SA: Electricity companies to power up phonelines

[Karnaugh]

Point taken.

But what is the point of developing an inferior technology when things like wireless have far more potential? This is my point.

 

[MaD]

I think that the more options available the better. 98% of SA has power already, so with enough R&D this technology could be brought to reality and provide communication to those who have never even used a telephone. Incumbent telephone operators have never been as thorough as electricity providers - Telkom for example has only around 4 million fixed lines, or around 10% of the country.

There is massive potential not only in SA but around the world for powerline internet/voice application and no doubt with Gov. funding and people who know what they're doing running things the technology could become a viable alternative to what is available.

Imagine being able to choose between wireless, satellite, adsl or powerline.. powerline is still under development and testing but so was wireless, satellite and adsl.. its just a matter of time before it becomes commercially viable.

 

[Darke]

I don't think that any of us dispute that data, video and voice communications are the way of future, they will be in our homes, public places, work and other institutions, so much so that I can see travel agencies advertizing "Comunication Free zones" for the real getaway adventure.

Having a steady, reliable, stable means to do this built into our infrastructure will be vital as the amount of data we will 'consume' will steadily increase. Giving the governing body the ability to provide what will then be basic services, fast(ish), always on communications as part of residential package. As long as they have power, they have basic comms. This still leaves the market very widely open for special services, Streaming vid/TV/entertainment technologies, fast data services and whatever else is then needed or wanted.

For now it is just simply a means to get some form of information technology and basic voice to 90% of our population who have never had any. If we leave it up to the Telkom and DoC's of SA, they can not expect it until at least 2020.

 

[[)roi(]]

I think that the more options available the better. 98% of SA has power already,....

Are you sure about this? Is this something that Eskom advertise?

 

[Karnaugh]

Eskom do not supply power, the municipality does. Eskom generates power.

 

[mbs]

Eskom do not supply power, the municipality does. Eskom generates power.

Depends on where you are. Municipalities will also eventually have this utility removed from their mandate, due to REDs (Regional Electricity Distributors) - there are consumers in some areas breathing a sigh of relief over that, in the hope that this will result in improved service delivery - Joburg's billing fiasco being a case in point...

 

[bwana]

It seems the only thing holding the technology back in the USA is they need FCC approval due to the usage of radio waves to carry broadband over power lines. Apparently the possible interference is of concern to many. The USA certainly has the upper hand – since 1996 its been mandated that broadband service be made widely available through out the country.

The technology has been proven to work worldwide. An article in the Edison Electrical Review stated that a Spanish electricity company Iberdrola SA is offering BPL as a last mile broadband service while in the states there have been numerous successful pilot projects. Last mile service BPL is also being offered in Russia, Iceland and Finland. In the states the customers of an entire electricity utility are being offered BLP.

With BPL who would need Telkom? To the masses who cant afford telkoms prices the appeal of electricity AND communications in one affordable package would be fantastic. I'm sure Telkom would welcome the competition - although why anyone would want speeds in excess of 512 is beyond me.

 

[MaD]

lol

It does work, its not as perfect as most technologies but its getting there - nothing has been achieved without trying. If people always sat around saying 'oh my gooooood this isnt going to work' then we would probably still be sitting around fires with long hair and a wooden club by our sides, wondering how the hell one can make something travel across land without effort. Surely that round thing won't work????

 

[Debbie]

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world. The unreasonable man adapts the world to himself. All progress, therefore, depends on the unreasonable man."

 

[mbs]

"Progress today is the manifestation of greed - true progress is the result of an enquiring mind."
/I think the Dalai Lama said that, not sure tho...

 

[Peapod]

Erherm - my 2 cents (reliably informed) worth

Picture the scene.....
ESKOM are under pressure as are all power manufacturing companies globally, to figure out a way of implementing demand side management for their product. Because power companies generally invest large sums of money into their infrastructure, (they see the value of plowing profit back into their own enterprise, unlike some other companies we could mention) they have large, efficient networks that obviate the dilemma of last 10 mile delivery. In South Africa, Eskom has a fibre optic network of some considerable international reputation.
Enter convergence technologies into the fray.
Which forward thinking sensible CEO of any power company would not see the opportunity to deliver a service (and a billable one at that) at the same time as instituting a demnd side management mechanism?
Especialy since the infrastructure is already in place and the technology exists.

