SO .........the transfer of my new property ain't what it seemed

[undesign]

Seems a latent defect, doubt the seller was even aware of it. Is the crack structural do you think, probably not otherwise it would have been fairly visible even behind wallpaper - the house is old so most likely not a recent crack. (I'm no expert though)

http://www.housecheck.co.za/voetstoots-latent-and-patent-defects-and-the-home-inspection-report/

 

[Humberto]

I am not a lawyer but this is how I understand things based on some reading I did a while back for a family member.

1. Voetstoots is alive and well despite the CPA.
2. The CPA only applies to houses bought from property developers.
3. A patent defect is one that a buyer should have been aware of upon a careful inspection of the property. Examples are broken windows and bad carpets.
4. It is the buyer's responsibility to carefully inspect a property to familiarise themself with the state of the property. They cannot afterwards complain they were unaware of a patent defect.
5. A latent defect is one that the buyer could not have been aware of upon a careful inspection of the property. Examples are a stove where one of the plates isn't working or a rat infestation in the roof of the house.
6. The seller may be aware or unaware of a latent defect. For example the seller may not have been aware of a broken stove plate because of never using that particular stove plate when cooking.
7. If the seller is aware of a latent defect, they must declare this defect in the sale. As such the latent defect becomes a patent defect.
8. Voetstoots clauses cover all patent defects and all latent defects that the seller was not aware of.
9. If a seller is aware of a latent defect but does not declare it to a prospective buyer then it is fraud and the seller can subsequently be sued for the cost of repairs and damages. The buyer needs to be able to prove however that the seller was aware of the defect and this can be difficult. An example of this would be the following: A house has a roof that leaks. Before putting the house on the market, the seller has the ceiling and walls repaired to hide the fact that the roof leaks, without having the actual roof fixed. If the seller does not disclose the fact that the roof leaks then they are maliciously concealing a latent defect. If the buyer can subsequently show that the seller must have been aware of the problem through the fact that they had damage to the walls and ceiling repaired before the sale then the buyer can sue the seller for the cost of having the roof repaired.

Once you've signed an offer to purchase, you are contractually bound. The process is no longer within your control. Hence you cannot simply instruct the conveyancers to halt all paperwork until further notice.

 

[akescpt]

I am not a lawyer but this is how I understand things based on some reading I did a while back for a family member.

1. Voetstoots is alive and well despite the CPA.
2. The CPA only applies to houses bought from property developers.
3. A patent defect is one that a buyer should have been aware of upon a careful inspection of the property. Examples are broken windows and bad carpets.
4. It is the buyer's responsibility to carefully inspect a property to familiarise themself with the state of the property. They cannot afterwards complain they were unaware of a patent defect.
5. A latent defect is one that the buyer could not have been aware of upon a careful inspection of the property. Examples are a stove where one of the plates isn't working or a rat infestation in the roof of the house.
6. The seller may be aware or unaware of a latent defect. For example the seller may not have been aware of a broken stove plate because of never using that particular stove plate when cooking.
7. If the seller is aware of a latent defect, they must declare this defect in the sale. As such the latent defect becomes a patent defect.
8. Voetstoots clauses cover all patent defects and all latent defects that the seller was not aware of.
9. If a seller is aware of a latent defect but does not declare it to a prospective buyer then it is fraud and the seller can subsequently be sued for the cost of repairs and damages. The buyer needs to be able to prove however that the seller was aware of the defect and this can be difficult. An example of this would be the following: A house has a roof that leaks. Before putting the house on the market, the seller has the ceiling and walls repaired to hide the fact that the roof leaks, without having the actual roof fixed. If the seller does not disclose the fact that the roof leaks then they are maliciously concealing a latent defect. If the buyer can subsequently show that the seller must have been aware of the problem through the fact that they had damage to the walls and ceiling repaired before the sale then the buyer can sue the seller for the cost of having the roof repaired.

Once you've signed an offer to purchase, you are contractually bound. The process is no longer within your control. Hence you cannot simply instruct the conveyancers to halt all paperwork until further notice.

:wtf: that actually made sense. Who are you and what have you done with the king?

 

[ToxicBunny]

if the crack was clearly wallpapered over... by glue etc being in the crack, then its a patent defect that the owner has tried to cover up.

 

[ISP cash cow]

:wtf: that actually made sense. Who are you and what have you done with the king?

He's trolling you by being serious for a change

 

[blunomore]

I remember you were being very difficult with your neighbour when he was negotiating to buy your house: http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php/500734-I-got-my-price-on-my-house?highlight=

So what is happening now is, sadly for you, a little karma coming your way. It's ouch, but that is life for you

I am sure it will be sorted out in the end.

 

[ToxicBunny]

I remember you were being very difficult with your neighbour when he was negotiating to buy your house: http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php/500734-I-got-my-price-on-my-house?highlight=

So what is happening now is, sadly for you, a little karma coming your way. It's ouch, but that is life for you

I am sure it will be sorted out in the end.

She wasn't being difficult.. she didn't "want" to sell.. therefore the deal must be entirely on her terms.

