The US-China trade war will force countries to choose sides

system32

Expert Member
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Dec 29, 2009
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2,609
#2
The USA-China trade war will force countries to choose sides develop alternatives - FTFY.
The USA is trying to force it's will on the world for profit and greed which is never a good motive.

USA can't be trusted - USA has broken its treaties, pacts and promises:
  • Paris Climate Agreement - broken by USA.
  • NAFTA - broken by USA.
  • Iran Nuclear agreement - broken by USA.
  • TPP - broken by USA.
  • China/USA trade - broken by USA Executive Order on Huawei
  • etc
All non-USA multinationals & Governments should be planning/mandating alternatives to USA product to remove reliance on USA technology.

Countries will move away from/develop alternatives to AWS, Azure, Google, Cisco, Dell, Intel, etc as USA products are no longer trusted suppliers.

USA can issue an "Executive Order" (more potent than CLOUD act or Patriot Act) under the guise of security and kill the competition (see Huawei & ZTE for an example)

Trump has said said that the Huawei blacklist and the arrest of Huawei CFO can be part of the trade talks, which shows that's it's not about security or domestic Chinese policy, it's about profit and greed.
 

system32

Expert Member
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#6
I would rather be behind the US than China.
Is that the same USA that breaks treaties, pacts and promises?

The same USA that invades Iraq because of non-existent WMD
The same USA that sells weapons/supports/allied to Saudi Arabia, a country governed by an absolute monarch (a kinda medieval King that is not bound by any law). A country that as no respect for basic human right, applies the Sharia law full extent, beheads +/-150 people per year, supports global terrorism, etc.
The same USA that started & funded the Taliban and Afghan mujahideen (which included Saudi Arabs aka Al-Qaeda)
The same USA that funded the South American drug trade / Contra rebels.

That U.S.A.
 
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Stevewarren

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2010
Messages
452
#7
Trump USA? not so sure
Then you don't know **** about China and what they get away with. Trump is a tit but China is far from innocent in fact it's quite amazing how they got and get away with stuff that they do. It's like the world just turned a blind eye to all the **** they pulled.
 

Swa

Honorary Master
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May 4, 2012
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20,183
#9
U.S. technology still leads the world, and it’ll stay that way for a while
Really? Checks labels and fine print: "Made in China". Thought so. Maybe it's about time China pulls all its products and patents from countries that support the U.S. Put the little boy in its place.
 

Swa

Honorary Master
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May 4, 2012
Messages
20,183
#10
Then you don't know **** about China and what they get away with. Trump is a tit but China is far from innocent in fact it's quite amazing how they got and get away with stuff that they do. It's like the world just turned a blind eye to all the **** they pulled.
China is more about their own citizens while the U.S. has a habit of meddling into other people's affairs and demand that everyone supports them. I'll rather take the lesser of the two

 

dw...

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
395
#11
Then you don't know **** about China and what they get away with. Trump is a tit but China is far from innocent in fact it's quite amazing how they got and get away with stuff that they do. It's like the world just turned a blind eye to all the **** they pulled.
Are you some form of telepathist? Did I mention any support for China in my post?
 

OrbitalDawn

Ulysses Everett McGill
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
41,034
#12
USA can't be trusted - USA has broken its treaties, pacts and promises:
  • Paris Climate Agreement - broken by USA.
  • NAFTA - broken by USA.
  • Iran Nuclear agreement - broken by USA.
  • TPP - broken by USA.
  • China/USA trade - broken by USA Executive Order on Huawei
Some quibbles here:

- He didn't 'break' the Paris Agreement - it's not a treaty, simply a voluntary international agreement on mutual cooperation and principles. Terrible idea, imo.
- They didn't 'break' NAFTA either. He undermined it and mismanaged the mandated negotiation, but that's not the same as 'breaking' it. Also said steel tariffs on Canada and South Korea was because of national security, but dangled trade solutions. Completely incoherent and built on a lie.
- Yep, they broke the Iran agreement and lie about it, empowering the worst actors in Iran.
- They didn't break the TPP, they declined to ratify - stupidly in my view, as it was the main way to gain leverage over China, which they gave away now.
- Since they're still negotiating, there's nothing to break, but he undermined the US position totally and ensured nothing the US can get will be as good as what the TPP would have given them.
 

skimread

Executive Member
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Oct 18, 2010
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8,457
#13

Developing countries want cheaper stuff. Western countries focus on privacy and potential spy or war threat
 

system32

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Dec 29, 2009
Messages
2,609
#15

Developing countries want cheaper stuff. Western countries focus on privacy and potential spy or war threat
It's not about cheaper stuff, it's about better stuff. Huawei equipment is better at 5G than anyone else.
Huawei invented & owns 34% of 5G essential patents.
It's better and cheaper (because they own the patents).

Huawei privacy and spy / war threat was invented by USA as a trade talk lever - Trump has admitted to the trade lever.

There is no proof of privacy and spying or war by Huawei.
CISCO has numerous proven backdoors, privacy and spy issues, but I don't see you asking for them to be blacklisted.

Map of "Five-Eyes members which have been pressured by USA to blacklist Huawei" - see above.
 

Scooby_Doo

Executive Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2005
Messages
6,216
#16
Lets test which country is more dangerous.

Steps:

1. Get a hypothetical $100mil,
2. Buy some ad space on tv/internet/whatever.
3. Film an anti US/China piece
4. Run ad campaign

Lets guess which country you will want to be in when their respective governments come knocking.
 

ambroseg1

Executive Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2008
Messages
9,977
#17
This is like our recent election. All parties are ****. You just need to choose one where the smell doesnt make you as sick to your stomach.
 

Mrlepen

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 18, 2017
Messages
360
#18
Lets test which country is more dangerous.

Steps:

1. Get a hypothetical $100mil,
2. Buy some ad space on tv/internet/whatever.
3. Film an anti US/China piece
4. Run ad campaign

Lets guess which country you will want to be in when their respective governments come knocking.
USA is dangerous since it imposes the USA way of life world wide with democracy in Iraq Afghanistan Libya Syria and now Iran Russia China Venezuela but China only does **** to its own citizens so it's not that bad.
 
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