Sign up with Google
Creag
The Boar's Rock
- Joined
- May 19, 2009
- Messages
- 43,526
Ok. Morris works. But who comes into the team as a player of colour (dreaded terminology
)?
-
Ask a question and get free supportUnlock new privileges and see hidden discussionsWin prizes and earn reputation
-
Question of the day ~ How often do you braai?
-
Afristay giveaway.Win a 2-night stay for two people at an establishment of your choice with R1,000 in spending money. Enter here.
South Africa tour of England, May - Aug 2017
- Thread starter Kelerei
- Start date
Ok. Morris works. But who comes into the team as a player of colour (dreaded terminology
)?Well the ICC did. And their opinion is the only one that really matters in this case.
Last edited:
Bowler takes a wicket and gives a send off including screaming **** off after which the batsmen immediately turns around. Do you really need a commentators analysis to tell you what happened?
Pom_in_Pretoria
Active Member
- Joined
- Jul 13, 2017
- Messages
- 31
SA had a chance of winning the last test but for some inexplicable reason they went into the last innings intent on trying to bat out 5 sessions when really they should have attacked the spinners from the start and tried to get them off and the seamers back on...the attitude may well have been different under Faf.
However it was not just the attitude...the batting was pretty awful against the spin throughout and England will be licking their lips at getting at the Jaapies on a proper nasty track that usually has plenty of swing/spin available.
England in 4 days again for me.
However it was not just the attitude...the batting was pretty awful against the spin throughout and England will be licking their lips at getting at the Jaapies on a proper nasty track that usually has plenty of swing/spin available.
England in 4 days again for me.
Last edited:
Baxteen
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Feb 26, 2013
- Messages
- 17,369
if the rumours running around is true, and there is no JP, and no TdB so we can play Morris, then the proteas will take this.
removing JP removes pressure from the openers, as now the middle order is not as weak.
with Faf back to lead the charge, and grounds that offer swing, the protas will take this one.
win the toss, bat out day 1.
bowl eng out by lunch Day 2, go back in, score some quick runs wiht high risk shots at a fast pace.
by lunch Day 3 we are all out with a decent lead.
midway though the mornign session on day 4 eng will all be back in the dressing room, wiht the only real high scoring sessions being in the afternoons.
removing JP removes pressure from the openers, as now the middle order is not as weak.
with Faf back to lead the charge, and grounds that offer swing, the protas will take this one.
win the toss, bat out day 1.
bowl eng out by lunch Day 2, go back in, score some quick runs wiht high risk shots at a fast pace.
by lunch Day 3 we are all out with a decent lead.
midway though the mornign session on day 4 eng will all be back in the dressing room, wiht the only real high scoring sessions being in the afternoons.
WaxLyrical
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2011
- Messages
- 25,353
Hi Outkast. Welcome back.
Dan C
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Nov 21, 2005
- Messages
- 36,651
Dan C
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Nov 21, 2005
- Messages
- 36,651
Hmmm interesting call as I think Morris has more experience and better temperament. But that's just my opinion as I don't know de Bruyn that well.
So the match starts at 12 ?
De Bruyn is a genuine batsman morris is an all rounder, different player. If I want runs I would pick theunis if I want an extra bowler morris.
Game starts at 12 yes.
WaxLyrical
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2011
- Messages
- 25,353
DeBruin is still cutting his teeth so it's either Duck or glory whereas Morris can get you that quick 40 to 50 - and he can bowl.
Creag
The Boar's Rock
- Joined
- May 19, 2009
- Messages
- 43,526
As soon as I read that post, it smacked of a clone of a banned zcf outcast. So spot on!
Agree. Batting needs fibre. At the moment it looks vulnerable. The 3 seamers and spin with part time contributions from TdB and Elgar should be enough. If we can't roll the Poms twice with that, we poo probably done deserve to win.
Pom_in_Pretoria
Active Member
- Joined
- Jul 13, 2017
- Messages
- 31
I am not sure who Outkast is as I am new here..? Was there something in my post that offended you. If so many apologies it was not my intent, especially in my first post.
It was just my truthful observations / analysis inasmuch that I genuinely did think SA had a slight 'chance' of winning when they went into the 2nd innings, I genuinely did think they batted poorly against the spin and I genuinely do think England will win in 4 days again in the 2nd Test on a traditionally difficult wicket.
sand_man
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Jun 4, 2005
- Messages
- 35,844

Graeme Pollock: Transformation is affecting Proteas' performances
AFP*06:54 14/07/2017

