Maybe he hacked into the Internet in the future? Hahahaha
No idea where he gets his info and makes these claims, he's basing his facts on past performance.
-
Join the MyBroadband community
South Africa’s biggest forum. Discuss, discover, and connect with thousands of members.
-
Question of the Day: Have you ever been to an airshow?
Unit trusts
- Thread starter Drifter
- Start date
Maybe he hacked into the Internet in the future? Hahahaha
No idea where he gets his info and makes these claims, he's basing his facts on past performance.
Cius
Honorary Master
Stay away from unit trusts rather. They are expensive and the main reason financial advisors punt them is the ongoing fees they get. ETF's have no ongoing fees and hence no financial advisor really punts them. Our pensions funds unfortunately have to be in Unit trusts so any spare cash should rather go in a good ETF like Betta Beta or Satrix divi. These ETF's beat 80% of unit trusts and you don't have to be a genius to pick them unlike finding the winning Unit trust.
The rest of the world is moving away from unit trusts. SA is one of the last countries to have such a large unit trust buy in rate and that is mainly due to how bad our math litteracy is in SA I am thinking.
The rest of the world is moving away from unit trusts. SA is one of the last countries to have such a large unit trust buy in rate and that is mainly due to how bad our math litteracy is in SA I am thinking.
After reading this thread, I'm quite interested in ETFs and have been looking into it. Something I found on the JSE's website was a document called "Introduction to exchange traded funds" and found this in that document:
You can't really go wrong with ETFs, good resource is on www.etfsa.co.za and www.satrix.co.za
They generally do have an annual administration fee(I know satrix just reduced theirs)! If I'm not mistaken it's 0.65% pa now and goes down depending on how much u have invested!
You can larf as much as you want. STXIND has never had a correction in 10 years apart from the 2008 crash. It is very diversified over the largest Industrial stocks on the JSE and done 30 to 40% pa for many years. Now can you please show me that I'm wrong. Most Fund Managers can only dream of beating the INDI index.
My charts cannot go back further than 10 years. If you have, please share.
If you know nothing about investing then go for STXIND.
How much have you done Hendrix?
I agree with you but not on the STXDIV. The STXIND has been tops for many years and will continue to do so.
Buying from the STX website is more expensive. If you register with a broker site like www.imaraspreid.co.za you can buy and sell directly on the JSE at less cost.
R13...
Honorary Master
Indi is doing well and has been but you can't really predict the future. It's better to advise diversity.
I'm fully aware it has outperformed all UT's and ETF's over 10 years.
I have around 40% of my dough in it, and watch it closely.
The issue we have is with your claims that it will continue to do exceptionally well in the future, how do you know this? One cannot make claims that if something has done well in the past it will do well in the future.
Go look at the stocks it holds, a lot have high PE's, the bubble has to burst sometime, this ETF can't keep climbing this fast indefinately.
How well have I done? I average around 35% pa over the last 6 years.
If you check out my stocks on www.investorchallenge.co.za, they are close to what I currently hold in real life.
Why do you think that index is there? That index will always be the one to beat for the best investors. You are above it so you doing very well.
I see you have a large holding in CML. Have you looked at my charts at shareChat in the CML thread?
I see you have a large holding in CML. Have you looked at my charts at shareChat in the CML thread?
Last edited:
I don't think it will always be the one to beat, I think resources will make a strong comeback eventually, I'm slowly putting money into NewPlat. And some into STXRES.
I'm not active on sharechat, just browse every now and then, but will go check out your charts.
I like CML, it's a solid stock, their AUM is quite high, second or third highest behind Allan Gray/investec if memory serves me correct, I just wonder how long they can continue this growth and attract investments into their products as well as their stock.
I think the OP has left and we've jacked his thread...
I'm not active on sharechat, just browse every now and then, but will go check out your charts.
I like CML, it's a solid stock, their AUM is quite high, second or third highest behind Allan Gray/investec if memory serves me correct, I just wonder how long they can continue this growth and attract investments into their products as well as their stock.
