They’re Lying about Louis C.K

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Regardless of how you feel, it is straight up sexual harassment. Even in the cases of the women who did say no and he backed off - how disgusting it must be to be propositioned in that way by someone you took as a respected colleague. Why should anyone be subjected to that at work?

What would happen at your company if the CEO asked a female worker if she would let him masturbate in front of her, just out of the blue and unsolicited? Even assuming she said yes at the time but she was not comfortable, her entire experience in that environment has been tainted by what she went through. I would guess that the vast majority of women would not want to see something like that.

And then to make it worse he went after the women who did speak up and intentionally railroaded their careers. Come on - there's really no way to defend his actions here. Louis CK was at the peak of comedy at the time and he did have the power to make or break careers. What he did was predatory and sick.
"Can I Jerk off in front of you?"
"Yes."

Jerks off.
"That's sexual harassment!"

Holy **** you lot are beyond lost.
 

Datura

Captain Faptastic
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Oct 12, 2006
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45,291
Dafuq is male-gaze?

Actually, I don't want to fscking know.

/logs off
/goes for solitary beach walk to gaze at whatever the fsck I choose to gaze at...
 
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Dafuq is male-gaze?

Actually, I don't want to fscking know.

/logs off
/goes for solitary beach walk to gaze at whatever the fsck I choose to gaze at...
I wish they could experience the opposite - let no one ever desire or look at them.

We are truly in the golden age of the cry-baby.
 
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Re-read what you just typed. This is all perception, not fact. You are assuming that he had massive leverage over their careers, I disagree. You then go on to say "expect women to trade career advantage for subjecting themselves to sexual behavior that they never wanted?" - so, as I said, they acted (or, neglected to) out of the hope of furthering themselves in some way, and not in fear of having something taken away. They're pretty much expecting payment from enduring this, then?

To re-iterate, I do not condone actual abuse of power (a CEO telling his secretary that she'll never get a raise if she doesn't do something for him would be a case of this), but I think you're assuming far too much in this instance.

" But they weren't really okay, and he just went on anyway" I'd like to know how he would've known at the time that they were not okay? Did they say no? Did they tell him to stop? I am genuinely asking for actual facts here. If this is the case, then yes, he's despicable. If not, and they sat there silent while he j3rk3d off, then how was he to know?
Precisely this. If he suggested it and they agreed, then he had no reason to believe otherwise.

His lack of self-awareness does not overturn the consent.
 

Nick333

Honorary Master
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I still read this entirely differently, barring the blocking the door incident. Agree to disagree, I guess. As you said, perception - mine is clouded by the fact that I am not easily threatened and have no problem saying no if I am uncomfortable, so that probably plays a very large part in my view.
Ja, he over stepped the line once as far as those articles go. That doesn't turn every other time he jerked off in front of a women into the same thing, and how huge a frikken deal was it anyway? Ja, I guess those chicks have a right to talk about it in public, and the public is entitled to judge him on it, but that doesn't make it right to bring up every time he propositioned a women and judge him on it too.

It does sound like he would help women's careers with the expectation of being allowed to jerk off in front of them, but so what? He's not obligated to help anyone's career. If you're not happy with that deal move on. If you're willing to watch some dude jerk off to help your career, shut up about it. That was your choice.
 

Nick333

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"Can I Jerk off in front of you?"
"Yes."

Jerks off.
"That's sexual harassment!"

Holy **** you lot are beyond lost.
It's the notion that women own the light that reflects off their bodies and can dictate who is allowed to allow said light to enter the pupils of their eyes.
 

PoppieChoffel

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Messages
387
"Can I Jerk off in front of you?"
"Yes."

Jerks off.
"That's sexual harassment!"

Holy **** you lot are beyond lost.
Absolutely my sentiment, until I read in one instance he reportedly blocked a door to keep two women from leaving while doing so, and in another instance went ahead after she said no. If he did this things, not consensual anymore
 

Zoomzoom

Expert Member
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It seems some people need some very basic lessons in what is sexual harassment.


Sexual harassment is any unwanted verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature. It can make you feel embarrassed, offended, intimidated or unsafe and shouldn’t be ignored.

Sexual harassment can take place anywhere, including at school, at work or out in public, so it’s important to recognize the different types of sexual harassment.

Sexual harassment can include:

  • inappropriate staring
  • telling sexual jokes
  • showing or sending unwanted sexual pictures, cartoons or other sexual images (including online)
  • demanding hugs, dates or sexual favours
  • asking questions or talking about someone’s sexuality, sex life or body
  • making unnecessary physical contact, including unwanted touching
  • using language that puts someone down on the basis of their gender
  • spreading sexual rumours (including online)
  • threatening to fire or punish someone if they don’t accept sexual advances (this is known as reprisal)
  • stalking (behaviour that makes someone feel unsafe including unwanted visits, phone calls, texts, emails or letters, leaving gifts or watching someone’s home/school)
If you’re being sexually harassed, remember, it’s not your fault. You’re not responsible for the harasser’s behaviour — no matter what. It’s normal to see physical and emotional side effects from the experience including anxiety, depression, fatigue and insomnia as well as relationship or self-esteem problems.
 

