The true impact of electric cars on the environment

Jet-Fighter7700 said:
and what happens with the charging time? are people prepared to sit and wait a hour with a supercharger?

or how will people cope when the heat decreases the range and makes he batteries conk out sooner.
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Why would people be waiting for an hour to charge?

Most people (here at least) who have EVs have a home charger. So the car is charged overnight. It would be on long road trips where an hour break would be welcomed that you’d need to wait.
 
To see the TRUE impact of an electric vehicle, just wait until one bursts into flames - either spontaneously due to an electrical malfunction, or as a result of a collision or accident, and witness the huge cloud of toxic fumes it generates into the surrounding atmosphere, what's involved in extinguishing the conflagration, and how it needs to be safely disposed off afterwards... ;)

It makes a mid-2010s VW 'Clean Diesel' car look like a way better choice for 'Saving the Planet'... ;)
 
Napalm2880 said:
What doesn't get talked about enough is what happens to old EV batteries. You can leave an ICE vehicle rust in a scrapheap but EV batteries will have to be safely disposed of. Very little mention of this in the media.
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Nah dude. That's like saying gold bars need to be safely disposed of.

An EV battery that's as dead as a doornail - Is worth plenty. Some chemistries less so, but then - They also contain less heavy metals. Which is the primary concern with typical Lithium Ion battery disposal. How to get rid of all those concentrated and highly valuable heavy metals. Oh dear. Whoever would be willing to take care of it? Not the type of thing you want in your drinking water - More the type of thing you can only hope to be privileged enough to be a bulk seller of..
 
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The Trutherizer said:
Nah dude. That's like saying gold bars need to be safely disposed of.

An EV battery that's as dead as a doornail - Is worth plenty. Some chemistries less so, but then - They also contain less heavy metals. Which is the primary concern with typical Lithium Ion battery disposal. How to get rid of all those concentrated and highly valuable heavy metals. Oh dear. Whoever would be willing to take care of it? Not the type of thing you want in your drinking water - More the type of thing you can only hope to be privileged enough to be a bulk seller of..
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Wait until the thieving masses find out how lucrative EV batteries are - they'll stop hacksawing off the catalytic converters of ICE vehicles, in favour of stealing the ENTIRE battery pack from the underside of parked EVs, so scrap dealers can ship them back to China for recycling... ;)
 
The article correctly uses the entire cradle to grave lifecycle for comparing the various types of cars. It can also be seen in the article that the manufacture of EVs makes a significant contribution, a lot of which comes from the materials used in the batteries. This can be partly mitigated by policies mandating the use of child labour in the mining of the minerals. Children are smaller than adults and therefore have a lower per-person carbon contribution to the process, thereby making the material production cleaner.
 
Ivan Leon said:
To see the TRUE impact of an electric vehicle, just wait until one bursts into flames - either spontaneously due to an electrical malfunction, or as a result of a collision or accident, and witness the huge cloud of toxic fumes it generates into the surrounding atmosphere, what's involved in extinguishing the conflagration, and how it needs to be safely disposed off afterwards... ;)

It makes a mid-2010s VW 'Clean Diesel' car look like a way better choice for 'Saving the Planet'... ;)
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EVs don't burn like ICE vehicles.

The Swedish Civil Contingencies Agency (MSB) reported 23 fires in 611,000 EVs during 2022, or 0.004 per cent in a year, which makes it 20 times less likely to happen than ICE car fires, which burned 3,400 times in 4.4 million cars, or 0.08 per cent. MSB has also recently proven a new way to extinguish battery fires fast.

 
Napalm2880 said:
Didn't know you could still recycle batteries that had completely failed. Thanks
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Yeah. The composition/profile of materials (at the elemental/atomic level) does not change. Otherwise they would qualify to be called nuclear batteries. Just different molecular arrangements than when new. i.e. Chemistry.
 
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Napalm2880 said:
Would be intesting to know what percentage actually gets recycled. I can't imagine accident damaged batteries are recycled but I could be wrong.
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Depends on the scrapping protocols.

If the policy is to drop them off somewhere where nobody cares if they catch fire, then no. Wasteful, dirty, potentially costly... But no. If the policy is to process them (mechanical separation of components and basic disposal), to the point where what remains is safe, then that actually makes recycling easier.

Keep in mind that the novel aspect of battery recycling is the recycling processes that apply to the internals of the cells. The rest is just safe separation of other structural components. And there, materials like aluminium, steel and plastics - Already has substantial recycling industry.
 
Mekon said:
Sure but people carry on like EV's are the earths savior. I hope I live long enough to see proper hydrogen powered cars and the rest can die a quick death.
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I do see them as better all round. The only negative is the price. They may be a transitional technology but so far Hydrogen has been a no show using more energy from other sources than what it produces.
 
The Trutherizer said:
A specific example. For the Tesla Model 3 battery temps between 15 and 35 Celsius are considered optimal. Tippy top Ideal is probably 20-30C. But either way... Negligible physical degradation. Outside of that. Yes - Range can be affected. How much matters though. Of course... It depends on how far outside that range you go. And for how long. Where I live. Fully two thirds of the year it will be a rare day indeed where the ambient temperature is NOT within the optimal range.

Extreme temperature can affect battery life. But then we're talking about like 40C+, which could cause minor degradation if experienced for a long time. Or even 50C+ which can be substantially deleterious - Again, if experienced for a long time.

Here's the thing though... It only matters while an EV is not in operation. AND not plugged in. AND only once the seriously insulated battery packs have finally internally equalized with the ambient temperature. The rest of the time the BMS will work to maintain near ideal temperatures. Which will affect range, yes, but at least the battery will be safe. And the range impact is also much less than letting the cells operate outside of optimal ranges. The gold standard these days are heat pumps. You get a lot of cooling/heating for relatively little energy. Since you're moving heat around. As opposed to heating systems where heat is outright generated.

Where temperature and range is concerned... Extreme cold is much more problematic. Yet many EVs now do quite well even in very cold climates.

Literally the only notable troublesome scenarios, are ones where EVs remain unused, and unplugged, for lengthy periods of time. During which it also happens to be seriously hot. Not just very warm. Hot-hot. Most places in SA - No problem.

Moral of the story. Don't leave your EV standing outside, unused, unplugged for the entire summer, in like... The Karoo. That's just looking for trouble. Of course if you do leave your EV stowed in a garage in the Karoo all summer. And the garage rarely gets hotter inside than 35C. Again - No problem.
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Cold is actually the killer of batteries and not heat. It also causes condensation issues. Luckily SA is more moderate compared to places like Iceland.
 
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