The DA is in total crisis.

[JohnStarr]

It was never a crime against humanity. Many countries did not support that viewpoint. Funny that the communists raised this at the time they were trying to completely take over Africa. It is always interesting to know the circumstances around certain decisions.

Fact is that 'democracy's aids stance' killed many more black people in a year than apartheid did in its lifetime. Fact is that apartheid's benefits is much more than its negatives ever were. thanks to apartheid the ANC got Africa's powerhouse, top economy, pristine infrastructure, etc. Now it is all falling apart.

It's the concept of separating people on racev and disenfranchising them completely in life. Support it all you will...

 

[ToxicBunny]

It was never a crime against humanity. Many countries did not support that viewpoint. Funny that the communists raised this at the time they were trying to completely take over Africa. It is always interesting to know the circumstances around certain decisions.

Fact is that 'democracy's aids stance' killed many more black people in a year than apartheid did in its lifetime. Fact is that apartheid's benefits is much more than its negatives ever were. thanks to apartheid the ANC got Africa's powerhouse, top economy, pristine infrastructure, etc. Now it is all falling apart.

Sorry to burst your bubble there son

Crime of apartheid - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[surface]

It was never a crime against humanity. Many countries did not support that viewpoint. Funny that the communists raised this at the time they were trying to completely take over Africa. It is always interesting to know the circumstances around certain decisions.

Fact is that 'democracy's aids stance' killed many more black people in a year than apartheid did in its lifetime. Fact is that apartheid's benefits is much more than its negatives ever were. thanks to apartheid the ANC got Africa's powerhouse, top economy, pristine infrastructure, etc. Now it is all falling apart.

wow. King of apartheid apologist.

 

[rambo919]

There are different levels to crimes against humanity. Farm murders are just that for instance. Disenfranching races and not allowing them to vote or have a fair shot at employment (look at what BBBEE has become now as a direct result of that); death squads to wipe out dissidents against the state...that's why we had a Truth & Reconciliation Committee.
Apartheid was always short-sighted and always idiotic. Which is why the rest of the world looked upon us with scorn. Which is why there were sanctions that eventually broke Apartheid.

You either supported Apartheid, or you didn't. If you didn't then nothing makes sense about it and you cannot defend a single aspect of it. The opposite is then true if you did. There was NO terror when Apartheid was started, but continue to believe that.

That is religion speaking not logic.

 

[ForceFate]

wow. King of apartheid apologist.

Lol

 

[rambo919]

wow. King of apartheid apologist.

shush king of ANC apologist

 

[Vrotappel]

Sorry to burst your bubble there son

Crime of apartheid - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

No bubble to burst. Many disagreed Mostly countries considered civilized.

Seventy-six other countries subsequently signed on, but a number of nations, including western democracies, have neither signed nor ratified the ICSPCA, including Canada, France, Germany, Israel, Italy, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom, Australia, New Zealand and the United States. In explanation of the US vote against the convention, Ambassador Clarence Clyde Ferguson Jr. said: "[W]e cannot...accept that apartheid can in this manner be made a crime against humanity. Crimes against humanity are so grave in nature that they must be meticulously elaborated and strictly construed under existing international law..."

 

[Vrotappel]

wow. King of apartheid apologist.

Wow, such magnificent insight. I stated that it was not a crime against humanity and that it brought a lot of benefits. If that makes me an apartheid apologist so be it. Fact is if we did not have apartheid this country would have failed decades ago like the rest of Africa.

 

[ForceFate]

 

[ToxicBunny]

No bubble to burst. Many disagreed Mostly countries considered civilized.

Umm I was referring to the Rome statute and the icc definition.

 

[Tokolotshe]

Umm I was referring to the Rome statute and the icc definition.

That was 2002. We as a country had abolished it 10 years previously. Just saying.

But while on this topic: Plenty of other goodies that are considered a crime against humanity, not mentioned too widely. Consider EWC. The ANC be like ...

 

[rietrot]

You either supported Apartheid, or you didn't. If you didn't then nothing makes sense about it and you cannot defend a single aspect of it. The opposite is then true if you did. There was NO terror when Apartheid was started, but continue to believe that.

