The one “Please Call Me” question Vodacom refuses to answer

DJ...

Banned
Joined
Jan 24, 2007
Messages
70,287
It's quite simple, really: Makate conceptualised the idea - he did not invent it. Vodacom began to build it. By law, MTN invented it. The likelihood that both providers came up with such a non-core service, which was quite arbitrary and unique in the market, at exactly the same times with almost identical concepts using the same terminology, is nigh on impossible.


Now put on your tin-foil hats: We know that Makate conceptualised the idea first but is not the inventor. Either Vodacom wasn't the only group he sold the idea to, or there was in all likelihood some corporate espionage going on at the time and MTN had more resources to throw at this, from both legal and dev. The fact that MTN didn't sue is a very odd one for me to accept without contemplating that they maybe, knowingly, accepted the IP from a Vodacom employee and were aware that the Vodacom employee had sold the concept to Vodacom bosses. If this is the case, it's plausible that Makate had no right to release this idea to MTN under any circumstances and MTN were aware of this. And if you look at how this has played out, everyone is a winner in the end, as VC retain profits without paying the IP holder, MTN retain rights and full IP, and Makate gets his share as well. Perhaps there's no need to stir this hornet's nest much further? :D
 

Emjay

Executive Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2005
Messages
9,463
It's an interesting idea. It has a little bit of a conspiracy theory to it though. Vodacom are not winners in my mind. I still think they were trying to protect Knott-craig's reputation.
 

falcon786

Executive Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2011
Messages
9,988
It's an interesting idea. It has a little bit of a conspiracy theory to it though. Vodacom are not winners in my mind. I still think they were trying to protect Knott-craig's reputation.
Well I do think he is a very shrewd business person but if that's the exact passage quoted from his book then it's clear that he does not explicitly claim the idea as his own alone.

Hard to pin his claim as a lie based on an ambiguous passage like that alone.
 

DJ...

Banned
Joined
Jan 24, 2007
Messages
70,287
It's an interesting idea. It has a little bit of a conspiracy theory to it though. Vodacom are not winners in my mind. I still think they were trying to protect Knott-craig's reputation.
If they beat Makate in court (and know that he gave the info to MTN) they'd have had a case for the IP and the tables would have turned heavily in their favour. Hence why MTN and VC perhaps previously agreed not to enforce the IP rights so quickly. If MTN lost it, it would have been catastrophic for them and they'd have come out of this looking something awful, had they enforced the IP.

Instead, with Masake winning his case, MTN retain IP but don't take legal action against VC who in turn don't play the IP-secret trading card. Makate gets a small cut. Easy-peasy...:D
 

JustAsk

Expert Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2007
Messages
2,937
The fact that MTN didn't sue is a very odd one for me to accept without contemplating that they maybe, knowingly, accepted the IP from a Vodacom employee and were aware that the Vodacom employee had sold the concept to Vodacom bosses.
A more plausible explanation would be that it would've been shortsighted for MTN to sue as "please call me's" generates call backs (and therefor revenue) for both networks.

I'm also of the opinion that these networks don't patent these "services" for exclusive use but simply to keep the other guy from patenting it.
 

Emjay

Executive Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2005
Messages
9,463
A more plausible explanation would be that it would've been shortsighted for MTN to sue as "please call me's" generates call backs (and therefor revenue) for both networks.

I'm also of the opinion that these networks don't patent these "services" for exclusive use but simply to keep the other guy from patenting it.
DJ..., you know how to weave a good story. But the most simple explanation is usually the right one. JustAsk raises a very valid point. Also, proving damages or equitable payout (the Makate case and a hypothetical case between Vodacom vs MTN) is/would be very difficult.

Also, registering current patents also gives the holder some sort of comfort for spinoff inventions that use the underlying technology.
 

Ancalagon

Honorary Master
Joined
Feb 23, 2010
Messages
16,781
It's quite simple, really: Makate conceptualised the idea - he did not invent it. Vodacom began to build it. By law, MTN invented it. The likelihood that both providers came up with such a non-core service, which was quite arbitrary and unique in the market, at exactly the same times with almost identical concepts using the same terminology, is nigh on impossible.


Now put on your tin-foil hats: We know that Makate conceptualised the idea first but is not the inventor. Either Vodacom wasn't the only group he sold the idea to, or there was in all likelihood some corporate espionage going on at the time and MTN had more resources to throw at this, from both legal and dev. The fact that MTN didn't sue is a very odd one for me to accept without contemplating that they maybe, knowingly, accepted the IP from a Vodacom employee and were aware that the Vodacom employee had sold the concept to Vodacom bosses. If this is the case, it's plausible that Makate had no right to release this idea to MTN under any circumstances and MTN were aware of this. And if you look at how this has played out, everyone is a winner in the end, as VC retain profits without paying the IP holder, MTN retain rights and full IP, and Makate gets his share as well. Perhaps there's no need to stir this hornet's nest much further? :D
If he conceptualized the idea first, he is the inventor. Invention refers to the process of idea origination and innovation refers to the implementation of ideas in a commercial setting. Makate invented it, MTN were the first to patent the innovation and bring it to market.
 

DJ...

Banned
Joined
Jan 24, 2007
Messages
70,287
If he conceptualized the idea first, he is the inventor. Invention refers to the process of idea origination and innovation refers to the implementation of ideas in a commercial setting. Makate invented it, MTN were the first to patent the innovation and bring it to market.
If you say so...
 

Swa

Honorary Master
Joined
May 4, 2012
Messages
24,484
Who invented it is really irrelevant. The only thing that matters is who gave Vodacom the idea. Vodacom has never really denied it to be Makate. The one question they don't want to answer is how much it has made.

A more plausible explanation would be that it would've been shortsighted for MTN to sue as "please call me's" generates call backs (and therefor revenue) for both networks.

I'm also of the opinion that these networks don't patent these "services" for exclusive use but simply to keep the other guy from patenting it.
Yup, the most likely reason they patented it. Also "please call me" hardly counts as an invention that can be patented. Would probably not have stood up in court.
 

sasasa

New Member
Joined
May 6, 2016
Messages
1
I totally agree with DJ, this Ari kahn guy is not telling us the truth, some one from Vodacom advised Kahn to go an register the "pls call me" idea an claim it as his own. how come mtn and vodacom conceptualize this idea almost at the same time.
 
Top