Skilled people are leaving South Africa in droves – and government’s unemployment plans can’t stop it

[TheChamp]

one cannot reason with the average anc person

Why would you even waste your time doing that? It's the skilled people you need to reason with, explain to them why leaving is bad for our country.

 

[azbob]

Skilled people have always left for better opportunities abroad. It’s now easier for them to do so as well as more people motivated to do so.

Just like skilled foreigners have always come to SA to fill those gaps and will continue to do so.

 

[TelkomUseless]

He wanted to chain them to trees but you people moaned about that as well, what must the poor guy do?

Hmm. Once again ANC is just lip service (whites must stay). But actions speaks different (more stricter BEE/AA in 2021 etc)..

If Cyril was serious.. he would have stopped with the BEE/AA crap, and cut red tape, follow what investors/financial people tell him. But he wont.. because ANC is commies.

 

[TelkomUseless]

Skilled people have always left for better opportunities abroad. It’s now easier for them to do so as well as more people motivated to do so.

Just like skilled foreigners have always come to SA to fill those gaps and will continue to do so.

They don't qualify as BEE/AA. Means 0 for a company that wants to comply with government Equity Stats.

 

[azbob]

They don't qualify as BEE/AA. Means 0 for a company that wants to comply with government Equity Stats.

Irrelevant. The job needs to get done and they get to do it if there are no locals available with the scarce skills required.

 

[PaulMurkin]

People go where they feel appreciated and safe. The Americans aren't happy with their country either. Many are moving to other places. But that's a different kind of move, one to do with different factors I recall reading an article its to do with insanely priced healthcare and such.

This country is screwed, you'd be a fool to say otherwise. There is nothing left of value here economically speaking. Just another failed African state like so many others, the Zimbabwe example probably faces us in the future

 

[TelkomUseless]

Irrelevant. The job needs to get done and they get to do it if there are no locals available with the scarce skills required.

Might not be irrelevant, depends if the company wants to be fined.

And yea. People move... but ANC government is just making sure more people actually leave.

edit: And with the ANC not being investor friendly etc.. jobs are getting scarce in SA. Look at our 35% unemployment rate. Its just increasing year on year. Sooner or later there is go to be very little jobs and even foreigners won't have come here because there is little jobs left.

And that is a big reason why more people (and rich) people are leaving. Government is hell bent on destroying SA.

 

[PaulMurkin]

Might not be irrelevant, depends if the company wants to be fined.

And yea. People move... but ANC government is just making sure more people actually leave.

edit: And with the ANC not being investor friendly etc.. jobs are getting scarce in SA. Look at our 35% unemployment rate. Its just increasing year on year. Sooner or later there is go to be very little jobs and even foreigners won't have come here because there is little jobs left.

And that is a big reason why more people (and rich) people are leaving. Government is hell bent on destroying SA.

Pretty much!

What worries me is the ANC will eventually realise there's some of us who earn incomes abroad but are paid here and in local currency, then they will try and invent some BEE/AA related laws around that, and THAT will be one of the triggers for me to pack my bags and go.

In our meeting today it was quite clear that if this country goes tits-up, we all just move to the closest overseas office of choice and work remotely as we have been. Pain the ass but what do you do?

The unemployment rate indirectly feeds crime, something this government seems pretty determined to keep increasing year on year.

 

[Supervan II]

They will still post on this and other SA forums.
Today I rode my bicycle around the river in Amsterdam, such a pleasure riding a bike with no fear of being killed.
Lolzzz

In the past 6-8 months I have had a number of friends leave for The Netherlands, all of them are professionals:
2 x pharmacists (hubby & wife) plus 2 kids - Leiderdorp
1 x Electrical Engineer, wife & 2 kids - Arnhem
1 x Senior Manager (Pharmaceuticals), hubby & 2 kids - Krimpen aan den IJssel
1 Software Developer and wife - Almelo

I very much doubt that they'll be back

 

[PaulMurkin]

In the past 6-8 months I have had a number of friends leave for The Netherlands, all of them are professionals:
2 x pharmacists (hubby & wife) plus 2 kids - Leiderdorp
1 x Electrical Engineer, wife & 2 kids - Arnhem
1 x Senior Manager (Pharmaceuticals), hubby & 2 kids - Krimpen aan den IJssel
1 Software Developer and wife - Almelo

I very much doubt that they'll be back

They won't be back... and yes, I am actually of interest to a company in Leiden, they've told me if I ever consider leaving I must please call them first, they'll take care of everything.