I think the OP has left and we've jacked his thread...
supersunbird
Honorary Master
Coronation Industrial Fund price performance 5-years: 152.56%
Satrix Indi price performance 5-years: 119.43%
KleinBoontjie
Honorary Master
OK, I'm on the Satrix site and is on the individual tab. Here they give 2 options:
Which one do I choose to get to the Satrix 40 or Satrix Indi? Which is best?
Which one do I choose to get to the Satrix 40 or Satrix Indi? Which is best?
ETF's are traded on the JSE, you can buy them like you would a share on the secondary market.
So your choices are to open an account with a Broker and buy them directly on the JSE yourself, the broker will hold them in safe custody for you.
or you can sign up for the Satrix investment plan, and pay monthly or with a lump sum and they will buy them for you, and hold in safe custody for you.
As a general rule, if you wanna buy with a debit order or a small lump sum, go through the Satrix investment plan.
If you have lots of cash, say R50k, it's probably cheaper to buy through a broker (as the satrix investment plan has a yearly platform cost on top of the ETF costs)
Brokers won't do debit orders, you put money into an account with them and then purchase shares or ETF's using the money in that account, they will charge you a percentage for the trade, and a monthly fee to use their services.
What amounts you looking to invest?
Fair enough, but compare the returns over a year, or 10, and they close (annualized)
And taking Coronations higher costs, The ETF might just beat coronation over those periods.
KleinBoontjie
Honorary Master
I was thinking R5000 or R10000 lump sum with a R500/pm
supersunbird
Honorary Master
Satrix investment plan
emptybruwer
Senior Member
- Joined
- Jul 8, 2008
- Messages
- 621
- Reaction score
- 68
Buying from the STX website is more expensive. If you register with a broker site like www.imaraspreid.co.za you can buy and sell directly on the JSE at less cost.[/QUOTE]
Hey macro whats the cost to do this?
Hey macro whats the cost to do this?
supersunbird
Honorary Master
Cant access anything with 10 year info but yes, 1 years is much much closer. I just wanted to illustrate to Marco is talking some nonsense again (but my example does show why CML stock does perform well lol). I have no problem with Satrix stuff and use it myself but nonsense is nonsense.
Another thing if going through the Satrix Investment Plan (have to with smaller figures) and say Coronation (which has decent fees and if not using an financial advisor) the fees are not that far apart. ETF companies are trying to lower their costs, but so are the good unit trust providers.
Now talking about 5 years again (just to show something called diversification to Marco):
The performance figures mentioned earlier are just price performance figures, now if you include income figures then for the 2nd and 3rd best unit trusts over 5 years -
Coronation Industrial Fund - 174.81% (22.25% is income growth)
Coronation Property Equity - 166.66% (61.95% is income growth)
Now talking about 1 year again (just to again show something called diversification to Marco):
Coronation Global Managed Fund and Coronation Global Emerging Markets and the DB MSCI Emerging Markets Total Return ETN each performed around the same as the Satrix or Coronation Industrial Funds due to the Rand/Dollar volatility which no one (and Marco knows this) can predict.
Now to everyone else that is newish to this:
There is nothing wrong with Unit Trusts (some are too expensive though or do not perform as they should for the fee paid) as there is nothing wrong with ETFs (same can also be a bit expensive). One follows the market and the other one tries to beat it (but only 20% are successful with that). So my suggestion is read up a bit and then start with a equity ETF or Unit Trust of your choice (R300pm minimum for a ETF and R500pm minimum for a UT). After getting to know the system and how it works for say a years time perhaps, then start with your next fund in another sector or asset class to diversify more, and then a while later another one till you have a diversified spread of say 4 to 6 funds.
Last edited:
Not always, as I've stated before, it's depends on the amount...
Imara will charge a Basic fee of R85 per deal, PLUS a brokerage fee that scales down from 0.7% to 0.2%.
So to buy R500pm of ETF's will cost you R85 + R3.50 (at 0.7%)= R88.5
R1000 pm is R85 + R7 (at 0.7%) = R92.
A R1m investment will be R85 + R4500 (at 0.45%) = R4585
A R5m investment will be R85 + R10000 (at 0,20%) = 10085
There is also a R250 account admin fee per year.
All these costs excl vat
So in Beans100's case, it's a lot cheaper to go through the investment plan...