multiple documented military strategies that employ exactly that?

Countervalue - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Military deception - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Distraction - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Feint - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Indirect approach - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[NarrowBandFtw]

You are a notorious fanboy, defending these actions non stop. You are a russian apologist over all these pages constantly. If you can see what has been done why do you keep defending Putin?

god, take some copium

seems you're a NBFTw fanboy entirely incapable of reading an article, much too keen to just bark your nonsense after you see who posted it

pathetic and hilarious at the same time

 

[The Trutherizer]

the uncomfortable possibility almost nobody wants to talk about ...

Opinion | What if Putin Didn’t Miscalculate?

It’s always wiser to treat an adversary as a canny fox, not a crazy fool.

www.nytimes.com

Then he's a calculating mass murdered without any doubt.

 

[NarrowBandFtw]

Another one LoL

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1511755121746755586

you cheer outright fascism (i.e. the suppression of dissenting information) ... why?

 

[Gimli_]

the evidence free conviction of another sovereign state is an excellent example of why truly independent investigations are needed

thanks for that apt reminder

There is a boat load of evidence. There are truckloads of journalists, cameras from space and people with cellphones. Nobody believes that Ukrain, even the USA can control the message and can stage thousands of scenes where civilians were killed in cold blood. You insisting on an independent investigation is just an attempt to put evidence into doubt. By the time your independent team (agreed to by the russians) are put together, all the evidence would have been buried already. In amongst all the press there will also be independents.

 

[Sneeky]

Regarding joining Nato

Free choice
NATO respects the right of every country to choose its own security arrangements. Each sovereign country
has the right to choose for itself whether it joins any treaty or alliance. This fundamental principle is enshrined
in international agreements, including the Helsinki Final Act and the Charter of Paris for a New Europe.
NATO membership is not imposed on countries. Article 13 of the Washington Treaty specifically gives Allies
the right to leave should they wish to.
Process of Accession
European countries that wish to join NATO are initially invited to begin an Intensified Dialogue with the
Alliance about their aspirations and related reforms. Aspirants may then be invited to join the Membership
Action Plan, a programme which helps nations prepare for possible future membership. Participation does not
guarantee membership, but is a key preparation mechanism.
To join the Alliance, nations are expected to respect the values of the North Atlantic Treaty, and to meet certain
political, economic and military criteria, set out in the Alliance’s 1995 Study on Enlargement. These criteria
include a functioning democratic political system based on a market economy; fair treatment of minority
populations; a commitment to resolve conflicts peacefully; an ability and willingness to make a military
contribution to NATO operations; and a commitment to democratic civil-military relations and institutions.

Part of that is you cant have internal unrest which is what happened last time Ukr tried to join the Nato membership action plan, the precursor to membership itself.
There was a lot of internal political instability and uprising, the ex Pres being ousted and fleeing. A Putin fanboy he then asked Putin to invade the place. The Ukr basically settled and decided not to join the EU and Nato, at least, thats the simplistic view (mine)
The uprising in Ukr

Euromaidan - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

There is no firm list of requirements but guidelines exist according to the Nato site.
This from Us Gov site but same info on others.

NATO membership is potentially open to all of Europe's emerging democracies that share the alliance's values and are ready to meet the obligations of membership.

There is no checklist for membership.

We have made clear that, at a minimum, candidates for membership must meet the following five requirements:

--New members must uphold democracy, including tolerating diversity.

--New members must be making progress toward a market economy.

--Their military forces must be under firm civilian control.

--They must be good neighbors and respect sovereignty outside their borders.

--They must be working toward compatibility with NATO forces.

Again, while these criteria are essential, they do not constitute a checklist leading automatically to NATO membership.

New members must be invited by a consensus of current members.

Decisions to invite new members must take into account the required ratification process in the member states. In the case of the United States, decisions are made in consultation with Congress.

The key determinant for any invitation to new members is whether their admission to NATO will strengthen the alliance and further the basic objective of NATO enlargement, which is to increase security and stability across Europe.

Minimum Requirements for NATO Membership

1997-2001.state.gov

So it not like hey, I wanna join your club and its all dandy, their are expectations and treaties that member states need to subscribe to as well in order to be elligable.

 

[ToxicBunny]

you cheer outright fascism (i.e. the suppression of dissenting information) ... why?

