SpaceX starlink in South Africa

zolly

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No, The network claims to have the potential to route traffic via ISLs to create a space path for international traffic at some time in the future when all satellites are equipped with ISLs, preferably laser links. Currently, only a few "test satellites" are quipped like this covering the polar regions because it is those areas that have no alternatives and are not likely to be supported by very large GS networks. The efficiencies are supposedly going to come from very large capacity laser link ISLs. The "switching time" between satellites (especially under loaded conditions), not known.

The will depend on the number of satellites covering the area where you are and the impact again when the network becomes heavily loaded is unknown at this stage. There obviously will be handover issues every time a new satellite takes over your connection.

From microseconds to minutes.

While this is great in theory, what I meant is from someone actually testing it. And yes, as you pointed out, more specifically once it has tested under loaded conditions. I remember when I did a beta test for Web Africa's new network years ago and was amazed about the 155 ping they offered on ADSL. Then the service went live and it shot up to 170/180. Still good at the time, but not what I was hoping for.
 

diesel

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A wild guess, and has pretty much nothing to do with being operational. All to do with CAPACITY, just like every other network in existence.

Exactly the same congestion constraint is going to bite Starlink. There IS NO SUCH THING as a congestion-free network. There is NO way ALL traffic will be routed through the ISLs. Most traffic WILL be routed to the nearest GS and then go terrestrial.
And the weather and power issues are not something to write-off as an almost in-passing comment.

Latency is a FACT of life. It exists in every single network that exists at the moment and will stay with us until someone comes up with a technology that does not obey the current laws of physics.

Congestion cannot be compared , you have wireless networks servicing every cellphone user compared to a satellite network that will have far fewer users and possibly a higher capacity.

Latency is a fact, nobody is saying it will disappear but it will most definitely be reduced. You talk about not obeying the laws of physics , that is not possible but every day new technology comes out that manipulates the laws of physics more efficiently than older tech. no way data traveling through a fibre pipeline routing through multiple hops is going to be quicker than a data beam shot through the vacuum of space.

Results and reviews are being posted daily from users all around the world , lets see how things develop and time will tell whos right and whos wrong.
 

Geoff.D

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While this is great in theory, what I meant is from someone actually testing it. And yes, as you pointed out, more specifically once it has tested under loaded conditions. I remember when I did a beta test for Web Africa's new network years ago and was amazed about the 155 ping they offered on ADSL. Then the service went live and it shot up to 170/180. Still good at the time, but not what I was hoping for.
The current "testers" in the USA are ecstatic by the performance, None of them is currently routing traffic over few ISLs in series. Most of them are going from the terminals up to satellites and straight down to the nearest GS. The euphoria is massive. The let down is going to be equally massive ats some point.
 

Geoff.D

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Congestion cannot be compared , you have wireless networks servicing every cellphone user compared to a satellite network that will have far fewer users and possibly a higher capacity.
Far fewer users: Why? because it costs too much? Possibly higher capacity? Why Becuase it will be not needed? Or, because there will be a limit o available capacity?
When have you seen an operator of a network not push his luck? No, the network providers WILL push their luck just like the RAIN idiots have done. The outcome will be the same, fantastic performance initially and then it will deteriorate to become dodgy at best.
Latency is a fact, nobody is saying it will disappear but it will most definitely be reduced. You talk about not obeying the laws of physics , that is not possible but every day new technology comes out that manipulates the laws of physics more efficiently than older tech. no way data traveling through a fibre pipeline routing through multiple hops is going to be quicker than a data beam shot through the vacuum of space.
You can spoof, disguise manipulate as much as you like, but you cant get away from the inherent latency introduced by distance. And that is not even talking about the added processing delays. which are a mystery at the moment.

More than one person has already shown that the maximum "saving" on latency is going to be about 20 - 30 ms. Big deal!

Results and reviews are being posted daily from users all around the world , lets see how things develop and time will tell whos right and whos wrong.
Those are all low usage euphoric BS. The realities are what we have seen time and time again with ALL mobile radio-based networks. Starlink is just a mobile network in the sky, there is NOTHING different about it w.r.t how the basics work.

Those who ignore the basic facts will always be wrong.
 

SauRoNZA

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Lets agree that we not going to agree about this and at this stage everyone is guessing,

But my guess is that starlink will beat both fibre and 5G in speed and international latencies once its fully operational.

5G has the speed but its downfall is still congestion, also 5G will still need to route through a undersea cable or satellite to connect internationally, this will affect speed and latency. also stability is dependent on weather or power outages etc.

Fibre is stable , fast and well priced but not readily available and still has high"ish latencies depending on your location.

Do remember that 5G is basically doing the same thing Starlink is doing by throwing hundreds of towers at the problem only doing it on the ground.

So if congestion is a concern on 5G it should be an equal concern on Starlink.

