SA's electric car boom is coming

[Cosmik Debris]

I rate we go back to using ox wagons, low carbon footprint.

Oxen fart methane, a known greenhouse gas...

 

[Cosmik Debris]

People size their PV systems based on their expected peak demand. In saying that to charge your vehicle to travel a 50km return trip would require a 8-10kwh of battery assuming you did the charging of the EV exclusively in the dark and Eskom is totally unavailable. That's probably a 80k investment if it were done independently just for the car. You also don't use your car every day and it is at home on weekends for some daytime charging so you could defer it for a full charge once a week for the average driver.

Nice info, thanks. At last someone that can give figures. My concern is that this is economically beyond over 90% of the SA population. Some info:

An interesting graph surfaced after the budget speech: -

113 000 salary earners pay 27% of all the PAYE.
15% of salary earners, pay 82% of all employees tax

When it comes to company tax the picture is even more skewed.
Just 0.1% of the companies pay 64% of the tax
4.7% of the companies pay 96% of the tax.

Currently, approximately three million South Africans account for 97% of the country’s personal income tax collected in 2019.

EV boom incoming?

 

[Cosmik Debris]

given the average drive in SA is 40km a day, and an ev averages about 15kw /100km, you'll need roughly 6kw hr a car.

well within capacity for eskom, or battery systems for that matter.

Thanks for that good info. Now read my post preceding this one and tell me if EV's are affordable in SA.

We're fooked...

 

[chrisc]

There is a lot of hot air and ill-informed people here who have never had an electric car

My UK cousin, a 70 year old lady, has had her e-Mini for 21 months now. She drives it to and from the library where she works half-days, that is a 28 mile round trip. Then there are shopping trips and most week-ends visiting friends. She plugs it in to her 800 watt charging station at night. The car’s state of charge never goes below 30% and by 9.00am its always at 100% range.

It is less efficient in winter, and when it’s below 5 deg, the range is about 10%-12% less (or depletes more quickly).

Maintenance over the period has been one set of front tyres at 44000 miles, wheel alignment and nothing else. Inspections are free for 6 years or 100 000 miles. No oil change or anything like that.

It was pointed out that an internal combustion engines car has 26 000 parts, whereas an electric car has 4000 parts. Far less to go wrong. Quiet and smooth, nippy performance

Her energy costs for the year amount to £7200 a year. Electrical units used in 2018-2019 were 14400 units. Since the car has been using electricity, this is now 21100 units. This works out to £91 per month extra. Petrol costs when there was a petrol-driven car was £122

Their electrical charge fee works out to £0.22/kWH which is more than the SA rate (in Cape Town)

 

[Cosmik Debris]

There is a lot of hot air and ill-informed people here who have never had an electric car

My UK cousin, a 70 year old lady, has had her e-Mini for 21 months now. She drives it to and from the library where she works half-days, that is a 28 mile round trip. Then there are shopping trips and most week-ends visiting friends. She plugs it in to her 800 watt charging station at night. The car’s state of charge never goes below 30% and by 9.00am its always at 100% range.

It is less efficient in winter, and when it’s below 5 deg, the range is about 10%-12% less (or depletes more quickly).

Maintenance over the period has been one set of front tyres at 44000 miles, wheel alignment and nothing else. Inspections are free for 6 years or 100 000 miles. No oil change or anything like that.

It was pointed out that an internal combustion engines car has 26 000 parts, whereas an electric car has 4000 parts. Far less to go wrong. Quiet and smooth, nippy performance

Her energy costs for the year amount to £7200 a year. Electrical units used in 2018-2019 were 14400 units. Since the car has been using electricity, this is now 21100 units. This works out to £91 per month extra. Petrol costs when there was a petrol-driven car was £122

Their electrical charge fee works out to £0.22/kWH which is more than the SA rate (in Cape Town)

All great. But if EV's were the norm in SA, the grid would collapse. So any EV boom for SA is a pipe dream.

 

[krycor]

I think the bigger issue is the service industry change.. Ie EVs require less maintenance and u pay less tax due to fuel not being required.

So that’s a lot of jobs going again globally.. (let’s pretend that batteries, chips, electricity was all plentiful).

Yah.. SA in trouble. Reminds wife of plan to bounce next year.

 

[wingnut771]

I think the bigger issue is the service industry change.. Ie EVs require less maintenance and u pay less tax due to fuel not being required.

So that’s a lot of jobs going again globally.. (let’s pretend that batteries, chips, electricity was all plentiful).

Yah.. SA in trouble. Reminds wife of plan to bounce next year.

Add autonomous driving taxis and trucks...

 

[Johand]

I can't wait for electric cars.

