Turkey announces incursion of northeast Syria, US-backed Kurds have vowed ‘all-out’ war

[Unhappy438]

No sorry, this is bullcrap by the US, the Kurds have been allies and the US has benefited from their help. Will the Kurds turn out to be just another ally that the US betrays and turns their backs on when their usefulness runs out... terrible. And this comes from someone who likes Trump (not all his policies mind you).

The Kurds are one of the few forces in the ME worth protecting but realpolitik will have them choosing Turkey over the Kurds everyday of the week.

 

[buka001]

The Kurds are one of the few forces in the ME worth protecting but realpolitik will have them choosing Turkey over the Kurds everyday of the week.

Boggles my mind that the US continue to keep a stockpile of tactical nuclear weapons in Turkey.

 

[konfab]

The Kurds are one of the few forces in the ME worth protecting but realpolitik will have them choosing Turkey over the Kurds everyday of the week.

That is the sad reality of the situation. The Kurd's relationship with the US is ridiculously one-sided. The US simply gets bad rep for interfering in the Middle East, whist the Kurds get the backing of a gigantic military force.

If there was ever a nation that needed a state, it is the Kurds. But that would pretty much throw thermite into the petrol fire of Middle Eastern politics.

 

[Milano]

T.

That is the sad reality of the situation. The Kurd's relationship with the US is ridiculously one-sided. The US simply gets bad rep for interfering in the Middle East, whist the Kurds get the backing of a gigantic military force.

If there was ever a nation that needed a state, it is the Kurds. But that would pretty much throw thermite into the petrol fire of Middle Eastern politics.

The US earns the bad rep while pressured by European and ME allies not to perform a complete withdrawal. Meanwhile Europe will have no part in taking the 1m+ Syrian refugees so the US has no option but to allow Turkey to move into Syria to settle them back in NE Syria. US earns bad rep again. Damned if you do damned if you don't.

 

[Cius]

Turkey has a horrific history of genocide and repression of minorities, right back to their pre-history. They are also extremely anti admitting they have this problem while still not exactly treating minorities well. Kurds, Armenian's, the Ionian Greek's, as you go back in history it just multiplies. All people on this planet just about have historic crimes their ancestors committed and acknowledging that what happened was wrong seems the decent thing to do. Turks never do that. Which is perhaps why they are one of a few semi modern countries where torture is both widespread and on the rise. There is no way the Turks are out there to help the Kurds. This is going to lead to a lot of dead Kurdish people now that the US is not protecting them.

 

[Milano]

Turkey intends to make a peace corridor there and then Syrian refugees will go back to their country and live peacefully in that space. Instead of suffering in other countries. Turkey history never genocide anywhere. On the contrary they are humanitarian and have welcomed millions of refugees unlike other countries which chase them away. If any community concerned about Syrian refugees they must help to make a peaceful place. The US happily sells billions of dollars worth of death weapons to terrorists including Saudia Arabia instead of making peace. Please stop your false propaganda and lies. Behave yourself.

Agree that Turkey should have been assisted with the Syrian refugee problem. Since there has been nothing coming forward they should repatriate them to Syria. But I disagree that there is very much that is welcoming, peaceful or humanitarian about its history.

 

[konfab]

Turkey has a horrific history of genocide and repression of minorities, right back to their pre-history. They are also extremely anti admitting they have this problem while still not exactly treating minorities well. Kurds, Armenian's, the Ionian Greek's, as you go back in history it just multiplies. All people on this planet just about have historic crimes their ancestors committed and acknowledging that what happened was wrong seems the decent thing to do. Turks never do that. Which is perhaps why they are one of a few semi modern countries where torture is both widespread and on the rise. There is no way the Turks are out there to help the Kurds. This is going to lead to a lot of dead Kurdish people now that the US is not protecting them.

The problem is that Germany shot the cat when they did it by implementing collectivised guilt. Whilst acknowledging evildoing is correct, it is another thing to impose the payment of reparations upon people who had nothing to do with the actual crime.