And while Starlink could make some international routes faster it’s not really for being better than fibre, but rather for the lack of fibre existing in the same capacity.

When it comes to last mile, Starlink is never going to beat fibre and very likely not 5G either on average.

So ultimately Starlink very well could make both fibre and 5G faster for its backbone infrastructure, but it’s not going to better either for last mile end users.

Also let’s not forget there will never be a Starlink option running or mobile phones directly, so 5G will always win out in that market.

****

And yes there will certainly be outliers, but that’s why we look at averages and majorities.
 

diesel

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Far fewer users: Why? because it costs too much? Possibly higher capacity? Why Becuase it will be not needed? Or, because there will be a limit o available capacity?
When have you seen an operator of a network not push his luck? No, the network providers WILL push their luck just like the RAIN idiots have done. The outcome will be the same, fantastic performance initially and then it will deteriorate to become dodgy at best.

Non argument really ,

What % of south Africa's population do you think is going to fork out $99 per month and the $500 hardware costs?.

Compare that % of south Africa's population with mobile phones that use our local LTE networks.

Why even mention a company like rain?, i dont think rain could launch a firework into space so definately not worth mentioning in the same sentence as starlink.
 

Genisys

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Non argument really ,

What % of south Africa's population do you think is going to fork out $99 per month and the $500 hardware costs?.

Compare that % of south Africa's population with mobile phones that use our local LTE networks.

Why even mention a company like rain?, i dont think rain could launch a firework into space so definately not worth mentioning in the same sentence as starlink.
Pricing isn't Starlinks problem. They have a product. If someone wants it, they pay for it. Its simple as that. At the end of the day you don't see Ferrari changing their cars pricing because people can't justify the price or afford it. People either pay up or they don't get it.
 

diesel

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Pricing isn't Starlinks problem. They have a product. If someone wants it, they pay for it. Its simple as that. At the end of the day you don't see Ferrari changing their cars pricing because people can't justify the price or afford it. People either pay up or they don't get it.
Agreed 100% , I will most definitely pay a premium for a premium service and i intend on going for it. I love the idea of having super fast internet i can take anywhere.
 

ghostRgg

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Agreed 100% , I will most definitely pay a premium for a premium service and i intend on going for it. I love the idea of having super fast internet i can take anywhere.
I would slow down though, you can't take it anywhere yet or for a while as it is address/location locked. They do plan to have a version that can be mobile and moved around though, just not yet or for a while.
 

Geoff.D

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I would slow down though, you can't take it anywhere yet or for a while as it is address/location locked. They do plan to have a version that can be mobile and moved around though, just not yet or for a while.
Address location locked precisely because of regulatory issues.
 

SadIvyParrot

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We have 2 types of satellites, Geo Stationary 'high altitude" and low orbit, Starlink uses low orbit, being in low orbit presents a problem, that is, it is moving way too fast for a dish to lock on and keep the signal, moving to High Orbit, Geo Stationary has the problem of distance, it takes the signal way too long to finish the transmit up to satellite and back down to a ground station...

So the clever folks at Starlink made the decision that low orbit is better, and to solve the problem of fast moving, hard to track satellites, you flood the low earth track with satellites, this means that they are switching from one to another to the ground station in a very short time...

This has the benefit of always being there? Geo Stationary is just too far from the earth, it has only 1 main function that is wide beam broadcasting, you can park the satellite in 1 location above Africa, and the transmit beam reach is wide enough to cover a huge section.

There is a huge benefit to low earth orbit, the signal can only move so fast, I am sure there is a technical barrier to the top speed. The gap between fibre costs and Starlink is shrinking, right now it is 1:3, the lowest fibre package is 1/3 the cost of Starlink, until April 2021, this was 1 to 5.... So it is quite possible than within the next 2 years, it would be viable to abandon Rural Fibre and instead install Starlink...
 

Nod

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Source: https://www.teslarati.com/starlink-moving-vehicles-tesla-fcc-application/
In its FCC application, SpaceX aimed to acquire a blanket license authorizing the operation of end-user earth stations for deployment dubbed as Vehicle-Mounted Earth Stations (“VMESs”), Earth Stations on Vessels (“ESVs”), and Earth Stations Aboard Aircraft (“ESAAs”). Collectively called Earth Stations in Motion (“ESIMs”), these stations would have the capability to bring internet connectivity to moving vehicles like cars, ships, or even aircraft
 

konfab

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The current "testers" in the USA are ecstatic by the performance, None of them is currently routing traffic over few ISLs in series. Most of them are going from the terminals up to satellites and straight down to the nearest GS. The euphoria is massive. The let down is going to be equally massive ats some point.
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ilikepi

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I don't understand where all this hate for Starlink comes from, they are going to fill a gap in the market that fibre operators have no intention of filling, many people, even those living in suburban areas still don't have access to fibre, and wireless networks are over taxed, I welcome another competitor to the market....
 
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