For those complaining that Eskom won't keep up - here is something for reflection - it is much easier to build Solar PV plants and Wind Power plants than it is to build new refineries... Plus we can have more private players. An electric charging station is also a lot easier and cheaper to build than a petrol station.

It is going to be like FTTH in the metros. At first it seems like nothing is happening and then suddenly it explodes.

Electric cars also make the economics of home PV much, much better...

 

[Cosmik Debris]

I can't wait for electric cars.

For those complaining that Eskom won't keep up - here is something for reflection - it is much easier to build Solar PV plants and Wind Power plants than it is to build new refineries... Plus we can have more private players. An electric charging station is also a lot easier and cheaper to build than a petrol station.

It is going to be like FTTH in the metros. At first it seems like nothing is happening and then suddenly it explodes.

Electric cars also make the economics of home PV much, much better...

The problem is the cars need to charge at night when the sun doesn't shine. Unless each home can afford a lot of battery it's not going to work in SA. You need a coal baseload to sustain generation in SA and that can't be stopped and started easily. And that big Tesla battery in Aussie that all the optimists went glassy eyed over? What happened there?

 

[wingnut771]

The problem is the cars need to charge at night when the sun doesn't shine. Unless each home can afford a lot of battery it's not going to work in SA. You need a coal baseload to sustain generation in SA and that can't be stopped and started easily. And that big Tesla battery in Aussie that all the optimists went glassy eyed over? What happened there?

I don't know, what happened there?

 

[Sensorei]

There is a lot of hot air and ill-informed people here who have never had an electric car

My UK cousin, a 70 year old lady, has had her e-Mini for 21 months now. She drives it to and from the library where she works half-days, that is a 28 mile round trip. Then there are shopping trips and most week-ends visiting friends. She plugs it in to her 800 watt charging station at night. The car’s state of charge never goes below 30% and by 9.00am its always at 100% range.

It is less efficient in winter, and when it’s below 5 deg, the range is about 10%-12% less (or depletes more quickly).

Maintenance over the period has been one set of front tyres at 44000 miles, wheel alignment and nothing else. Inspections are free for 6 years or 100 000 miles. No oil change or anything like that.

It was pointed out that an internal combustion engines car has 26 000 parts, whereas an electric car has 4000 parts. Far less to go wrong. Quiet and smooth, nippy performance

Her energy costs for the year amount to £7200 a year. Electrical units used in 2018-2019 were 14400 units. Since the car has been using electricity, this is now 21100 units. This works out to £91 per month extra. Petrol costs when there was a petrol-driven car was £122

Their electrical charge fee works out to £0.22/kWH which is more than the SA rate (in Cape Town)

Doesn't really apply consdering in the UK electric cars are much cheaper because there is no import tax on EV's made anywhere in the EU. This now includes Teslas which are now also manufactured in Germany.

In SA we pay 42% import tax on electric vehicles.

 

[wingnut771]

Doesn't really apply consdering in the UK electric cars are much cheaper because there is no import tax on EV's made anywhere in the EU. This now includes Teslas which are now also manufactured in Germany.

In SA we pay 42% import tax on electric vehicles.

This is the number one issue.

 

[Moto Guzzi]

Electric cars are like being out on parole with an ankle strap.

If you want to dig graves quietly at night:

 

[RonSwanson]

Electric cars are like being out on parole with an ankle strap.

If you want to dig graves quietly at night:

I dig it.

 

[thehuman]

30a @ 220v for 10 hours is 66kwh

If there is loadsheding maybe 2 or 4 hours is lost.
By the time ev is more mainstream business will have charging sockets in parking and solar panels as carports.

Makro here in port Elizabeth already have solar panel carports.

 

[wingnut771]

30a @ 220v for 10 hours is 66kwh

If there is loadsheding maybe 2 or 4 hours is lost.
By the time ev is more mainstream business will have charging sockets in parking and solar panels as carports.

Makro here in port Elizabeth already have solar panel carports.

Makro in dbn used to have solar panels and carports.

 

[quovadis]

Nice info, thanks. At last someone that can give figures. My concern is that this is economically beyond over 90% of the SA population. Some info:

An interesting graph surfaced after the budget speech: -

113 000 salary earners pay 27% of all the PAYE.
15% of salary earners, pay 82% of all employees tax

When it comes to company tax the picture is even more skewed.
Just 0.1% of the companies pay 64% of the tax
4.7% of the companies pay 96% of the tax.

Currently, approximately three million South Africans account for 97% of the country’s personal income tax collected in 2019.

EV boom incoming?

And yet we sell hundreds of thousands of new cars every year with the average price probably between R300-R400k. If you offset the fuel saving the affordability would be higher.

 

[wingnut771]

Then:

Now:

 

[B-1]

Then:
View attachment 1163862
Now:
View attachment 1163866

History taught in schools:

 

[dualmeister]