There is no hell because no one has observed it.

DMNknight

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Atheism isn't no thought. That's indifference or just being uninformed. Atheist take a active position. I kind of admire people that's more agnostic and don't even participate in this debates as that's more scientific and honest if you will, If you're going to go with a scientific world view only. But that's also not the default setting for people, that requires quite a bit of reasoning and introspection.
Atheism is also because of educated rational thought when faced with the atrocities by people who tout religion as a moral high ground in order to perpetrate evil.
 

rietrot

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Atheism is also because of educated rational thought when faced with the atrocities by people who tout religion as a moral high ground in order to perpetrate evil.
Definitely agree with this, it is mainly because of people's daddy issues.
 

rietrot

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As is Religion.
Ethics and values transcend both religion and athiesm. They are rooted in philosophy not belief.
Religion is philosophy. Philosophy without religion has absolutely no substance. There's a few new-agey humanist nonsense that's very superficial that tries to make religion irrelevant, but mostly fail.
 

DMNknight

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Definitely agree with this, it is mainly because of people's daddy issues.
Jeez that's an over simplication. Been watching a program called 'The Keepers' on Netfix where a nun was murdered. The investigation is a real eyeopener and I'm not going to spoil it for people who still want to watch it.

That is why, my primary belief is that there is something out there that is a god (to us) the same way we would be gods to 2D people. We could literally cure 2D cancer with a pencil and eraser.
Anyways, Organised religion does so much harm to it's own establishment, that it should simply be abolished and because at the end of the day, it's become financially motivated, it has it's own existence to protect. Ergo, organised religion has lost it's right to preach religiously to people because it is run by finance.
 

DMNknight

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Religion is philosophy. Philosophy without religion has absolutely no substance. There's a few new-agey humanist nonsense that's very superficial that tries to make religion irrelevant, but mostly fail.
Religion is A philosophy, one that has corrupted itself because it can not adhere to it's own philosophy.
 

Nanfeishen

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Religion is philosophy. Philosophy without religion has absolutely no substance. There's a few new-agey humanist nonsense that's very superficial that tries to make religion irrelevant, but mostly fail.
Nonsense, Philosophy stands apart and above religion.
Religion can be a stepping stone to Philosophy.
Philosophy isnt a path to religion, thats stepping backwards.
 

rietrot

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Jeez that's an over simplication. Been watching a program called 'The Keepers' on Netfix where a nun was murdered. The investigation is a real eyeopener and I'm not going to spoil it for people who still want to watch it.

That is why, my primary belief is that there is something out there that is a god (to us) the same way we would be gods to 2D people. We could literally cure 2D cancer with a pencil and eraser.
Anyways, Organised religion does so much harm to it's own establishment, that it should simply be abolished and because at the end of the day, it's become financially motivated, it has it's own existence to protect. Ergo, organised religion has lost it's right to preach religiously to people because it is run by finance.
It is just as much of an over simplification as blaming religion for everything that's wrong with the world.

And I agree with the issues about finance.
 

rietrot

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Nonsense, Philosophy stands apart and above religion.
Religion can be a stepping stone to Philosophy.
Philosophy isnt a path to religion, thats stepping backwards.
Maybe you don't understand what philosophy is.
philosophy

fɪˈlɒsəfi/

noun

1.

the study of the fundamental nature of knowledge, reality, and existence, especially when considered as an academic discipline.

2.

a theory or attitude that acts as a guiding principle for behaviour.
It isn't the same thing, and isn't really comparable. Philosophy studies religion and without religion to study philosophy has nothing. In the same way that archeology study history.
 
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DMNknight

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It is just as much of an over simplification as blaming religion for everything that's wrong with the world.

And I agree with the issues about finance.
No, it's not an oversimplification.

Organised religion presumed to take over the moral & ethical rudder for humanity. In so doing it took on a burden it could never deliver on because it would become the biggest sanctuary for the biggest sinners. It would become an excuse to commit atrocities and commit those atrocities they did.
I believe that organised religion has sent more people to hell or away from moral practises than "the devil" could ever managed on it's own.

You have to ask yourself, if Jesus was truly the son of God. Why didn't he become the Pope (or the equivalent thereof) instead of staying a common man for all of his life? There is wisdom in the scriptures, just that no-one should presume to know the scriptures better than anyone else.

People are flawed. Organisations based on people will be flawed. Moral organisations will be morally flawed.
 

Nanfeishen

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Maybe you don't understand what philosophy is.


It isn't the same thing, and isn't really comparable. Philosophy studies religion and without religion to study philosophy has nothing. In the same way that archeology study history.
#1 is really just an academic exercise

# 2 is a daily for life.


For me as a Daoist its #2
Its beyond and apart from belief or faith, it is based on logic not emotion.
 

rietrot

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No, it's not an oversimplification.

Organised religion presumed to take over the moral & ethical rudder for humanity. In so doing it took on a burden it could never deliver on because it would become the biggest sanctuary for the biggest sinners. It would become an excuse to commit atrocities and commit those atrocities they did.
I believe that organised religion has sent more people to hell or away from moral practises than "the devil" could ever managed on it's own.

You have to ask yourself, if Jesus was truly the son of God. Why didn't he become the Pope (or the equivalent thereof) instead of staying a common man for all of his life? There is wisdom in the scriptures, just that no-one should presume to know the scriptures better than anyone else.

People are flawed. Organisations based on people will be flawed. Moral organisations will be morally flawed.
Definitely agree.
 

DMNknight

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Maybe you don't understand what philosophy is.


It isn't the same thing, and isn't really comparable. Philosophy studies religion and without religion to study philosophy has nothing. In the same way that archaeology study history.
omg no.
Philosophy is completely stand alone, based on rigorous mental discipline and continual improvement where faults in logic are found and corrected. It is a repetitive and never ending cycle and is adaptive to new knowledge.

Organised religion is an attempt to explain our existence and to provide humanity with a moral fibre it itself could not maintain. At one time, it was also the study of the fundamental nature of knowledge, reality, and existence. The people who studied religion were mentally disciplined and rigorous.
But then came a time where religion was unable to absorb new knowledge and adapt itself, so instead it persecuted and even killed those that dared to find new knowledge.

I'd argue that religion would be one of the primary causes of why we've seen such slow progression in humanity overall.

Today, it is still the primary cause of oppression and is used to make up "new" laws that suit those enforcing them rather than uplifting it's peoples lives.
 

Techne

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As is Religion.
Ethics and values transcend both religion and athiesm. They are rooted in philosophy not belief.
This is false. Any ideology, religious or not, pushes or encourages people to act in certain ways, be it good or bad. Atheism doesn't, on its own it is entirely useless.
 

lived666

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This is false. Any ideology, religious or not, pushes or encourages people to act in certain ways, be it good or bad. Atheism doesn't, on its own it is entirely useless.
Its an adjective to describe a sane person that doesn't believe in magical sky daddies raping virgins and other superstitions, it's not meant to be anything else?
 

Techne

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Its an adjective to describe a sane person that doesn't believe in magical sky daddies raping virgins and other superstitions, it's not meant to be anything else?
Gosh this fun. Another one giving definitive evidence the he/she doesn't even know what atheism is. Ask EADC for help, you will get there one day.
 

lived666

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Gosh this fun. Another one giving definitive evidence the he/she doesn't even know what atheism is. Ask EADC for help, you will get there one day.
Indeed it is fun, chatting with a god fearing person is always up there for a good laugh. All Atheism is, is a lack of belief in god/s - its actually very simple snookums, its just a word an adjective to describe someone, nothing more nothing less.
 
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