State capture inquiry begins

PrimeSteak

Executive Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2020
Messages
7,624
They (ANC) were building firepools baby!

People should be ashamed voting ANC...
What were they doing, you ask? They looted and destroyed along with Zuma, the Guptas and other cronies to the country's detriment.

The whole ****ing party was complicit. If I'm remembering correctly in one of the previous parts of the Zondo Report, it is said that the ANC as a party was complicit. I may be misremembering
 

Gordon_R

Honorary Master
Joined
Jul 5, 2009
Messages
19,897
BBC version:
While this report confirms what many South Africans had long suspected, the impact of seeing it in black and white cannot be overstated.

After years of denials from Zuma and his associates, this is in a sense a collective vindication.

But with it comes a deep sense of betrayal - that those who South Africans trusted to look after them after the brutality of apartheid, instead looked after themselves.
 

Fulcrum29

Honorary Master
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
50,317
The DA is now in the view that those implicated must be criminally charged, and Mazzone said that she laid charges against every name mentioned (those implicated). Solidarity beat them to this some weeks ago by laying criminal charges against 21 alleged state capturers.

Mazzone was interviewed by eNCA,


the DA launched a dashboard some time ago, https://www.da.org.za/statecaptureconsequences, but there is not much on the site.

It is the NPA which must speak up.
 

PrimeSteak

Executive Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2020
Messages
7,624
The DA is now in the view that those implicated must be criminally charged
That's the right view. Surely, those implicated can't just walk away scot-free from this?
, and Mazzone said that she laid charges against every name mentioned (those implicated). Solidarity beat them to this some weeks ago by laying criminal charges against 21 alleged state capturers.
Cool. Hopefully, their cases succeed with the help of the Zondo Report.
It is the NPA which must speak up.
Highly agree, the ball is in their court now.
 

Fulcrum29

Honorary Master
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
50,317
That's the right view. Surely, those implicated can't just walk away scot-free from this?

Yes, but the onus is on the state to pursue these prosecutions. Like Solidariteit, the DA is taking the initiative, but why do they need to take the initiative when this responsibility is on the state? The public needs to question this, knowing that there is existing cooperation,


DA welcomes long-overdue regulations allowing Zondo Commission to share information with law-enforcement agencies​

29 Jul 2020 in News

The Democratic Alliance (DA) welcomes the long-overdue amendments to regulations which now allows the Zondo Commission of Inquiry into State Capture to share information, records or documents directly with any state law-enforcement agency in South Africa.

the police and intelligence services, and the NPA, have no excuse to delay.

Cool. Hopefully, their cases succeed with the help of the Zondo Report.

Hope? It must, but their cases are likely to be taken under a collective consideration, however, the DA have opened cases against all who are implicated to this point. I think Mazzone said 34 or 44, I can't remember.

Highly agree, the ball is in their court now.

Tick-tock.
 

TheChamp

Honorary Master
Joined
Feb 26, 2011
Messages
48,943
That's the right view. Surely, those implicated can't just walk away scot-free from this?

Cool. Hopefully, their cases succeed with the help of the Zondo Report.

Highly agree, the ball is in their court now.
They might walk away scot free, being implicated doesn't make you guilty, we should not let the fact that Zondo commission was not a court escape us, so at best those implicated have cases to answer to.
 

PrimeSteak

Executive Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2020
Messages
7,624
Yes, but the onus is on the state to pursue these prosecutions. Like Solidariteit, the DA is taking the initiative, but why do they need to take the initiative when this responsibility is on the state? The public needs to question this, knowing that there is existing cooperation,




the police and intelligence services, and the NPA, have no excuse to delay.
We know how it goes with our justice system. I mean the 12 conspirators behind the July Riots last year weren't even prosecuted?

So, sorry that I don't trust the state to do anything unless forced/encouraged.
Hope? It must, but their cases are likely to be taken under a collective consideration, however, the DA have opened cases against all who are implicated to this point. I think Mazzone said 34 or 44, I can't remember.
Cool, and I agree that it must. But you never know...
 

PrimeSteak

Executive Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2020
Messages
7,624
being implicated doesn't make you guilty
It kinda does in an informal way? I mean if you were implicated in doing something, then chances are quite high that you did do it?
we should not let the fact that Zondo commission was not a court escape us, so at best those implicated have cases to answer to.
Everyone knows it's not a court but the findings are just too damning (in fact it confirmed what many knew/suspected for years), at this point the cases themselves can be considered formalities with the sheer volume of evidence against the implicated in that report alone.
 

TheChamp

Honorary Master
Joined
Feb 26, 2011
Messages
48,943
It kinda does in an informal way? I mean if you were implicated in doing something, then chances are quite high that you did do it?