PoppieChoffel

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Messages
387
Precisely this. If he suggested it and they agreed, then he had no reason to believe otherwise.

His lack of self-awareness does not overturn the consent.
If he actually asked for permission in each instance, and they either agreed, or did not object, yes. Some other reports suggest not always the case. Would love to have actual facts,but I doubt we'll ever get them sadly.
 

Zoomzoom

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And consent seems to be another grey area.


Consent: What it is and why it’s important

When two people engage in sexual activity, they both have to agree to what’s happening. This is known as giving consent.

Consent is defined as a voluntary agreement to engage in sexual activity with another person(s). If consent is not given by both people, it is sexual assault.

Consent must be clearly expressed in words and behaviour and it’s important to know that consent is not obtained if:
  • a person is impaired by alcohol or drugs
  • a person is unconscious or sleeping
  • a person is in a position of trust or authority (teacher, coach, employer, etc.)
  • a person uses intimidation or threats to coerce someone into sexual activity
  • a person changes his or her mind and says “no”
So if the person asking for sexual favours is in a position of authority CONSENT is NOT obtained, even if there was some form of tacit consent.
 

PoppieChoffel

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Messages
387
And consent seems to be another grey area.


Consent: What it is and why it’s important

When two people engage in sexual activity, they both have to agree to what’s happening. This is known as giving consent.

Consent is defined as a voluntary agreement to engage in sexual activity with another person(s). If consent is not given by both people, it is sexual assault.

Consent must be clearly expressed in words and behaviour and it’s important to know that consent is not obtained if:
  • a person is impaired by alcohol or drugs
  • a person is unconscious or sleeping
  • a person is in a position of trust or authority (teacher, coach, employer, etc.)
  • a person uses intimidation or threats to coerce someone into sexual activity
  • a person changes his or her mind and says “no”
So if the person asking for sexual favours is in a position of authority CONSENT is NOT obtained, even if there was some form of tacit consent.
100% agree with above, but I still don't see C. K. as being in a position of authority. Just my perception, not touting as fact.

Again, if him forcing women to stay or watch when they made it clear they didn't want to, happened, sexual harassment for sure.
 

PoppieChoffel

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Oct 25, 2018
Messages
387
Yea he was not employing any of these women. What a wanker! :)
As tongue in cheek and punny as that response was, exactly what I was saying regarding "authority" versus perceived potential influence. But that's only if the "I asked for consent each time" holds true... And if he adhered to the answer.
 

KT-B

Honorary Master
Joined
Feb 3, 2014
Messages
15,881
It seems some people need some very basic lessons in what is sexual harassment.


Sexual harassment is any unwanted verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature. It can make you feel embarrassed, offended, intimidated or unsafe and shouldn’t be ignored.

Sexual harassment can take place anywhere, including at school, at work or out in public, so it’s important to recognize the different types of sexual harassment.

Sexual harassment can include:

  • inappropriate staring
  • telling sexual jokes
  • showing or sending unwanted sexual pictures, cartoons or other sexual images (including online)
  • demanding hugs, dates or sexual favours
  • asking questions or talking about someone’s sexuality, sex life or body
  • making unnecessary physical contact, including unwanted touching
  • using language that puts someone down on the basis of their gender
  • spreading sexual rumours (including online)
  • threatening to fire or punish someone if they don’t accept sexual advances (this is known as reprisal)
  • stalking (behaviour that makes someone feel unsafe including unwanted visits, phone calls, texts, emails or letters, leaving gifts or watching someone’s home/school)
If you’re being sexually harassed, remember, it’s not your fault. You’re not responsible for the harasser’s behaviour — no matter what. It’s normal to see physical and emotional side effects from the experience including anxiety, depression, fatigue and insomnia as well as relationship or self-esteem problems.
In my opinion, a lot of that can be ignored by the woman. Well, I would anyway. Sexual harassment to me is when I am touched and I did not invite it. Did not consent. But each person is free to interpret it as they wish. I feel that we take life and people way too seriously and a lot of what is said, is said in jest - as a means of testing the waters.

I was molested as a child - by a family acquaintance. But I have learnt that not all people have the same intentions. Not everyone that jokes or flirts or tries their luck is actually serious. I suppose that if I was pretty and young - or sexy - I may feel differently. It must be so stressful to have to analyze every action any male makes around you and in relation to you. I pity males with that list hanging over their heads. So women can pretty much joke and flirt but if a guy so much as looks at a women too long - he can be up on charges for harassment? Or does it work both ways? Are our natural instincts going to be the end of us all?
 

Zoomzoom

Expert Member
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Messages
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In my opinion, a lot of that can be ignored by the woman. Well, I would anyway. Sexual harassment to me is when I am touched and I did not invite it. Did not consent. But each person is free to interpret it as they wish. I feel that we take life and people way too seriously and a lot of what is said, is said in jest - as a means of testing the waters.