Here is the business profile of Eskom Enterprises http://www.eskomenterprises.co.za/ - see business sectors
Eskom Enterprises is a division of Eskom: This is on the web for all to see but here is a precis:
Has a wholly owned division called Eskom Telecommunications
Owns 45% of Arivia, an IT solutions company
Owns 50% of HEM KOM which amongst other things is a telecomms company
Owns shares in TSI Africa and here's their profile http://www.eskomenterprises.co.za/tsi/index.htm
and lists under Related Projects is a principle in Eskom Enterprises - national fibre-optic network programme

Furthermore, from EsKom's own website
Company Profile

Company Profile
Overview: Eskom Enterprises Pty Ltd was established as a fully registered company and officially launched September 11th 1999 to coincide with the opening of the Seventh All Africa Games held in Johannesburg. Eskom Enterprises is part of the Eskom group and is the holding company for a number of subsidiaries - all of which provide products and services related to the power industry in Africa and around the world. These subsidiaries include TSI, Rotek, and Eskom Telecommunications.

In March 2000 the Electricity Council took the decision to move all Telecommunications functions from the Eskom Transmission and Distribution Groups into Eskom Enterprises. Eskom Telecommunications was thus created to house all telecommunications assets, employees and functions. Eskom Telecommunications cherishes the following

Vision: To be the leading provider of telecommunications and related services in emerging markets
Mission: To be a world class telecommunications operator and provide a full range of telecommunications services to business and residential customers and other operators in South Africa, selected telecommunications services internationally, and continue to provide critical services to Eskom.

It's like music to my ears!

But wait, theres more

Over the years Eskom has developed and operated a robust national private utility telecommunications network and has in recent years upgraded the backbone to a broadband synchronous digital hierarchy (SDH) network using microwave radio and fibre optic technologies. This state of the art infrastructure is supplemented by more than 900km of fibre optic cable installed on power lines and equipped with SDH terminals. A modern network management centre operates on a 24-hours basis, 7 days a week to ensure that the operation of the network meets the availability requirements of safe and efficient electricity supply. The reliability and performance requirements necessarily imposed on telecommunications by the mission critical electricity network determines that the telecommunications staff is capable and high performance driven. The modernisation program that was carried out has ensured that Eskom Telecommunications staff are up to date with current technology and capable of rolling out a complex network in a well defined and effective manner.

see it all at http://www.eskom.co.za/live/content.php?Item_ID=75&Revision=en/0

And here's something current and pertinent
http://www.eskom.co.za/live/content.php?Item_ID=590&Revision=en/0
and i quote from the article

Last week Teddy Naidoo, telecommunications manager for City Power Johannesburg, announced that the power supplier could start providing power line telecommunications by as early as the second quarter of 2005.

But like i have said a billion times on this forum, the biggest obstacle is a telecomms act that encompasses suitably this technology - the article re-iterates that;

Business Connexion notes that, as it stands, the lack of clarity in terms of the law or regulation is a hurdle that any utilities company will have to overcome before rolling out voice or data over power lines. "It is unclear as to which of the four convergence licences a power utility company will have to apply for. My suggestion is that interested users of the technology wait for the ink to dry on the Convergence Bill before they act," says Brauer.

I dropped off this forum for ages because of my own involvement in lobbying for this technology. I am now back. heh heh.
I can assure you, it is under Beta test, it is real and it is coming soon.

 

[stoke]

/Me gets excited again. Now how long does it take to add a clause to a document and get some mamparra's to sign it off ? My estimates = 5 months. Patience wearing thinner.

 

[MaD]

hmmmm.. Eskom Telecom.. where do I sign?!

 

[eye_suc]

Eskom: Already sounds like a telecommunications company!!! Give me power and communications! Geez, if this gets off the ground Telkom goes bye bye!

 

[Peapod]

Egzakkary!!!!!
Which is why things are so hush hush - can you IMAGINE the wrangling going on around this?
Not to mention the conflict of interests - does anyone know ho much of Eskom is owned by Telkom and vice versa?

 

[Karnaugh]

All of which is simply hearsay.

 

[Peapod]

plainspeak
it is not hearsay. it is happening.
i worked on it for a bidder

 

[bwana]

All of which is simply hearsay.

Can you be more specific as to what is hearsay? Or are you referring to all of the prior posts, including all of yours?

 

[Peapod]

An edited message from the INDRANET guys (Mesh Technologies as opposed to PLC)

The powers that be have serious doubts re PLC technology. In fact in some far east countries (Japan) they are banning it for performance and security reasons.

Your forum should look at mesh technologies (as we do) as a complete rival technology to existing and incumbent Telkom technologies.