 

[losta]

Will the Kurds turn out to be just another ally that the US betrays and turns their backs on when their usefulness runs out... terrible. And this comes from someone who likes Trump (not all his policies mind you).

which is completely in line with Trump policy.

America First.

From now Turkey is delivering more political capital than the alliance with the Kurds.

This is sound geopolitical strategy from Trump. (allthough horrific for the kurdish people, but who cares?)

 

[Polymathic]

Turkey intends to make a peace corridor there and then Syrian refugees will go back to their country and live peacefully in that space. Instead of suffering in other countries. Turkey history never genocide anywhere. On the contrary they are humanitarian and have welcomed millions of refugees unlike other countries which chase them away. If any community concerned about Syrian refugees they must help to make a peaceful place. The US happily sells billions of dollars worth of death weapons to terrorists including Saudia Arabia instead of making peace. Please stop your false propaganda and lies. Behave yourself.

Turkey's history is built upon genocide, Armenians, Greeks, Bulgarians and Kurds all suffered ethnic cleansing under them

 

[MidnightWizard]

Turkey intends to make a peace corridor there and then Syrian refugees will go back to their country and live peacefully in that space. Instead of suffering in other countries. Turkey history never genocide anywhere. On the contrary they are humanitarian and have welcomed millions of refugees unlike other countries which chase them away. If any community concerned about Syrian refugees they must help to make a peaceful place. The US happily sells billions of dollars worth of death weapons to terrorists including Saudia Arabia instead of making peace. Please stop your false propaganda and lies. Behave yourself.

Go watch MIDNIGHT EXPRESS

Midnight Express: The cult film that had disastrous consequences for the Turkish tourism industry

Rotten Tomatoes -- 96%

Really liked the music score for that movie .....

 

[MidnightWizard]

President Recep Tayyip Erdogan is pushing a radical solution — resettling refugees in a swath of Syrian territory controlled by the United States and its Kurdish allies. If that does not happen, he is threatening to send a flood of Syrian migrants to Europe.
Mr. Erdogan has long demanded a buffer zone along Turkey’s border with Syria to keep out Kurdish forces, whom he considers a security threat.
But he has repackaged the idea for the zone as a refuge for Syrians fleeing the war — pushing it as resentment against Syrians in Turkey has increased, and a Syrian and Russian offensive in Syria has sent hundreds of thousands more refugees fleeing toward the Turkish border.

“Our goal is to settle at least one million Syrian brothers and sisters in our country in this safe zone,” Mr. Erdogan told leaders of his Justice and Development Party in Ankara on Thursday. “If needed, with support from our friends, we can build new cities there and make it habitable for our Syrian siblings.”

Turkey’s Radical Plan: Send a Million Refugees Back to Syria

Germany's Horst Seehofer warns of 'refugee wave' bigger than in 2015

NOW we know the TRUTH -- ISIS be damned

Just like I said -- ANOTHER ARMENIAN GENOCIDE !

 

[buka001]

Looks like Lindsey Graham is surprised and against this. Seeking clarification.

Interesting.

I wonder how he will change his mind to blindly support Trump in the next few days?

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1181181561045172224

 

[MidnightWizard]

Boggles my mind that the US continue to keep a stockpile of tactical nuclear weapons in Turkey.

MEANT TO HAVE BEEN REMOVED -- by agreement with JFK and Nikita Khrushchev

CUBAN MISSILE CRISIS:

Although U.S. experts were convinced the message from Khrushchev was authentic, hope for a resolution was short-lived. The next day, October 27, Khrushchev sent another message indicating that any proposed deal must include the removal of U.S. Jupiter missiles from Turkey. That same day a U.S. U–2 reconnaissance jet was shot down over Cuba. Kennedy and his advisors prepared for an attack on Cuba within days as they searched for any remaining diplomatic resolution. It was determined that Kennedy would ignore the second Khrushchev message and respond to the first one. That night, Kennedy set forth in his message to the Soviet leader proposed steps for the removal of Soviet missiles from Cuba under supervision of the United Nations, and a guarantee that the United States would not attack Cuba.

