Twitter permanently bans Donald Trump

AtoZ

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Free speech doesn't cover incitement of violence.
Brandenburg was arrested, charged under an Ohio statute, convicted, and sentenced to 10 years in prison. A unanimous Supreme Court overturned his conviction. The Court held that speech like Brandenburg’s could be criminally punished only where “such advocacy is directed to inciting or producing imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action.”

This standard has lots of requirements. The speech must be directed toward producing action. It must be likely to result in such action. The action must be unlawful. And the action advocated for must be imminent.
Opinion piece link.

I'm still trying to get how the speech was "Imminent & unlawful" but they're able to use posts from the past as well as taking others opinions.
 

STS

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Pretending one is worse or different than the other because one is full of opinions and people you don't like just shows that you'll make excuses and deferments to benefit your talking point.

It is easy to differentiate, Facebook is not about opinions; it is about networking with family, friends, acquaintances and strangers. Having a wig up your ass about facebook is like having a problem with Linkdin, whatsapp, gmail, etc.

When a website is 90% propaganda, politics, conspiracies, it stops being unbiased. The front page is almost exclusively dedicated to right-wing political posts. Would you recommend your aunt join Gab to socialize with her baking club friends? Or do you go to EFF rallies to talk about sport?

As I said, there are posts(and pictures) of people posting on social media sayign thigns Malema has been saying, just to a different group. Will you defend Malema like you re defending these people's rights to incite violence?
 

Vorastra

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It is easy to differentiate, Facebook is not about opinions; it is about networking with family, friends, acquaintances and strangers. Having a wig up your ass about facebook is like having a problem with Linkdin, whatsapp, gmail, etc.

When a website is 90% propaganda, politics, conspiracies, it stops being unbiased. The front page is almost exclusively dedicated to right-wing political posts. Would you recommend your aunt join Gab to socialize with her baking club friends? Or do you go to EFF rallies to talk about sport?

As I said, there are posts(and pictures) of people posting on social media sayign thigns Malema has been saying, just to a different group. Will you defend Malema like you re defending these people's rights to incite violence?
There's those twists, turns, and backflips again trying to legitimise your talking point.
It's been very disappointing seeing people on this forum who've been doing that because of "muh right-wingers". Not a surprise who they are, just disappointing.
Don't worry, one day when they come for you, no one will help you. This phase of far-left-dominated lunacy won't last forever. It'll eventually phase out to normalcy like every weird movement does.

When a website is 90% propaganda, politics, conspiracies, it stops being unbiased.

Congratulations. You've just described Reddit. I guess I'm right in wanting it banned now. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

As I said, there are posts(and pictures) of people posting on social media sayign thigns Malema has been saying, just to a different group. Will you defend Malema like you re defending these people's rights to incite violence?
Consider getting some glasses. I already addressed this and said people don't have the right to incite violence.
 

STS

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There's those twists, turns, and backflips again trying to legitimise your talking point.
It's been very disappointing seeing people on this forum who've been doing that because of "muh right-wingers". Not a surprise who they are, just disappointing.
Don't worry, one day when they come for you, no one will help you. This phase of far-left-dominated lunacy won't last forever. It'll eventually phase out to normalcy like every weird movement does.



Congratulations. You've just described Reddit. I guess I'm right in wanting it banned now. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


Consider getting some glasses. I already addressed this and said people don't have the right to incite violence.

Reddit has multiple subreddits covering a variety of issues, like facebook. Even 4chan has multiple forums and threads. What is the demography of Parler/Gab?

Should this be censored?

1610693550950.png
 

AfricanTech

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Oh no incitement is never a view point its a call to arms or violent uprising. I was more talking in the context of Pelosi's statement on twitter about a hijacked election vs the same with Trumps message. It was ok then but somehow unacceptable now.

I see your point, and, as I indicated in another reply, I agree that if the standards then were the same as they are now, then Pelosi's tweet should have been slapped with the same kind of banners that Trump's were

With respect to your point about it being ok then and not now, the reality is that standards do change and evolve, as does context. In the context then, Pelosi's single tweet did very little to inflame and incite compared to Trump's collection of tweets that represented a barrage of misinformation that ultimately served to embolden and encourage his supporters to conduct an illegal storming of the Capitol (which is, it must be emphasised, the Legislative Arm of Government, an equal to the Executive and the Courts) in particular.

