Russo-Ukrainian War - 2022 Edition - Part 4

[Nicodeamus]

Kazakhstan doesn't host US military base afaik. Neither does any country in the north-western coast of Africa.

Transit Center at Manas - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

It was closed in 2014 after Russia complained too much.

The number of AFCON bases are disputed as they are often used only by the host country, yet paid by the US.

Pentagon’s Own Map of U.S. Bases in Africa Contradicts Its Claim of “Light” Footprint

A formerly secret map from AFRICOM shows a network of 29 U.S. military bases that stretch from one side of Africa to another.

theintercept.com

 

[Mirai]

Russia is no longer communist, you need to move on.

Nobody claimed they were. But there is no place for them in dictating to us anymore. If you don't like that leave Europe.

 

[Mirai]

Transit Center at Manas - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

It was closed in 2014 after Russia complained too much.

The number of AFCON bases are disputed as they are often used only by the host country, yet paid by the US.

Pentagon’s Own Map of U.S. Bases in Africa Contradicts Its Claim of “Light” Footprint

A formerly secret map from AFRICOM shows a network of 29 U.S. military bases that stretch from one side of Africa to another.

theintercept.com

So you knowingly posted a lie?

 

[Nicodeamus]

Nobody claimed they were. But there is no place for them in dictating to us anymore. If you don't like that leave Europe.

Russia shouldn't dictate, but they are a counter balance to US influence on the continent. Many former Warsaw pact nations welcome being turned into US vassal states.

 

[TEXTILE GUY]

Russian missiles strike Ukraine's Odesa region

Russia said on Sunday that its Kalibr missiles had destroyed an ammunition depot containing missiles for U.S.-made HIMARS rocket in Ukraine's southeastern Odesa region, while Kyiv said a granary had been hit.

www.reuters.com

 

[Mirai]

Russia shouldn't dictate, but they are a counter balance to US influence on the continent.

Proof needed. In fact Russia's belligerence has brought US more into Europe.

Many former Warsaw pact nations welcome being turned into US vassal states.

Proof needed.

If Russia was just a bigger UK, then maybe it would be a valid point, but Russia is just the same USSR minus the love for Lenin.

 

[TEXTILE GUY]

Oops - repost

Will fill the gap with

 

[Nicodeamus]

Proof needed. In fact Russia's belligerence has brought US more into Europe.



Proof needed.

If Russia was just a bigger UK, then maybe it would be a valid point, but Russia is just the same USSR minus the love for Lenin.

The US would like to create a boogeyman out of a state that has a GDP the size of Italy and an army that has shrunk significantly since the cold war ended.

 

[Mirai]

The US would like to create a boogeyman out of a state that has a GDP the size of Italy and an army that has shrunk significantly since the cold war ended.

Look nothing has changed in Russia since USSR fell. In Germany they denazified. In Norway they denazified. Your own French wanted to hang Petain. Italians hanged Mussolini. Russia is just USSR renamed one day, they just went free market if one can call it that and they have the same crew in charge there for the past 20 years or so.

Russia is killing Ukrainians as we speak. No bogeyman. And a GDP size of Italy does not mean they don't have lots of artillery and troops who could bomb civilians.

 

[Nicodeamus]

Look nothing has changed in Russia since USSR fell. In Germany they denazified. In Norway they denazified. Your own French wanted to hang Vichy. Italians hanged Mussolini. Russia is just USSR renamed one day, they just went free market if one can call it that and they have the same crew in charge there for the past 20 years or so.

Russia is killing Ukrainians as we speak. No bogeyman. And a GDP size of Italy does not mean they don't have lots of artillery and troops who could bomb civilians.

A lot did change in Russia, for one the role of the Othodox Church became more prominent in replacing communist ideology. But what didn't change was Russia's self image,
Russia was not a defeated power unlike Germany and Japan. It was a weakened power, but not a defeated power. US troops did not move into Moscow as they did into Tokyo and Berlin.

For a good article on the West's "Russia problem".

