Treasury Sanctions Members of a Significant Corruption Network in South Africa - US Sanctions Gupta Family

[quovadis]

Its relatively simple, They can't interact with any US Business, especially the financial institutions, even indirectly. So yes they can still transact in dollars so long as the transaction never touches the US Financial system in any way, but it would be risky for them to do so in my opinion.

Good luck with that. Unless the Guptas are trading in cash they are pretty much screwed. No bank with US currency or any US entity shareholding will knowingly transact with them.

Interestingly enough, USA doesn't seem to have mutual extradition treaty & legal assistance with UAE but South africa apparently signed it in 2018. Dubai seems safe haven for guptas for now unless NPA & UAE authorities pursue it with vigour.

Last I checked Dubai was a city of the United Arab Emirates. You don't do extradition treaties with cities. South Africa has to actually file the extradition papers for something to happen.

Of course, but the US Dollar is not the only currency, its just the most widely used for international transactions... it doesn't mean they can't do business, it just makes it complicated and more expensive.

It's extremely complicated as even international wire transfers have sponsor banks and entities to enable the movement of cash and technically any currency which comes into the possession of any US entity would result in it being seized.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Agreed, its way more complicated than I'm putting across due to regulations etc etc etc.... but it doesn't instantly destroy their businesses outside of the US. It just makes life monumentally more complicated to actually function.

 

[Lindiswa]

about time!!!

 

[TysonRoux]

SA issues mutual legal assistance requests to 8 countries over Guptas, Essa case

On Thursday, the US imposed sanctions on the controversial brothers and associate Salim Essa, for corruption which cost the country billions of rand.

ewn.co.za

He said the blacklisting of the Guptas and Essa by the US government was the first step in the government’s fight against perpetrators of corruption.

But ANC cadres remain untouchable.

 

[hungrymamba]

Good news, but leave no one outside the sanctions ... McKinsey, Bain, KPMG... The whole corrupt temple must burn! They were not corrupt by themselves. They had lots of help from American and British players. No sacred cows!

 

[Jopie Fourie]

Good news, but leave no one outside the sanctions ... McKinsey, Bain, KPMG... The whole corrupt temple must burn! They were not corrupt by themselves. They had lots of help from American and British players. No sacred cows!

Totally, 100% agree with you. What you said and also remember there were a whole bunch of corrupt government officials along with Zuma too. There were hundreds of parliamentarians who knew about the corruption and despite this voted against Zuma's impeachment and to protect him and themselves, this include Ramaphosa too. There were a political party mentioned too in the corruption syndicate, and we all know it to be the ANC. So expand the sanctions and do the right thing, even if the country burns. We who remain will start building again when done.

 

[Jopie Fourie]

When it rains it pours....

British finance secretary asked to impose US-style sanctions on the Guptas

British MP Lord Peter Hain has asked the UK's finance minister, Sajid Javid, to follow the US' lead and impose a series of debilitating sanctions against the Gupta family.

In a letter addressed to Javid on Friday, Hain, who was born in South Africa and became a leading anti-apartheid figure in Britain, said President Cyril Ramaphosa needed help in the fight against corruption, looting, cronyism and state capture.

He also asked Javid to request the authorities in India and Dubai to do the same. The Guptas are resident in both countries.

"Just as US Treasury sanctions forbid US entities from doing business with the family or handling their assets, so I ask that all UK entities be instructed to impose the same ban.


"These UK entities include London-based banks like HSBC, Standard Chartered and Bank of Baroda, which in recent years facilitated money laundering by the Guptas and which I exposed in the House of Lords late in 2017 and early 2018.

British finance secretary asked to impose US-style sanctions on the Guptas

British MP Lord Peter Hain has asked the UK's finance minister, Sajid Javid, to follow the US' lead and impose a series of debilitating sanctions against the Gupta family.

www.news24.com

 

[Jola]

But ANC cadres remain untouchable.

Yeah, this is the problem.

Put all of these guys in jail with practice bikes with generators and all of Eskom's electricity generation problems would be solved.

There certainly is enough of them.

 

[Gordon_R]

The sanctions won't directly get the money back, but they eliminate the possibility of doing legitimate business with any international financial institution: https://www.dailymaverick.co.za/art...eir-financial-ambitions-goodbye-bill-browder/

"Since every bank needs to do business in dollars, it doesn’t matter what the location of the bank is, they won’t do business with sanctioned individual and risk those fines. I’m sure the Guptas are getting this same advice from their lawyers as we speak. Anyone on the Magnitsky list can basically kiss their global financial ambitions goodbye"

 

[skimread]

Thinking about it I don't think the Americans or the British care at all. If they cared the British would have gone after Bell Pottinger when it was exposed.