There is a qualitative (and quantitative mind you) difference between Pelosi Twitter and Trump Twitter.
 

AfricanTech

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Facebook is interesting. Poor Mark seems to be the outcast of silicon valley so I kinda want to support him, but then again he is also the worst one of them all at times.
FB is the devil - you should feel zero sympathy for 'ol Zuck - Bezos too

That said, even the devil makes the correct decision
Most of us learn this as kids.

Have your parents ever asked you, if your friends jump into the fire, will you do it too?

That's all incitement is. One guy telling others to jump into the fire. People don't have to listen, they have their own agency and can decide for themselves if they wish to do wrong.

Doing something wrong is ultimately the real crime. Not just talking about it(incitement.)

Either way this is pretty much irrelevant as Trump explicitly said be peaceful.

Trump is not your friend - for what it's worth, he is an Authority and Leadership figure - we are also taught as kids to respect Authority and adhere to instructions from our Leaders.

When Trump told his followers to jump into the fire, they followed their societal programming - that is criminal incitement due to his power and position.

If you or I had tweeted up a shitstorm telling thousands to go and 'take back their government that was stolen from them' it would have zero effect 'cos we don't have that kind of influence.

Like it or not, "With great power come great responsibility" <---- from Wikipedia: [French National Convention in 1793,[5] there is this sentence: Ils doivent envisager qu'une grande responsabilité est la suite inséparable d'un grand pouvoir ("They [the Representatives] must contemplate that a great responsibility is the inseparable result of a great power"). In 1817, British Member of Parliament William Lamb is recorded saying, "the possession of great power necessarily implies great responsibility."[6] In 1906, Under-Secretary of the Colonial Office Winston Churchill said, "Where there is great power there is great responsibility," even indicating that it was already a cultural maxim invoked toward government at the time.[7][8][9]

Trump and his supporters cannot shy away from that - as POTUS his words and actions carry greater weight than any other person in the USA, arguably the world.

PS: On him explicitly tweeting 'be peaceful', that's disengenous since it ignores not only what he said at the rally beforehand, it also ignores what his enablers and supporters had to say in the same context, and it ignores his tweet history filled with falsehood and misinformation designed to whip up the emotions of his supporters.
 

AfricanTech

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A thing he literally did not do.
The two Tweets that got him banned, since they were the ones deleted, literally said to respect police and the second literally told people to calm down and go home.

The two tweets that got him banned were the straws that broke the camels back in the context in which they were tweeted.

After close review of recent Tweets from the @realDonaldTrump account and the context around themspecifically how they are being received and interpreted on and off Twitter — we have permanently suspended the account due to the risk of further incitement of violence.

In the context of horrific events this week, we made it clear on Wednesday that additional violations of the Twitter Rules would potentially result in this very course of action. Our public interest framework exists to enable the public to hear from elected officials and world leaders directly. It is built on a principle that the people have a right to hold power to account in the open.

However, we made it clear going back years that these accounts are not above our rules entirely and cannot use Twitter to incite violence, among other things. We will continue to be transparent around our policies and their enforcement.

Full explanation here: https://blog.twitter.com/en_us/topics/company/2020/suspension.html

PS: I see that his other tweets on that day are conveniently ignored. Also, while tweeting 'be peaceful' he ignores calls for help from the Capitol - bit insincere what - something about words and actions...
 

AfricanTech

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Yeah, no. This was addressed earlier.