This has nothing to do with karma at all. Either the seller is trying to hide the defect or genuinely didn't know about it... but given my experience with house buying, every seller knows about the big defects in their house.... its just whether its worth pursuing it after you have taken transfer. Honestly, if I had known of some of the defects I would have stopped transfer on the spot until they were sorted out... but after transfer it was just easier and cheaper for me to sort them out myself.

 

[bokka1]

As Humberto said, you are going to have a very difficult time proving that the deceased knew about the cracks and tried to cover it up.

 

[blunomore]

She wasn't being difficult.. she didn't "want" to sell.. therefore the deal must be entirely on her terms.

This has nothing to do with karma at all. Either the seller is trying to hide the defect or genuinely didn't know about it... but given my experience with house buying, every seller knows about the big defects in their house.... its just whether its worth pursuing it after you have taken transfer. Honestly, if I had known of some of the defects I would have stopped transfer on the spot until they were sorted out... but after transfer it was just easier and cheaper for me to sort them out myself.

She was in negotiations with the buyer and his legal representatives and was being very rude to them. She got her price, but was very difficult / insulting. Read the post again and read the comments from the posters on that thread. If you can get what you want, why the need to be rude to people?

That is all in the past now, but life works in strange ways.

 

[ToxicBunny]

She was in negotiations with the buyer and his legal representatives and was being very rude to them. She got her price, but was very difficult / insulting. Read the post again and read the comments from the posters on that thread. If you can get what you want, why the need to be rude to people?

That is all in the past now, but life works in strange ways.

We obviously have different opinions on that. I would have behaved exactly the same way as Celine. There was no need to bring in "external" assistance. It was an attempt to intimidate Celine, and it failed.

 

[I.am.Sam]

humberto for president

 

[supersunbird]

We obviously have different opinions on that. I would have behaved exactly the same way as Celine. There was no need to bring in "external" assistance. It was an attempt to intimidate Celine, and it failed.

I concur.

 

[blunomore]

We obviously have different opinions on that. I would have behaved exactly the same way as Celine. There was no need to bring in "external" assistance. It was an attempt to intimidate Celine, and it failed.

The "external assistance" was legal representation.

In any matter, any of us ( Celine included ) has the right to use a legal representative to assist us. It is perfectly OK. If she felt "ambushed", she could have postponed the meeting.

But as you said, to each his own.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Could you explain to me why he needed legal representation then?

This was the neighbour trying to purchase a property that was not on the market for sale.... why is legal representation required, when a selling price that is acceptable to the current homeowner has not even been reached yet?

 

[blunomore]

Could you explain to me why he needed legal representation then?

This was the neighbour trying to purchase a property that was not on the market for sale.... why is legal representation required, when a selling price that is acceptable to the current homeowner has not even been reached yet?

People use legal reps for various reasons, sometimes it is to protect their interests from a legal perspective, sometimes they simply feel that someone would be better at communicating their needs than they themselves would. I have no idea why he used a legal rep, but it remains his right.

Maybe because I have knowledge of law, it doesn't trouble me as much as it would other people. It is nothing to be scared of, or intimidated by. It is just someone talking on behalf of the buyer. It is not as if they can take her property from her without her consent. The worst that could possibly have happened was that they could have made her an offer that she did not like and in that case she can simply say "no thank you".

 

[ToxicBunny]

No of course not, and I fully agree with you about it being their right...

But when it comes to the kind of "negotiation" that was taking place, it was very clearly an attempt to intimdate, nothing more and nothing less.

 

[bokka1]

Blunomore is right, she was extremely rude to the people without any reason and then she felt glum about it.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Blunomore is right, she was extremely rude to the people without any reason and then she felt glum about it.

You ppl care too much about other peoples feelings.....

 

[Celine]

yay i am able to post again. i had something go wrong and i wasn't able to post since yesterday.

to those who think i was rude to my neighbor because HE wanted my house............get lost. HE wanted my house and HE wanted ME to move out of MY house because HE wanted MY house for HIS parking that HE wants for HIS conference area. do you expect me to just say yes because someone wants my house just like that considering that i have no bond, and the fact that my house is in excellent condition and i have looked around at houses and i what i have found is absolutely shocking for the price that these people want. i think not. my house wasn't on the market thank you very much. so if you want my house for your personal business, then you must pay what i want no matter what it is. if you want it that much then it doesn't matter what the price is you will pay. end of story.

with regards to the halting of the current house, the reason i did this was because the person who was living in the house passed on. the other people who are part owners have no clue what is going on in the house. they did not live in the house. they should be made aware of the facts. this is not the only thing that was discovered that was wrong. when the house was fumigated ALL the guttering and down pipes and facia boards have been destroyed. half the tiles on the roof are now missing. i certainly am not going to foot the bill for this mess. the pest control company don't want to take responsibility for this. i am not going to accept this and pay for this mess. someone has to pay and it's not going to be me.

 

[Seriously]

I remember you were being very difficult with your neighbour when he was negotiating to buy your house: http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php/500734-I-got-my-price-on-my-house?highlight=

So what is happening now is, sadly for you, a little karma coming your way. It's ouch, but that is life for you

I am sure it will be sorted out in the end.

Karma is a beetch for beetches that fight. I disagree and feel that Celine was 100% correct and within her right.
I also agree with her dropping this "prospective" buy as there seems to many cats dead together with the previous owner.