London - South Africa great*Graeme Pollock*says the Proteas will have to accept being a "middle of the road" Test side at best if they stick with racial transformation as a key component of selection.
Transformation is designed to cope with the legacy of apartheid, when largely only white players such as Pollock, one of the greatest batsmen in cricket history, were allowed to play for official South Africa sides.*
Pollock accepts players of his era could have done more to help their non-white counterparts, but is concerned the balance has now swung too far in the opposite direction after South Africa "got it right when Graeme Smith was captain" (from 2003 to his retirement in 2014).*
South Africa face England in the second Test at Trent Bridge 1-0 down in a four-match series after a crushing 211-run defeat inside four days at Lord's last week.*
Pollock believes political reasons are undermining South Africa's long-term competitiveness as a Test nation.*
"The major thing is the problem with the politics and interference with the selection of players," Pollock said at a meeting of cricket enthusiasts in London.*
"It's affecting the performance of the side - they don't put the 11 best players on the field.
"It's never going to change. As South Africans, we've got to accept that South Africa are going to be middle of the road in their future Test cricket."*
As of last August, Cricket South Africa defined the transformation policy as one where national teams should include on average and across all formats, six players of colour, of which two must be black African.*
The target at domestic level is a stricter six players of colour per side per match, of which three must be black African.*
Pollock said it was at domestic level where the effects were most noticeable.*
He cited the elevation of white opener Heino Kuhn - out for just one and nine on Test debut at Lord's - as a case in point.*
"You are going to pick a guy like Heino Kuhn, the opening batsman, who got a couple of hundreds in first-class cricket. He's not good enough to play Test cricket.*
"The guys are playing in a bad standard of first-class cricket in South Africa because of the politics and interference in selection," the 73-year-old left-hander added.*
Hampshire's Kyle Abbott and*Rilee Rossouw*are among several players who've forfeited their South Africa careers in order to play for English counties and Pollock said: "There are so many South Africans playing county cricket...the exchange rate (17 South African rand to the pound sterling) is a big factor."*
However, current South Africa captain*Faf du Plessis*insisted on Thursday that transformation could not be used as an excuse for poor performance.*
"Within the team it has never been a challenge, we understand what to do and what to expect and what is best for our country - we've been getting on with it," Du Plessis, who didn't play at Lord's following the birth of his first child, told reporters at Trent Bridge, the venue for Friday's second Test.*
Pollock's own Test career was cut short in 1970, after just 23 matches in which he had already scored 2 256 runs, including seven hundreds, by an anti-apartheid boycott that saw South Africa exiled from official international cricket for over two decades.*
"I thought it would be sorted out before 22 years had passed," he said.*
Graeme Pollock: Transformation is affecting Proteas' performances
AFP*06:54 14/07/2017

London - South Africa great*Graeme Pollock*says the Proteas will have to accept being a "middle of the road" Test side at best if they stick with racial transformation as a key component of selection.
Transformation is designed to cope with the legacy of apartheid, when largely only white players such as Pollock, one of the greatest batsmen in cricket history, were allowed to play for official South Africa sides.*
Pollock accepts players of his era could have done more to help their non-white counterparts, but is concerned the balance has now swung too far in the opposite direction after South Africa "got it right when Graeme Smith was captain" (from 2003 to his retirement in 2014).*
South Africa face England in the second Test at Trent Bridge 1-0 down in a four-match series after a crushing 211-run defeat inside four days at Lord's last week.*
Pollock believes political reasons are undermining South Africa's long-term competitiveness as a Test nation.*
"The major thing is the problem with the politics and interference with the selection of players," Pollock said at a meeting of cricket enthusiasts in London.*
"It's affecting the performance of the side - they don't put the 11 best players on the field.
"It's never going to change. As South Africans, we've got to accept that South Africa are going to be middle of the road in their future Test cricket."*
As of last August, Cricket South Africa defined the transformation policy as one where national teams should include on average and across all formats, six players of colour, of which two must be black African.*
The target at domestic level is a stricter six players of colour per side per match, of which three must be black African.*
Pollock said it was at domestic level where the effects were most noticeable.*
He cited the elevation of white opener Heino Kuhn - out for just one and nine on Test debut at Lord's - as a case in point.*
"You are going to pick a guy like Heino Kuhn, the opening batsman, who got a couple of hundreds in first-class cricket. He's not good enough to play Test cricket.*
"The guys are playing in a bad standard of first-class cricket in South Africa because of the politics and interference in selection," the 73-year-old left-hander added.*
Hampshire's Kyle Abbott and*Rilee Rossouw*are among several players who've forfeited their South Africa careers in order to play for English counties and Pollock said: "There are so many South Africans playing county cricket...the exchange rate (17 South African rand to the pound sterling) is a big factor."*
However, current South Africa captain*Faf du Plessis*insisted on Thursday that transformation could not be used as an excuse for poor performance.*
"Within the team it has never been a challenge, we understand what to do and what to expect and what is best for our country - we've been getting on with it," Du Plessis, who didn't play at Lord's following the birth of his first child, told reporters at Trent Bridge, the venue for Friday's second Test.*
Pollock's own Test career was cut short in 1970, after just 23 matches in which he had already scored 2 256 runs, including seven hundreds, by an anti-apartheid boycott that saw South Africa exiled from official international cricket for over two decades.*
"I thought it would be sorted out before 22 years had passed," he said.*
AfricanTech
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2010
- Messages
- 40,360
Graeme ain't helping with his 'observations'
Those who played cricket during the apartheid era should stfu - those who played post apartheid have the right to opine on the matter.
Those who played cricket during the apartheid era should stfu - those who played post apartheid have the right to opine on the matter.
The whole article wasn't posted, the version on News24 he speaks to the apartheid era players not doing enough to stand up against the system.
I respectfully disagree with the great player myself. For one thing, Kuhn is good enough for test cricket...
AfricanTech
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2010
- Messages
- 40,360
Fair enough.
I disagree with him as well - the first test was not lost due to the players of colour in the team (well, barring that wors JP).
yebocan
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Sep 22, 2005
- Messages
- 14,008
nice ass, but how many chances must be given!
Agent_Smith
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Dec 3, 2010
- Messages
- 18,126
Pity for JP. I've always been a fan of his, and do feel for him. However, the blame lies squarely on the shoulders of the selectors for persisting with him.
WaxLyrical
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2011
- Messages
- 25,353
Yeah Graeme is talking shyte as most players are picked on merit, and even players of colour get dropped. Alviro was dropped before the scandal and was actually a better opener than Cook.
I'd be interested to see how many more tests Bavuma will be given before he gets the axe. He has to come good.
He's average at best, inconsistent and hasn't really solidified his spot.
I suspect JP was given an extended run given his bowling/fielding.