Everyone knows it's not a court but the findings are just too damning (in fact it confirmed what many knew/suspected for years), at this point the cases themselves can be considered formalities with the sheer volume of evidence against the implicated in that report alone.
Unfortunately not, unless you haven't been following how court cases work.

If you remove the sensationalist news headlines and reporting you will find that there is still a lot of work to be done on those cases and putting a solid case before a judge is not as easy as it sounds, look at the manner in which Vytjie Mentoor crumbled at the commission and couldn't remember names and ask yourself what would have happened in court with the defence lawyers grilling her.
 
Last edited:

ToxicBunny

Oi! Leave me out of this...
Joined
Apr 8, 2006
Messages
107,146
We know how it goes with our justice system. I mean the 12 conspirators behind the July Riots last year weren't even prosecuted?

So, sorry that I don't trust the state to do anything unless forced/encouraged.

Cool, and I agree that it must. But you never know...
You mean the 12 escape goats who were chosen to try obfuscate the high ranking anc officials who were actually behind it?
 

TheChamp

Honorary Master
Joined
Feb 26, 2011
Messages
48,943
We know how it goes with our justice system. I mean the 12 conspirators behind the July Riots last year weren't even prosecuted?
I haven't followed the cases but there were prosecutions, I read some time ago that Sphitiphiti Evaluator was acquitted.
 

Howdy

Expert Member
Joined
Jul 26, 2021
Messages
3,946
The state capture continues ...

The Master’s Office – probably one of the most powerful institutions in the country that you rarely, if ever, think of. It’s here that deceased, insolvent estates and trusts are processed. But something has been amiss in the liquidations division, and recently two high-ranking officials were suspended in the Master’s Office in Pretoria. Simply doing their jobs, they say their suspensions are based on trumped-up charges and allege there are powerful political forces that want them gone. Carte Blanche goes in search of answers as more high-profile state capture companies fold.

 

Fulcrum29

Honorary Master
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
50,317
I am a bit concerned at the moment, especially now with the political moves made against Zondo. Something is brewing at the JSC and SCA. The EFF is making a big play, and it won't bode addressing state capture any good.
 

surface

Honorary Master
Joined
Oct 23, 2006
Messages
22,524

Fulcrum29

Honorary Master
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
50,317

Opposition parties lobby for a separate State Capture parliamentary committee​

Opposition parties in Parliament have urged Speaker Nosiviwe Mapisa-Nqakula to exclude the ANC from any committees that will look into allegations of State Capture against MPs.​

n their first meeting with National Assembly Speaker Nosiviwe Mapisa-Nqakula, opposition party representatives suggested that a committee be established to deal solely with State Capture. They took a firm stance that the ANC be excluded from the structure as its members are implicated in the State Capture report.

Party representatives in attendance felt it would be unfair for the governing party to be included as it would be likely to have the most seats in the committee. They also said it was not fair for the ANC to be referee and player in the committees as this would result in many of its members not being held accountable.

They appealed to the Speaker to act swiftly in establishing a separate committee that would focus on State Capture, adding that Parliament’s joint ethics committee would need to be assisted.

They held a meeting with Mapisa-Nqakula on Wednesday afternoon to discuss concerns about the workings of Parliament. Representatives from the African Transformation Movement, Al Jama-ah, Congress of the People, DA, EFF, Freedom Front Plus, IFP, National Freedom Party and United Democratic Movement were part of the discussions.

President Cyril Ramaphosa has been mandated to submit an implementation plan to Parliament in response to the State Capture report. However, the sentiment at the meeting was that the National Assembly should go ahead with its own plan.

The Speaker did not say which direction she would take, but reiterated that she had already sent letters to those implicated to inform them that the joint ethics committee would conduct a probe.

In my view, Cyril should still be mandated to submit an implementation plan, the National Assembly's sentiment shouldn’t impact this at all, directions are needed.

More commissions... It is probably the right thing to do since the state which can't be separated is being indecisive, but say this new commission also has members with shared interests involving state capture or those who are implicated?

All I can see is colossal resources being wasted.
 

PrimeSteak

Executive Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2020
Messages
7,624
In my view, Cyril should still be mandated to submit an implementation plan, the National Assembly's sentiment shouldn’t impact this at all, directions are needed.
It seems like it's a commission for state capture specifically for Parly and involved MPs?
More commissions... It is probably the right thing to do since the state which can't be separated is being indecisive, but say this new commission also has members with shared interests involving state capture or those who are implicated?
Well, if the ANC is excluded then I don't see that there'll be any/many members who do have such agendas?

All in all, I see it as a good thing, if the opposition parties can handle it, then I think we might go somewhere.
 
Top