Cuban Missile Crisis

Bad Americans negotiating in bad faith ........

 

[buka001]

MEANT TO HAVE BEEN REMOVED -- by agreement with JFK and Nikita Khrushchev

CUBAN MISSILE CRISIS:

Although U.S. experts were convinced the message from Khrushchev was authentic, hope for a resolution was short-lived. The next day, October 27, Khrushchev sent another message indicating that any proposed deal must include the removal of U.S. Jupiter missiles from Turkey. That same day a U.S. U–2 reconnaissance jet was shot down over Cuba. Kennedy and his advisors prepared for an attack on Cuba within days as they searched for any remaining diplomatic resolution. It was determined that Kennedy would ignore the second Khrushchev message and respond to the first one. That night, Kennedy set forth in his message to the Soviet leader proposed steps for the removal of Soviet missiles from Cuba under supervision of the United Nations, and a guarantee that the United States would not attack Cuba.

Cuban Missile Crisis

Bad Americans negotiating in bad faith ........

Jupiter missiles were removed in 1963. These were Medium Range Ballistic Missiles, that if used would have given Russia something like 5 minutes at the most to react. Hence a major strategic imbalance and why the USA did not want the same type of missiles in Cuba. There no longer any nuclear tipped missiles of any kind in Turkey.

What the USA have stockpiled there currently (at Incirlik Air Force Base) are around 50 gravity dropped nuclear bombs (B-61) that would be dropped from F-16's. These are allowed under all the various Strategic Arms treaties. As Turkey is a NATO ally, the stockpile of these nuclear bombs in Turkey forms part of the overall NATO strategy and deterrence.

So no bad faith actions.

 

[buka001]

Watching Sen. Lyndsey Graham slowly extricate his mind from the perpetual cognitive dissonance he created in his love for Trump is a beautiful site to behold.

 

[surface]

Looks like Lindsey Graham is surprised and against this. Seeking clarification.

Interesting.

I wonder how he will change his mind to blindly support Trump in the next few days?

You mean he will go back to "He's a race-baiting, xenophobic religious bigot " again ?

 

[Techne]

Shame, there goes the neo-Con twats' chance for an US-Iran war.

 

[OrbitalDawn]

The Kurds are one of the few forces in the ME worth protecting but realpolitik will have them choosing Turkey over the Kurds everyday of the week.

Not just realpolitik.

Ivanka Tweet Thanking Turkey's Erdogan for Trump Towers Launch Re-Emerges

Donald Trump admitted in 2015 that the towers represent a conflict of interest in his dealings with Turkey.

www.newsweek.com

Also, useful thread here by the former special envoy in the area:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1181085818493927425

The US earns the bad rep while pressured by European and ME allies not to perform a complete withdrawal. Meanwhile Europe will have no part in taking the 1m+ Syrian refugees so the US has no option but to allow Turkey to move into Syria to settle them back in NE Syria. US earns bad rep again. Damned if you do damned if you don't.

Alternatively, the US could increase its pathetic refugee intake. Europe has taken in orders of magnitude more than they have.

Shame, there goes the neo-Con twats' chance for an US-Iran war.

Hardly. If the Kurds turn to Iran for help, it'll strengthen the NeoCon argument in D.C. as they'll be an even bigger threat. The Kurds were a bulwark on many fronts...

 

[Alan]

Just look at Turkey elected president and it tells you everything about the Turkish mentality and history.

Anyone who thinks that Turkey is a docile friendly bunch of people with no ill history is living on a new kind of crack.

But the liberal media insisted he'd be a great president....

Although the Turkish prime minister and his Justice and Development Party have Islamist roots, they are proving in office to be of the liberal variety that believes in free markets and secular democracy. If democracy is to be successfully fostered across the Muslim world, especially in Arab countries, it is vital to encourage this Turkish exemplar.

The importance of backing Erdogan

The many reasons for supporting a pivotal Muslim country

www.economist.com

 

[Grant]

Alternatively, the US could increase its pathetic refugee intake. Europe has taken in orders of magnitude more than they have.

is the u.s. stopping refugees at it's ports ?