 

[Ghost64]

In the past 6-8 months I have had a number of friends leave for The Netherlands, all of them are professionals:
2 x pharmacists (hubby & wife) plus 2 kids - Leiderdorp
1 x Electrical Engineer, wife & 2 kids - Arnhem
1 x Senior Manager (Pharmaceuticals), hubby & 2 kids - Krimpen aan den IJssel
1 Software Developer and wife - Almelo

I very much doubt that they'll be back

I don’t see the problem. Do we need them? There’s countries actively recruiting skilled workers it’s not a new thing.
We are also actively recruiting new skilled workers. There are lots of skilled foreigners coming in that want to live here.

 

[cguy]

I don’t see the problem. Do we need them? There’s countries actively recruiting skilled workers it’s not a new thing.
We are also actively recruiting new skilled workers. There are lots of skilled foreigners coming in that want to live here.

The issue is that the outflow exceeds the inflow significantly.

 

[Ghost64]

The issue is that the outflow exceeds the inflow significantly.

Based on?
The IT sector for example is being filled by cheap Indian labor work force. One can argue the quality of work but the work is getting done.

Dischem is killing the pharmacists, I’ve noticed there’s 2 pharmacist per store, the rest are normal workers dispensing medication under supervision of one pharmacist.

It will level out at some point. I’m sure there’s 1000s coming out of uni that will quickly fill those roles.

 

[supersunbird]

Based on?
The IT sector for example is being filled by cheap Indian labor work force. One can argue the quality of work but the work is getting done.

Dischem is killing the pharmacists, I’ve noticed there’s 2 pharmacist per store, the rest are normal workers dispensing medication under supervision of one pharmacist.

It will level out at some point. I’m sure there’s 1000s coming out of uni that will quickly fill those roles.

Ja nee, none as blind as those that don't want to see, as they say. Seems experience counts for nothing. Guess that's why municipalities and gov departments and SOEs are being run so well.

 

[Ghost64]

Ja nee, none as blind as those that don't want to see, as they say. Seems experience counts for nothing. Guess that's why municipalities and gov departments and SOEs are being run so well.

Strange though coz those that I know of that have left we’re never at the upper echelon of their respective field...

 

[cguy]

Based on?

10 years in academia, watching most the brightest head off overseas. Almost 20 years overseas, watching the brightest arrive, while working in brilliant teams consisting of 60+% foreign born workers for most of my career.

The IT sector for example is being filled by cheap Indian labor work force. One can argue the quality of work but the work is getting done.

Only for the bottom tiers of work. The more advanced work costs, even in India.

It will level out at some point. I’m sure there’s 1000s coming out of uni that will quickly fill those roles.

See my point above about the outflow of graduates leaving.

Strange though coz those that I know of that have left we’re never at the upper echelon of their respective field...

Almost everyone I know who has left has been in the upper echelons of their field. It probably depends on who you know.

At the end of the day, it's a zero sum game. If another country pays more, offers more stability, more career growth, more safety, more opportunity for your family, better infrastructure, etc., skilled people will tend to head in that direction, while very few people move in the opposite direction (not to say that it doesn't happen - people have different priorities).

 

[Paul_S]

There is nothing he can do. He should not get involved in these type of discussions or give any comments on it. People are leaving the country. He cannot stop the braindrain from happening. Best he can do is to work on strengthening the military and police. One never know when you will need them.

There is plenty he can try to do but won't. He could start with the scrapping of mining charters and BEE.

I'm too old to move but for those that are staying you better batten down all hatches. I don't want to be negative but once the government can no longer afford to pay for SASSA grants we're going to end up with 20+ million people on death's door all fighting for whatever scraps they can get their hands on. The KZN riots will look like a walk in the park. First it will be businesses that are targetted and once there is nothing left the suburbs will be next.

I really hope it does not come to that but the money is running out so it's almost inevitable.

 

[Messugga]

Why would you even waste your time doing that? It's the skilled people you need to reason with, explain to them why leaving is bad for our country.

Why would we give a toss about us leaving being bad for the country? We're uprooting our entire lives to get away from the place. Do you think we feel any loyalty to it?

 

[Markd]

You still spend them dollars here. Thank you for your service.

yup, should also be paying some form of income tax here if you earned all your money sitting in SA. Every time you buy anything you're giving the government 15% of that as VAT. The other 85% is going towards whichever retailers you spend at and all of it contributes towards employing people. The skills benefit SA for sure.

 

[supersunbird]

Why would you even waste your time doing that? It's the skilled people you need to reason with, explain to them why leaving is bad for our country.

Well, if the country doesn't want them leaving is what they have to do... If the country doesn't want to listen to ways to make itself a nicer place to live, as it's been told for 27 years ("crime is so bad" aka address crime, "schooling is so poor" aka fix schooling so that most kids get a quality education) then why should people care about the country?