Would hardly call the crap that Scott puts out there dissenting information...

Huge steaming piles of horseshit yes, dissenting information nope.

 

[Defonotaltaccount]

No, I'm stating a fact. Not everyone follows the norm.

I only asked for you to STATE.
The norm.
The norm is ?
Opens downwards.
Silly puppy.

 

[Fred07]

 

[ForceFate]

I only asked for you to STATE.
The norm.
The norm is ?
Opens downwards.
Silly puppy.

Are you seriously trying that on me? Fact is, there's something called deviation from the norm. Time to update your manual/notes.

 

[buka001]

PATRICK LAWRENCE: The US Bubble of Pretend

The lack of objective, principled coverage of the war in Ukraine is a degenerate state of affairs. The one thing worse is the extent to which it's perfectly fine with most Americans. By Patrick Lawrence Special to Consortium News It is perfectly obvious by now, to anyone who cares to look,

consortiumnews.com

Important article for you @buka001 as you're quick to fall for the false flags.

Go back to bed.

You fall for any and every pro-Russian propaganda out there.


Meanwhile satellite photos from 19 March, eyewitness statements, drone footage and many other sources say you are beyond redemption for supporting and defending Russia on this.

 

[Defonotaltaccount]

Steiner will liberate Donbass and Mariupol any day now.

 

[sefeddt]

you cheer outright fascism (i.e. the suppression of dissenting information) ... why?

Your version of who the fascist are and mine are totally different.

Yes, Putin and Russia are fascist – a political scientist shows how they meet the textbook definition

When Vladimir Putin unleashed an unprovoked invasion of Ukraine on Feb. 24, 2022, the Ukrainian media, public and policymakers almost unanimously began calling the Russian president and the state he leads “rashyst.” The term is a hybrid of a derogatory moniker for Russia – “rasha” – and “fascist.”

Yes, Putin and Russia are fascist – a political scientist shows how they meet the textbook definition

When Russia invaded Ukraine, its leader was immediately labeled “fascist” by Ukrainians and others. A political scientist explains why that label fits.

theconversation.com

 

[Defonotaltaccount]

Russian occupied town.

Civilians there are the enemy.

I can see why it is pointless to debate with you. You are irrational, unreasonable and you wave those unreasonable viewpoints and opinions in other people's face like a badge of honor. For you it is an act of defiance and a cry for help. I feel sorry for you.

You see, most people learn to adapt and grow to new information and ideas; moving out of their safe spaces and on to new ideas in politics, religion and ideology and abandoning old ones, you however will never be free, because you carry your safe space around with you.

This is why you dangle rhetoric such as that above in front of others, which is utterly incompatible with any normal standards of behavior towards your fellow man. You are banging on the walls of that cage both begging to be released and demanding that other people climb in with you so you won't feel alone.

You forgot the formerly Ukie part.
Ukies bombing Ukies.
As usual.
Nice attempt at analysis.
Tell me doctor.
Does it hurt if i take off the mask ?

 

[Defonotaltaccount]

Are you seriously trying that on me? Fact is, there's something called deviation from the norm. Time to update your manual/notes.

I asked for the norm.
You are wrong.
In the absence of evidence of deviation.
We assume the norm.

 

[buka001]

all fake BS


based on what? your emotional reaction?


newsflash, ordinary Russians support him en masse

How is it fake?

You allege this, so provide an explanation in your own words, dissecting the fake and demonstrating it.

 

[ForceFate]

I asked for the norm.
You are wrong.
In the absence of evidence of deviation.
We assume the norm.

Time to update your notes. While at it, maybe do some DIY sometimes. You'll learn to deviate from the norm in the process.

 

[Defonotaltaccount]

Time to update your notes. While at it, maybe do some DIY sometimes. You'll learn to deviate from the norm in the process.

Yeah i asked for the norm.
You know the norm.
Door handle go down.
Thanks bro.
Try again.

 

[Blu82]

So this appeared in my twitter feed which is unfortunate since the Ukraine can't afford to loose their moral high ground.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1511760338743545858

 

[AfricanTech]

Phew!

The level of irrational is higher than it was in the Trump threads - man, at least that moron didn't actually murder anyone or reduce perfectly functioning towns to rubble on the pretext of getting rid of Nazis.

Need a cast iron stomach to read some of the **** spewed in this thread.