The Times & The Sunday Times

News and opinion from The Times & The Sunday Times

www.thetimes.co.uk

I actually think that the UK has a similar problem to Russia, but the UK can get away with its imperial talk because it has the Shadow of America over it. In practice Britain is a Vassal state that cannot do much geopolitically without American approval.

Kissinger summed it up in 2014, "To the west the demonization of Putin isn't a policy, it's the alibi for not having a policy".

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/henry-kissinger-to-settle-the-ukraine-crisis-start-at-the-end/2014/03/05/46dad868-a496-11e3-8466-d34c451760b9_story.html

Ukraine has been independent for only 23 years; it had previously been under some kind of foreign rule since the 14th century. Not surprisingly, its leaders have not learned the art of compromise, even less of historical perspective. The politics of post-independence Ukraine clearly demonstrates that the root of the problem lies in efforts by Ukrainian politicians to impose their will on recalcitrant parts of the country, first by one faction, then by the other. That is the essence of the conflict between Viktor Yanukovych and his principal political rival, Yulia Tymoshenko. They represent the two wings of Ukraine and have not been willing to share power. A wise U.S. policy toward Ukraine would seek a way for the two parts of the country to cooperate with each other. We should seek reconciliation, not the domination of a faction.

 

[Mirai]

A lot did change in Russia, for one the role of the Othodox Church became more prominent in replacing communist ideology. But what didn't change was Russia's self image,

These are insignificant. Same Russia. No admission of the system and ideology they had as evil. No coming to terms with their aggressive imperialism the way colonialism is criticized in the UK, Spain and other countries.
Russians didn't even buy into communism so much.

Russia was not a defeated power unlike Germany and Japan. It was a weakened power, but not a defeated power. US troops did not move into Moscow as they did into Tokyo and Berlin.

Hence NATO has to exist to ward off the same people who under the USSR pushed Communism, under the Tsars pushed Russia as some Bizantine Empire II and now Russians still see themselves as great.

But as you say they are the size of Italy. They are a counterbalance being the size of Italy to US?

 

[Mirai]

Nico you posted stuff but that's irrelevant.

Russia under the Tsars also had the Orthodox Church. It was an imperial power under it too. It doesn't make much difference if there is Orthodox Church or Central Committee of the Communist Party in charge, or which ideology we go with as a PRETEXT... we maintain the legacy of the Bizantine Empire or workers of the world unite, the West is full of cannibal capitalist exploiters... and we must free the workers from oppression.... etc.

Russians these days are not church going. I heard stories of them complaining about shops being closed on Sundays in parts of Europe.

 

[Nicodeamus]

These are insignificant. Same Russia. No admission of the system and ideology they had as evil. No coming to terms with their aggressive imperialism the way colonialism is criticized in the UK, Spain and other countries.
Russians didn't even buy into communism so much.



Hence NATO has to exist to ward off the same people who under the USSR pushed Communism, under the Tsars pushed Russia as some Bizantine Empire II and now Russians still see themselves as great.

But as you say they are the size of Italy. They are a counterbalance being the size of Italy to US?

Russia has decommunized entirely, Solzhenitsyn is mandatory reading in Russian schools. I doubt that the Politburo would have allowed for that.

Solzhenitsyn's "Gulag" mandatory in Russian schools

Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin welcomed on Tuesday the publication of a school version of Soviet-era dissident Alexander Solzhenitsyn's "The Gulag Archipelago," calling it essential reading.

www.reuters.com

What replaced communist ideology however was Russian nationalism. Nationalism also became stronger in other former warsaw pact countries, notably Poland where Lech Welesa a few years ago said that polish democracy is dead.

Lech Walesa on Why Democracy Is Failing: ‘There Is No Leadership’

The legendary Polish union leader who helped end the Cold War says the United States and other nations have not done enough to create a…

foreignpolicy.com

 

[Mirai]

Russia has decommunized entirely, Solzhenitsyn is mandatory reading in Russian schools. I doubt that the Politburo would have allowed for that.