Firstly, the video makes it about banning Trump by linking Pelosi's Tweet to Trump's Tweets

Secondly, I explicitly state "PS: I'm not sure when Twitter started slapping "fact checking" labels on Tweets; if they were doing it at the time of Pelosi's tweet I'd agree that they probably should have slapped it with one of their labels too." - how is that ignoring "Consistent enforcement of their rules" - I literally stated that "they probably should have slapped it (Pelosi's tweet) with one of their labels"
 

Gnarls

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Firstly, the video makes it about banning Trump by linking Pelosi's Tweet to Trump's Tweets

Secondly, I explicitly state "PS: I'm not sure when Twitter started slapping "fact checking" labels on Tweets; if they were doing it at the time of Pelosi's tweet I'd agree that they probably should have slapped it with one of their labels too." - how is that ignoring "Consistent enforcement of their rules" - I literally stated that "they probably should have slapped it (Pelosi's tweet) with one of their labels"

Yeah, that's a bit of a copout. We didn't do it then but if we did, we should have slapped a warning on her tweet too. Convenient isn't it? Did you also miss the post about the same Twitter moaning about internet shutdowns in Uganda? One standard for me and another for thee.
 

greg0205

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Loitering


“Strong evidence, including Chansley’s own words and actions at the Capitol, supports that the intent of the Capitol rioters was to capture and assassinate elected officials in the United States government,” prosecutors wrote.
 

rietrot

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FB is the devil - you should feel zero sympathy for 'ol Zuck - Bezos too

That said, even the devil makes the correct decision


Trump is not your friend - for what it's worth, he is an Authority and Leadership figure - we are also taught as kids to respect Authority and adhere to instructions from our Leaders.

When Trump told his followers to jump into the fire, they followed their societal programming - that is criminal incitement due to his power and position.

If you or I had tweeted up a shitstorm telling thousands to go and 'take back their government that was stolen from them' it would have zero effect 'cos we don't have that kind of influence.

Like it or not, "With great power come great responsibility" B],[5] there is this sentence: Ils doivent envisager qu'une grande responsabilité est la suite inséparable d'un grand pouvoir ("They [the Representatives] must contemplate that a great responsibility is the inseparable result of a great power"). In 1817, British Member of Parliament William Lamb is recorded saying, "the possession of great power necessarily implies great responsibility."[6] In 1906, Under-Secretary of the Colonial Office Winston Churchill said, "Where there is great power there is great responsibility," even indicating that it was already a cultural maxim invoked toward government at the time.[7][8][9]

Trump and his supporters cannot shy away from that - as POTUS his words and actions carry greater weight than any other person in the USA, arguably the world.

PS: On him explicitly tweeting 'be peaceful', that's disengenous since it ignores not only what he said at the rally beforehand, it also ignores what his enablers and supporters had to say in the same context, and it ignores his tweet history filled with falsehood and misinformation designed to whip up the emotions of his supporters.
Dude. I'm not so sure why you struggle with this.

Trump very clearly said people should protest peacefully, as is their constitutional right to do.

You can go and watch the actual speech for yourself, you don't just have to repeat fake news.
 

AfricanTech

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Yeah, that's a bit of a copout. We didn't do it then but if we did, we should have slapped a warning on her tweet too. Convenient isn't it? Did you also miss the post about the same Twitter moaning about internet shutdowns in Uganda? One standard for me and another for thee.
Unless you can magically go back in time there is no other way to address the issue.

Uganda? Yeah, that's an interesting discussion waiting to happen - it wasn't the topic of the above discussion though.
 

AfricanTech

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Dude. I'm not so sure why you struggle with this.

Trump very clearly said people should protest peacefully, as is their constitutional right to do.

You can go and watch the actual speech for yourself, you don't just have to repeat fake news.
and I have no idea why you struggle with the fact that Trump is and was an irresponsible Leader, arguably the most powerful Leader in the world - go and read his tweets* and watch his speeches if you need your memory refreshed.

*https://www.thetrumparchive.com/
 

Gnarls

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Unless you can magically go back in time there is no other way to address the issue.

Uganda? Yeah, that's an interesting discussion waiting to happen - it wasn't the topic of the above discussion though.

Funny how that always happens and the Uganda discussion is part of the topic because as I said before it kinda demonstrates their hypocrisy.
 

AfricanTech

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Funny how that always happens and the Uganda discussion is part of the topic because as I said before it kinda demonstrates their hypocrisy.
Please direct me to the thread where Uganda vs FB and Twitter is being discussed so that I can discuss it in the correct context - this thread title is "Twitter permanently bans Trump"
 
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