Always interested in what you guys are up to.

So did some digging around and found this http://ntrg.cs.tcd.ie/undergrad/4ba2.05/group13/ and heres a quote of findings from the document. The document is hugely informative on PLC technology and worth a read if you have the time

Problems & Solutions
The power lines would need repeaters to maintain signal integrity [1] and since the data signal cannot pass through transformers (in which case it would be lost), they must be bypassed. Routing data around transformers can be costly [11]. Since power supply networks vary from country to country, the cost of transformer bypassing can vary. To generalise, houses take in a low voltage (LV), so the medium voltage (MV) used for transmission must pass through a MV/LV transformer before it can enter a house. In the US, 1-10 houses are served by a MV/LV transformer, in Japan the figure can be up to thirty, while in Europe several hundred houses can be serviced by a single transformer [12]. This may account for the fact that BPL has been made commercially available in some European countries [13], while in the US utility companies are still engaging in trials. On the other hand, a report by the National Exchange Carrier Association [1] estimated that it would cost $10.9 billion to lay the wiring needed to provide rural areas in the US with (conventional) broadband. Just because BPL would be a cheaper alternative does not mean it is economically viable.

The cost of transformer bypassing is not the sole economic headache for potential providers. Since powerlines were never intended to be used for piggybacking data [12], a number of problems arose when trying to do so. These include high attenuation at high frequencies and noise (internal and external) [14]. As has been mentioned earlier, this leads to the necessity for a lot of error correction/prevention in any protocols using power lines as a physical layer. One thing that cannot be resolved, however is a failing in the electrical properties of the powerlines themselves. They act as aerials because they are not shielded [15]. This means that they can pick up noise and transmit it on as well as emit interference. Unfortunately, BPL operates at the same frequencies as short wave radio and low-band VHF. This can render various radio systems including those of governments unusable [16]. Amateur radio enthusiasts the world over seem to be united in their distaste for what BPL does to the airwaves [16, 17]. This interference has historically scuppered BPL trials. A good example of this is the Nor.Web trial that began in 1998 in Manchester[15]. Despite complaints about the interference and warnings from the Radiocommunications Agency [18], the company consistently rubbished criticism and insisted that the roll out would take place. By the end of 1999, the company had been closed down [15]. In Japan, the technology will not be adopted because of the interference problem [10].

Current trials seem to be suffering from the same problem. Power company Scottish Hydro Electric is currently offering BPL in three towns for £35.99 and £29.99 per month for 1 Mbps and 512 kbps connections respectively [19]. While the price is in the region of DSL, the interference problem has not gone away: BBC engineers have confirmed this [1]. Even in Germany where there are many companies offering commercially available BPL, the University of Duisburg-Essen has had similar findings when testing interference levels [15].

And then found the following

From LINK Media Network Weblog dated 22 dec 04
Japan may lift ban on data communications via power lines
Japan plans to launch a debate on lifting a ban on using power lines for data communications, enabling people get access to the Internet at high speed, an official said today. "We are preparing to hold talks of a study group early next year," said an official at the Ministry of Internal Affairs and Communications. If the study group finds no technical problem with the new service, the ministry will move for the deregulation as early as in 2006. Data communications based on power lines would enable users to build local area networks at home or access the Internet and control air conditioners and other home appliances from remote places. The ministry currently bans such use of power lines due to concerns that the 2-30MHz frequency spectrum, which is expected to be used for the new services, may interfere with existing radio services.

# posted by Andy @ 15:50 UTC Comment (0) | Trackback (0)

Another hugely informative site is http://www.qrpis.org/~k3ng/bpl.html

Let's get as informed as we can be folks - knowledge is power after all and if we are to be jimmy punched first by Telkom and then by another pseudo government company (ESKOM) into a technology that is inferior and fraught with problems, I want as much information personally before the fact as I can possibly get!

 

[Peapod]

Mesh Technologies/Networking vs PLC (C)

See http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/wireless/2004/01/22/wirelessmesh.html
for info on what Mesh Networking and gives guidelines on how you can build a local area mesh network....NICE!
See http://conferences.oreillynet.com/cs/et2004/view/e_sess/4697 for more for countires like ours!!!!
Me thinks we should recruit the writers of these articles onto our forum! *hmmmmm she thinks, clever clever*

See what MicroSoft has to say http://research.microsoft.com/mesh/

and from the world summit
http://research.microsoft.com/meshsummit/

What do you think chaps? Possible in SA, Can we MAKE it happen?