I was molested as a child - by a family acquaintance. But I have learnt that not all people have the same intentions. Not everyone that jokes or flirts or tries their luck is actually serious. I suppose that if I was pretty and young - or sexy - I may feel differently. It must be so stressful to have to analyze every action any male makes around you and in relation to you. I pity males with that list hanging over their heads. So women can pretty much joke and flirt but if a guy so much as looks at a women too long - he can be up on charges for harassment? Or does it work both ways? Are our natural instincts going to be the end of us all?
I'm sorry to hear that you were molested. You make a good point about intentions, but intentions can go sideways fast when the other person feels that it is ok to ignore how you feel about his intentions - whatever they may be. And the 'good' intentioned person can fall back on his 'good' intentions and say 'but I only ...' yeah that isn't the point what you only meant, what matters is that you felt entitled to press your intentions on another person.

It isn't about whether or not the person was 'serious' in their intentions, because again, can be an easy cop-out when called out on their behaviour, again it is about whether or not you stopped when given cues that your behaviour was unwanted. Any unsolicited behaviour that does not stop is a problem. And that is what everyone who is justifying what they see as normal or acceptable or dismissing as fragile female behaviour is missing. The behaviour doesn't stop. It doesn't stop if you shrug it off, it doesn't stop if you say no, it doesn't stop if you say stop, it doesn't stop if you yell at them, or whatever you do, it doesn't stop. Maybe it stops for today, but tomorrow they will be back and the next day and the next day. It is the 'not stopping' that crosses the line. And then all too often you are in a position where you can't say stop without repercussions that adds a layer of coercion to whatever other coercions are also in play.
 
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I'm sorry to hear that you were molested. You make a good point about intentions, but intentions can go sideways fast when the other person feels that it is ok to ignore how you feel about his intentions - whatever they may be. And the 'good' intentioned person can fall back on his 'good' intentions and say 'but I only ...' yeah that isn't the point what you only meant, what matters is that you felt entitled to press your intentions on another person.

It isn't about whether or not the person was 'serious' in their intentions, because again, can be an easy cop-out when called out on their behaviour, again it is about whether or not you stopped when given cues that your behaviour was unwanted. Any unsolicited behaviour that does not stop is a problem. And that is what everyone who is justifying what they see as normal or acceptable or dismissing as fragile female behaviour is missing. The behaviour doesn't stop. It doesn't stop if you shrug it off, it doesn't stop if you say no, it doesn't stop if you say stop, it doesn't stop if you yell at them, or whatever you do, it doesn't stop. Maybe it stops for today, but tomorrow they will be back and the next day and the next day. It is the 'not stopping' that crosses the line. And then all too often you are in a position where you can't say stop without repercussions that adds a layer of coercion to whatever other coercions are also in play.
It's textbook. Cognitive dissonance played out right here for anyone interested in the concept.

That you reconciled what we were debating to this piece of mind garbage you vomited out - yowzer. What a doozie!
 

KT-B

Honorary Master
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Messages
15,881
I'm sorry to hear that you were molested. You make a good point about intentions, but intentions can go sideways fast when the other person feels that it is ok to ignore how you feel about his intentions - whatever they may be. And the 'good' intentioned person can fall back on his 'good' intentions and say 'but I only ...' yeah that isn't the point what you only meant, what matters is that you felt entitled to press your intentions on another person.

It isn't about whether or not the person was 'serious' in their intentions, because again, can be an easy cop-out when called out on their behaviour, again it is about whether or not you stopped when given cues that your behaviour was unwanted. Any unsolicited behaviour that does not stop is a problem. And that is what everyone who is justifying what they see as normal or acceptable or dismissing as fragile female behaviour is missing. The behaviour doesn't stop. It doesn't stop if you shrug it off, it doesn't stop if you say no, it doesn't stop if you say stop, it doesn't stop if you yell at them, or whatever you do, it doesn't stop. Maybe it stops for today, but tomorrow they will be back and the next day and the next day. It is the 'not stopping' that crosses the line. And then all too often you are in a position where you can't say stop without repercussions that adds a layer of coercion to whatever other coercions are also in play.
I get where you are coming from - just don't demonize everyone that flits or makes advances. Not everyone is bad. Not everyone is going to railroad your choices or treat you with disrespect.
 

Verde

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2006
Messages
850
it is about whether or not you stopped when given cues that your behaviour was unwanted. Any unsolicited behaviour that does not stop is a problem.
Unfortunately our autistic forumites (and I have real empathy for them) don't have the capacity to understand this - from their perspective everything is black and white. Non-verbal cues are wasted on them.
 
Last edited:
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Unfortunately our autistic forumites (and I have real empathy for them) don't have the capacity to understand this - from their perspective everything is black and white. Non-verbal cues are wasted on them.
Louis literally asked them for consent and they gave it. And you have the gull to say the forumites who don't agree with you are autistic. The irony! :D:D:D:D:D
 
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