The Problem With Africa's Borders

thestaggy

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It is widely accepted that Europeans messed up when they arbitrarily divided Africa among themselves, sowing the seeds for decades of violence. I came across this video and the creator attempts to find out if - using the emergence of European nations on ethnic, linguistic and religious lines as a blueprint - Africa could('ve) been drawn up in a more logical a peaceful way.


At the end of the day it seems things could've been better but an age old conflict over resources would've always been a source of conflict. And while the creator of the video really put some effort in, he left out the nomadic pasturalists that frequently come in to contact with farmers. These people cannot be restricted by borders, no matter where the lines are.
 

Lupus

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It's actually a problem with borders in general, for some reason man has decided we need to have these artificial things between "countries" to identify us.
This has caused wars all over the world, yet does it get fixed noooooo, just new borders are drawn up.
 

thestaggy

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It's actually a problem with borders in general, for some reason man has decided we need to have these artificial things between "countries" to identify us.
This has caused wars all over the world, yet does it get fixed noooooo, just new borders are drawn up.
The video explores this, using Germany as an example.

The myriad German states were squabbling among one another as well as being used as pawns between major powers (France, Austria and Prussia). Once united along common lines - cultural, linguistic and religious - Germany emerged as a cohesive nation, post-WW2 partition aside as that split was not of German will.

There is a valid argument for borders as long as it keeps people that identify with one another together. In fact, the ramifications of Versailles forcing Germans to live in other countries would later cause Europe a lot of problems.
 

Lupus

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The video explores this, using Germany as an example.

The myriad German states were squabbling among one another as well as being used as pawns between major powers (France, Austria and Prussia). Once united along common lines - cultural, linguistic and religious - Germany emerged as a cohesive nation, post-WW2 partition aside as that split was not of German will.

There is a valid argument for borders as long as it keeps people that identify with one another together. In fact, the ramifications of Versailles forcing Germans to live in other countries would later cause Europe a lot of problems.
Well this is the thing, there needs to be more cohesion, if similar minded people get together they can prosper or fail to their own whims. The problem with a lot of man made borders is they've mixed different mindsets of people and this is causing the issues.
 

rambo919

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Doesnt this ignore the fact that the whole of africa had constant raiding or wars before the colonial era and the europeans actually had to do a LOT of pacification when it came to inter-tribal conflicts?
 

Bobbin

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I don't see how one can move to any extreme...

It seems impossible to have a one-world government, where the world is essentially one big border. Because there is no way to serve the interests of multiple cultures, morals and self-identified collectives all at once. You could democratically elect a OWG, but good luck keeping the peace. Or am I wrong?

It seems impossible to induce complete anarchy and obliterate all borders as well. Because human nature will see them rise again, from single properties to communities to towns to countries. All social life is territorial where safety and security is concerned.

But there is also strong resistance to secession and creating new borders when people want or need them. We're just stuck in a sort of limbo it seems. We won't even entertain a dynamic approach to the problem, at least not without force and violence.

No idea what the answer is.
 

Bobbin

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forbid usury, permit trade
How do I forbid it?

I can't have my say with anything in this world save a single vote against potentially millions.

If I want to secede, for example, nobody will care.
 

saturnz

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How do I forbid it?

I can't have my say with anything in this world save a single vote against potentially millions.

If I want to secede, for example, nobody will care.
oh yes I forgot you haven't got free will
 

rambo919

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I don't see how one can move to any extreme...

It seems impossible to have a one-world government, where the world is essentially one big border. Because there is no way to serve the interests of multiple cultures, morals and self-identified collectives all at once. You could democratically elect a OWG, but good luck keeping the peace. Or am I wrong?
The answer is an easy extreme, global genocide (either communal violence or via plague) reducing the number to what was it 2 billion? When all nations are in tatters the strongest can easily rise and force them into unity "for their own good" and most will be so traumatized they will fall for it.

You don't even have to cause the reduction you just have to fan it on and then later take advantage.
 

grok

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Why blame man when religion is clearly to blame?
In the bible for example, God decided to tribalize us at the tower of Babel already.
If you fight it you'll probably go hell, lol!
 

Prawnapple

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Why blame man when religion is clearly to blame?
In the bible for example, God decided to tribalize us at the tower of Babel already.
If you fight it you'll probably go hell, lol!
To OP, great vid.

As per the vid, this is indeed an issue with religion and tradition. Definitely not going to be solved by forbidding Usury and allowing free trade. They don't even have enough access to enough food and water and you're worried about Usury? @saturnz . Some tribes who share a country with other tribes, don't even want to trade with each other, let alone those from different countries.
 

etienne_marais

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It's actually a problem with borders in general, for some reason man has decided we need to have these artificial things between "countries" to identify us.
This has caused wars all over the world, yet does it get fixed noooooo, just new borders are drawn up.
Ready to give up English for Mandarin or German or French or Spanish perhaps ? Ready to sacrifice your worldview, cosmology (conscious and subconscious), historical perspective, social norms, values, ethics and even eventually political views ? Sorry man, the world is not a rainbow fairy playground where people just get along automatically.
 

Lupus

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Ready to give up English for Mandarin or German or French or Spanish perhaps ? Ready to sacrifice your worldview, cosmology (conscious and subconscious), historical perspective, social norms, values, ethics and even eventually political views ? Sorry man, the world is not a rainbow fairy playground where people just get along automatically.
Those are artificial social constructs over the years.
 
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