Solzhenitsyn's "Gulag" mandatory in Russian schools

Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin welcomed on Tuesday the publication of a school version of Soviet-era dissident Alexander Solzhenitsyn's "The Gulag Archipelago," calling it essential reading.

www.reuters.com

Russia always had nationalism. Under the Communists too.

The Soviet Union never really solved Russian nationalism | Aeon Essays

Lenin envisioned Soviet unity. Stalin called Russia ‘first among equals’. Yet Russian nationalism never went away

aeon.co

What replaced communist ideology however was Russian nationalism. Nationalism also became stronger in other former warsaw pact countries, notably Poland where Lech Welesa a few years ago said that polish democracy is dead.

Lech Walesa on Why Democracy Is Failing: ‘There Is No Leadership’

The legendary Polish union leader who helped end the Cold War says the United States and other nations have not done enough to create a…

foreignpolicy.com

This guy?

Former Polish leader Lech Walesa calls for West to reduce Russia's population

morningstaronline.co.uk

When Poland or any other European country invades another and threatens then with nukes and 'denazification' we'll talk again.

 

[tetrasect]

Why aren't there images of Russia doing the shelling?

Russia is in control of the Power station.

I'll let you figure out why they wouldn't be taking pictures of them shelling themselves.

 

[Mirai]

Nico, stay focused. Poland, Lithuania etc are not a problem here. They're not invading other states. The issue is Russia and its war of aggression. You always try your whataboutisms. Just stay focused. Russia is not fit to be your protector against the US. Learn to live with it.

 

[sefeddt]

P/R Bots wash, rinse repeat. Same "evidence" rehashed.

 

[The Trutherizer]

Colonialism doesn't exist in former colonized African countries. Russia however subjugated and bullies its former constituents to this day.

This Russia is innocent and West is evil and any debate on this gets automatically mirrored into whataboutisms is simply a mechanism of letting Russia off of the hook.

I've realized though some are not here to debate, they are here to state the terms and conditions. Russia delivered the terms and conditions to Zelenskyy and to NATO in November 2021. It was not and still is not open for debate. It is a list of demands. Period.

Putinism takes a firm root in the mind garden of those saturated by hatred for the West. The reason for this is that those types of people no longer ask questions. Perfect propaganda tool, one that has abandoned all rational and logical debate, is not interested in facts or evidence. A weaponized entity which is both vital and disposal.

As an adult, to allow one's self to let the evil actions of one off the hook because of the evil actions of another is one of the greatest injustices you can do to yourself. It is to deliberately strip away the foundations of compassion, consequences and understanding. You become no longer the whole but a diminished individual. You either become a soldier or a useful idiot.

Which is a big part of the reason why I mistrust allies of Russia. Especially ones in countries previously colonial.
Either their intelligence or their intent is suspect.

 

[Mirai]

Decommunization in Russia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Decommunization in Russia is the process of dealing with the communist legacies in terms of institutions and personnel that tends towards breaking with the Soviet past. Compared with the decommunization efforts of the other former constituents of the Eastern Bloc and the Soviet Union, it has been restricted to half-measures, if conducted at all.[1]

Unlike many other countries of the former Soviet bloc, in Russia lustration of senior Communist Party and KGB officials was staunchly resisted and has never been implemented there. Many with such a background have remained in power; most present-day Russian politicians began their careers in the Soviet period. A draft law on lustration was first put before the Russian parliament, then the RSFSR Supreme Soviet, in December 1992 by Galina Starovoytova. Neither at that time nor later have such proposals been successfully introduced.

Conscious attempts in Russian society to deal with the Soviet past have been uncertain.[16] Organisations such as the Memorial Society have worked on numerous projects involving witnesses to past events (Gulag inmates, Soviet rights activists) and younger generations, including schoolchildren.

 

[tetrasect]

The last 7 pages of this thread could be used as material for a thesis by a psychiatry student.

"Proposed technique for the approximation of lithium dosage based on observed degree of delusional behavior exhibited on online message boards by pro-Russian simps."