This is just false.
The logical progression is very clear and understandable for anyone that knows our history.

It makes perfect sense how we got here. Like many things in history there is moral wrongs but not much logical errors in the decisionmaking. So it makes sense

Not everything is black or white.

If you don't understand how the identity politics that got us to Apartheid works, but you are using that same identity politics today we are just going to repeat history.

 

[JohnStarr]

This is just false.
The logical progression is very clear and understandable for anyone that knows our history.

It makes perfect sense how we got here. Like many things in history there is moral wrongs but not much logical errors in the decisionmaking. So it makes sense

Not everything is black or white.

If you don't understand how the identity politics that got us to Apartheid works, but you are using that same identity politics today we are just going to repeat history.

We will...thanks to mistakes made in the past. You surely cannot condone what was done. If you defend that, then it's a moral stance and incorrect. Hell, if you have children I am sure you'd be outraged if the same happened to them.
Anyways, no getting any concrete affirmations on your stance as things are now. Just wishy-washy areas of grey.

 

[JohnStarr]

That is religion speaking not logic.

Nope...

 

[JohnStarr]

Wow, such magnificent insight. I stated that it was not a crime against humanity and that it brought a lot of benefits. If that makes me an apartheid apologist so be it. Fact is if we did not have apartheid this country would have failed decades ago like the rest of Africa.

No benefits for non-whites. And as a result we, who had parents who had to work for what they had because they weren't part of that NP/voter elite, are still tarred-and-feathered.

 

[rietrot]

No benefits for non-whites. And as a result we, who had parents who had to work for what they had because they weren't part of that NP/voter elite, are still tarred-and-feathered.

That also false. There was many benefits, just not the same benefits.

You are the doing the tar and feathering, then you want to complain about it. Lol

 

[rambo919]

Nope...

All or nothing, total condemnation or total approval..... it's religious virtue signalling.

 

[rambo919]

Umm I was referring to the Rome statute and the icc definition.

That would require one to accept the authority of global institutions.... not all of us are globalists and thus globalist opinions mean nothing to us especially when such opinions exist solely to enforce globalist power.

Put differently those institutions will call anything a "crime" if it profits them.

 

[rambo919]

(PDF) The Role of the Rome Statute in the Criminalization of Apartheid

PDF | The article challenges the assertion that the apartheid system in South Africa was a crime against humanity under customary international law... | Find, read and cite all the research you need on ResearchGate

www.researchgate.net

The article challenges the assertion that the apartheid system in South Africa was a crime against humanity under customary international law giving rise to individual responsibility prior to the drafting of the 1998 Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court. The article also examines the role of the Rome Statute in the criminalization of apartheid and assesses the current status of the crime of apartheid in customary international law with particular reference to the principle of legality (nullum crimen, nulla poena sine lege). Nothing in the article should be read as condoning the gross violations of human rights that resulted from the policies of apartheid in South Africa in any way.

My takeaway being (ignoring my distrust of any globalist institution) even under international law Aparheid was never a "crime against humanity" because that particular law was only drafted after it had already ended. And then even after the implementation of this new law was spotty at best.

"Crimes against humanity" in practice is whatever the strongest authorities deem them to be and thus they are in practice a total fiction.

Nazi Germany was a crime against humanity, Khmer Rouge was a crime against humanity, USSR was a crime against humanity, the French Revolution was a crime against humanity..... when compared to these hell's on earth Apartheid was a paradise. You cannot have a literal crime against humanity without creating hell on earth.... during Apartheid we had trouble keeping migrants out..... who exactly fights to get INTO hell?

 

[rambo919]

If you don't understand how the identity politics that got us to Apartheid works, but you are using that same identity politics today we are just going to repeat history.

One must however differentiate between tribalism and identity politics. The former is an actual identity, the latter synthesizes a new identity to replace a real one.

Apartheid was tribalism not identity politics... though to a degree yes there was also identity politics involved with an attempt to merge tribes here and there into new identities with uncertain levels of success still to this day.

There was more success merging the various Afrikaner tribes than there was merging the English with the Afrikaner for example.