South African Covid-19 News and Discussions 3

Lupus

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I think the MAC (however its structured) needs to sit the fsck down now..
Yeah good idea lets move to level 2 from level 1 where we have the lowest positivity rate, the lowest active cases and such for months. The mythical third wave, gotta keep everyone afraid.
Also does anyone actually remember what level 2 was?
 

Arzy

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I'm actually agreeing with the MAC this time. Pre-empt the cluster **** that is coming by locking us down early.

For clarity:
The ZCC draws a staggering crowd for the annual Easter pilgrimage. Rough calculations estimate that between three and five million pilgrims visit Moria for the Easter pilgrimage. It’s difficult to tell the size of the entire congregation because there are ZCC congregations Zimbabwe, South Africa, Zambia, Mozambique, Botswana, Malawi, the United Kingdom, United States, Australia and other countries. However, South Africa has the largest number of members.

ZCC-Moria-pilgrimage-Easter-768x512.jpg

Polokwane - More than nine million pilgrims are expected to descend on Limpopo ahead of the Easter weekend.

Articles from 2019 and 2013 respectively.
 

Lupus

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I'm actually agreeing with the MAC this time. Pre-empt the cluster **** that is coming by locking us down early.

For clarity:


View attachment 1041243



Articles from 2019 and 2013 respectively.
you think the raising of the level is going to prevent that? I mean even now technically they aren't supposed to have gatherings over 200
 

Arzy

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you think the raising of the level is going to prevent that? I mean even now technically they aren't supposed to have gatherings over 200

We were in full lockdown last year and yes, that prevented it.

I don't think a level 1 or 2 with restrictions of 250 people is going to achieve much though. Unfortunately, intra-provincial travel etc. needs to be blocked again and no gatherings allowed.
 

Lupus

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We were in full lockdown last year and yes, that prevented it.

I don't think a level 1 or 2 with restrictions of 250 people is going to achieve much though. Unfortunately, intra-provincial travel etc. needs to be blocked again and no gatherings allowed.
That was when a lot of people were still all kumbaya and we will flatten the curve, a year later is a completely different story.
 

Arzy

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That was when a lot of people were still all kumbaya and we will flatten the curve, a year later is a completely different story.

So are you proposing that it's a good idea to allow anything between 3m and 9m people from different provinces/countries to get shoved 130 a time into an 80 seater bus for an 8+ hour trip so that they can congregate for a weekend before heading back home?

Our government is clearly not just going to clamp down on religious activities and enforcement means sweet nothing.
 

Lupus

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So are you proposing that it's a good idea to allow anything between 3m and 9m people from different provinces/countries to get shoved 130 a time into an 80 seater bus for an 8+ hour trip so that they can congregate for a weekend before heading back home?

Our government is clearly not just going to clamp down on religious activities and enforcement means sweet nothing.
Are your reading skills limited? Did I propose that? At this point the level doesn't matter, people will do what they will do. Last year it was because the lockdown was only going to be for 3 weeks and everyone was going to be happy and kumbaya. Now the fatigue has set in.
 

Arzy

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Are your reading skills limited? Did I propose that? At this point the level doesn't matter, people will do what they will do. Last year it was because the lockdown was only going to be for 3 weeks and everyone was going to be happy and kumbaya. Now the fatigue has set in.

I actually just don't understand what your standpoint is on this.

I came out in support of a pre-emptive restriction which you seem to dislike. I agree that fatigue has set in and I also stated that a simple move from level 1 to 2 won't achieve anything.

I further stated that we need to block people moving around and stop gatherings. These have nothing to do with levels or fatigue or limiting the number of people at places. My proposal is to block them completely for this period, they simply aren't allowed, so fatigue has got nothing to do with it.

What is your alternative or solution?
 

Lupus

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I actually just don't understand what your standpoint is on this.

I came out in support of a pre-emptive restriction which you seem to dislike. I agree that fatigue has set in and I also stated that a simple move from level 1 to 2 won't achieve anything.

I further stated that we need to block people moving around and stop gatherings. These have nothing to do with levels or fatigue or limiting the number of people at places. My proposal is to block them completely for this period, they simply aren't allowed, so fatigue has got nothing to do with it.

What is your alternative or solution?
A pre-emptive restriction isn't going to do anything, people are going to do what they want now. Currently the restrictions are already no more then 250 for outside and 100 inside, so there won't be a massive multimillion gathering, as we already have restrictions.
Leave it as it is, shifting levels is just going to cause more harm again, as things will need to close that have only just opened, people will lose their jobs and such.
Honestly the whole lockdown thing is stupid, but hey.
 

Arzy

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A pre-emptive restriction isn't going to do anything, people are going to do what they want now. Currently the restrictions are already no more then 250 for outside and 100 inside, so there won't be a massive multimillion gathering, as we already have restrictions.
Leave it as it is, shifting levels is just going to cause more harm again, as things will need to close that have only just opened, people will lose their jobs and such.
Honestly the whole lockdown thing is stupid, but hey.


You'd be surprised at what the congregants feel about that restriction.
 

ToxicBunny

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You'd be surprised at what the congregants feel about that restriction.

And changing the level won't change their feeling or response to that restriction....

Especially with a week and a half to go. Buses will have been booked, places organised etc etc by now.
Changing the levels pre-emptively will be hugely problematic legally as well for the NCCC because it will get challenged in court on an urgent basis and all their previous arguments will be used against them. As much as they have an almost blank cheque to behave as they want, they can't stray too far outside the line or it will bring a bit more legal scrutiny than they need and could actually threaten the whole structure.
 
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I think the MAC (however its structured) needs to sit the fsck down now..

What bollocks is this? The Health Department is right that they will have no basis for restricting alcohol and the like and almost certainly lose in court.
 

Arzy

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And changing the level won't change their feeling or response to that restriction....

Especially with a week and a half to go. Buses will have been booked, places organised etc etc by now.
Changing the levels pre-emptively will be hugely problematic legally as well for the NCCC because it will get challenged in court on an urgent basis and all their previous arguments will be used against them. As much as they have an almost blank cheque to behave as they want, they can't stray too far outside the line or it will bring a bit more legal scrutiny than they need and could actually threaten the whole structure.

Feel like I'm repeating myself here. I don't care about what level they choose to call the restrictions.

The gatherings should not be allowed at all and in order to facilitate this, and peoples fatigue/**** you attitude/lack of enforcement, just stop intra provincial travel again for this period.
 

ToxicBunny

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Feel like I'm repeating myself here. I don't care about what level they choose to call the restrictions.

The gatherings should not be allowed at all and in order to facilitate this, and peoples fatigue/**** you attitude/lack of enforcement, just stop intra provincial travel again for this period.

I don't entirely disagree with you, but I think they need to be highly targeted restrictions and the government won't implement them in an election cycle because the restrictions will directly impact a largish portion of their voting base.

But restricting intra-provincial travel is too much of a sledgehammer approach, the hospitality industry is already on deaths door and needs whatever minimal opportunities are available to stay alive.
 
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