I can only think it is the new US ambassador that asked for favours. She was born in South Africa and will see firsthand what corruption is turning her country into.
It also is very good timing as Trump looks like he is going to get impeached for asking the Ukrainian president for favours about Biden's corrupt behavior. The US going after corruption worldwide in medium sized countries fits in nice with Trump's narrative that he is going after corruption which can help in his impeachment.

Regarding the ANC and Ramaphosa. I doubt they asked for favours. I think this announcement caught them by surprise as they are just interested in lining their pockets. All the Gupta deployments are still everywhere. Ace is still there.

The Guptas are good at using misinformation and accusations and using their lawyers to act like they are the victims. That works with the captured SA prosecution and legal system. But with the US you can't do that. US has so much intelligence options at their disposal. Guptas and Zuma jnr will shut up now to avoid getting themselves in trouble. They will never attack the US verbally or legally. They know that is a different beast you don't take on.

 

[Dave]

"Just as US Treasury sanctions forbid US entities from doing business with the family or handling their assets, so I ask that all UK entities be instructed to impose the same ban.

"These UK entities include London-based banks like HSBC, Standard Chartered and Bank of Baroda

British finance secretary asked to impose US-style sanctions on the Guptas

British MP Lord Peter Hain has asked the UK's finance minister, Sajid Javid, to follow the US' lead and impose a series of debilitating sanctions against the Gupta family.

www.news24.com

HSBC and Standard Chartered (don't know about Baroda) both have US subsidiaries so would already have to comply with the US sanctions order.

 

[skimread]

The sanctions won't directly get the money back, but they eliminate the possibility of doing legitimate business with any international financial institution: https://www.dailymaverick.co.za/art...eir-financial-ambitions-goodbye-bill-browder/

What is interesting next is to see what India and UAE are going to do. If India turns a blind eye it possibly means that Guptas paid Indian government officials bribes to turn a blind eye.. Indian authorities already look guilty for not sending through the information requested regarding the Estina dairy project causing all those crooks to get off free in that legal case. This also emboldened Ace and Zuma as it means if you can get away with stealing 100% of the money and caught red-handed but still get off free, then you can get away with anything.

Interesting times ahead.

 

[TysonRoux]

How much do the Guptas still have invested in SA, in property etc?

 

[ponder]

Thinking about it I don't think the Americans or the British care at all.

Why would they as it has zero impact on them.

 

[skimread]

Why would they as it has zero impact on them.

Yes I agree. Otherwise they would have intervened years ago. The timing so much later just seems off.
If the UK who were directly involved with Bell Pottinger did nothing then why would the US do anything?

That's why I said this is good timing as it is a combination of two things . New US ambassador to SA who was born in SA and Trump's own possible impeachment because of Biden's corruption.

 

[ForceFate]

Interesting comment in IOL

US Treasury imposes sanctions on Guptas, Salim Essa

The United States Department of Treasury on Thursday announced it had imposed sanctions on the Gupta brothers and their associate Salim Essa.

www.iol.co.za

hmmmm..... wonder who the Department is referring to here.....

OUTA?

 

[TysonRoux]

Would be good if they weren't such hypocrites and imposed sanctions on the dirty ANC cadres.

US may impose more sanctions on individuals accused of corruption in SA

This week the US imposed sanctions on Gupta brothers Ajay, Atul and Rajesh and their associate businessman Salim Essa for their alleged involvement in corrupt activities in South Africa.

ewn.co.za

 

[Jopie Fourie]

Would be good if they weren't such hypocrites and imposed sanctions on the dirty ANC cadres.

US may impose more sanctions on individuals accused of corruption in SA

This week the US imposed sanctions on Gupta brothers Ajay, Atul and Rajesh and their associate businessman Salim Essa for their alleged involvement in corrupt activities in South Africa.

ewn.co.za

Yeah, the United States of America identified a whole big syndicate. They finger political parties, leaders, their families, yet they go and sanction only a few on the other side of the fence. This is hypocritical and narrow-minded of the American leadership. It speaks a lot about their capabilities and abilities. Useless bunch.

They should have sanctioned the whole of the ANC, and Cyril Ramaphosa too. They all were involved in state capture, benefited from it and protected everyone else that were involved. They all need to be sanctioned. The world is crazy and it shows.

 

[marine1]

So the US have done more about our corruption than we have

 

[Gordon_R]

Some background on how this lengthy process unfolded: https://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/...expert-advice-to-npa-sars-and-others-20191013

News24 has also established that the US sanctions on the Guptas was the culmination of a process that started when reports about the Guptas first started appearing in the media.

The US Embassy in Pretoria submitted reports about the Guptas to, inter alia, the US State Department and Treasury, which started tracking the family and their activities and collecting evidence from a range of sources.

According to a US official with knowledge of events "it was quite a process… it took some time; we had to package the evidence. We had to consult many agencies (in the US government) and review the information there before making a decision."

The actions against the Guptas are considered "quite significant" but not new with the sanctions designed to protect the interests of the US, its citizens, financial system and businesses.