Unmarried and living together - Property owned by 1

[Herr der Verboten]

In a relationship for 2 and half years and 3 months ago I purchased a property (in my name only).

I pay for the bond and levies etc. and I have only asked my partner to cover the groceries and electricity.

We had the discussion a while back that if we had to get married it would be ANC accrued

Today, she told me that I'm being selfish and only thinking about myself because I don't want to be married COP. Her argument is that while she did not contribute toward the payment of the house, she is using all of her money with nothing guaranteed from me. i.e If something happens she won't get back any of what she spent.

Also made mention that she could always go back to live with her parents and not pay anything if that's the case

Am I being selfish here or sensible?

Sies! Living in Sin

 

[Hamster]

I'm in my mid 30's - she mid 20's

Amazing what a little bit of context does.

Make sure she has enough money left over to invest/save and build up capital of her own. If she doesn't get that she is "renting" for free and that she can save up on her own, well, there's no excuse for marrying somebody dumb.

Unless of course she is over extended and have no meaningful amount of money left of her own after household expenses. I mean given the age gap you are probably earning quite a bit more than her so expecting her to foot the R6000 grocery/electricity bill while you pay R3500 in levies and taxes is probably not fair. Keep in mind her expenses are way more than yours - go check her shampoo, conditioner etc. cost and the amount of product she has to use compared to you. Her hair appointments can cost R10k+ per year where yours is less than R2000. And you partly benefit from the effort she puts in spending that money on herself.

Anyway, don't go COP. The 50:50 thing aside, should one of you pass on your bank accounts, for example, can get frozen until the estate is finalised and anytime one of you want to take out a contract/make debt you'll need both signatures. Just don't do it.

When you sign the ANC the lawyers will (should) ask each of you to put your net worth in the contract. In case of a divorce they will first pay out those values (inflation adjusted) and then split the rest 50:50.

 

[STORMERSFAN]

Anc WITHOUT ACCRUAL.. That way you take your stuff and she takes hers and there are no losers.. Can't she invest in a property and rent it out?

 

[BBC]

Anc WITHOUT ACCRUAL.. That way you take your stuff and she takes hers and there are no losers.. Can't she invest in a property and rent it out?

but what about now, before marriage. she wants to know about the money spent before being married or if we had to part ways

 

[Sinbad]

but what about now, before marriage. she wants to know about the money spent before being married or if we had to part ways

With accrual. She would benefit from the increase in the asset value of the property.

Without accrual is very **** for her if she takes a break from her career to raise kids, for example.

 

[Barbarian Conan]

Women are strange creatures. As others have said, it's probably about feeling insecure.
My wife told me that if I decided to keep my old place and rent it out after moving in with her, she would have seen it as me keeping a back door open.

As Affieplaas said, getting married with accrual means that as the debt of the house is paid off, she will automatically "get" half of it.

COP is just bad. I am not an expert in the details, but under it both are responsible for the bad financial decisions of the other. You go bankrupt? She goes bankrupt with you.
You take out a R500K loan to help family then lose your job, she gets angry and divorces you? Now she is legally liable to repay that loan as much as you are.
Something happens where you drive drunk, knocks someone over and gets sued for damages? She is on the hook to pay those damages as much as you are.

ANC with accrual just means that you can't get married, and then 6 months later divorce (which happens) and get half of the other one's stuff. You go into a marriage with the best of intentions, but things go wrong. Just because you will live together beforehand doesn't mean that things can't go pear shaped very very quickly after getting married.

 

[The_MAC]

You guys should not be getting married

 

[R13...]

Why not just promise your decision isn't made and you'll both decide if (tell her when) you do get married. Gets her out of your hair for a bit and maybe you do decide different later on.

 

[braniac]

She's making a contribution to your expenses so you can put money towards the bond - that's not "nothing"

Agreed.

 

[Barbarian Conan]

but what about now, before marriage. she wants to know about the money spent before being married or if we had to part ways

Nothing is stopping you from determining your net worth now, and make a gentlemen's agreement that when the time comes, these are the values that you will put in the ANC?

 

[RonSwanson]

She's making a contribution to your expenses so you can put money towards the bond - that's not "nothing"

This. The fact that the OP appears insensitive to it suggests that he does not have her best interests at heart. Any partner who does not have their SO's best interests at heart should terminate the relationship, it will not work out.

 

[chrisc]

Why the fuss?

Just have an ante-nuptial contract drawn up, signed and witnessed and registered in the Deeds Office

I think you are making a mountain out of a mole-hill

Have you discussed this possibility?

 

[chrisc]

I bought my first house before we were married, but I had already asked her to marry me. I delayed transfer until we were married, so the conveyancer could register it in her name

Subsequent houses, some in my wife's name, some in mine

We have been married 49 years now and it worked out fine

 

[Captain Underpants]

I have an ex-friend who owned his house before he met his wife. She had to pay rent the whole time they were married, and then when they divorced (which was no surprise), he kept it all. He did this, to the mother of their child. A more massive p.o.s there cannot be. How he sleeps at night is beyond me. Needless to say he's not my friend anymore that's for sure.

OP, in your case, it's simple. You decide on the morality etc for yourself. The nuts and bolts though; you should essentially 'share' all of these expenses together. Create a combined account, work out the combined monthly for everything. Split it. Then, when you break up, you can sell the property and split the dividend minus your initial. (Notice I said 'when', also a virus is not a reason to not get engaged. Even if it's to budget for a ring. Any good woman would accept a piece of string around her finger if you're a good man).

 

[dielaksman]

In the same boat here. Been living with the SO for 3 years now, unmarried still but that will change in the coming year. I just bought a house and already had 2 properties before we met. Also planning on having the chat because I want to do ANC with accrual. I basically cover 90% of our expenses at the moment. Thing is that if we stay together all is fine, she won't have anything to worry about, If I die, she will inherit the properties, but if we get divorced for some reason, I feel it is only fair that I keep my properties.

 

[Pho3nix]

Same situation.
Food for two is cheap comparatively to rent and then food but yeah

Had the conversation years back already so not expecting any issues.

Maybe she should move back home and when you tie the knot, purchase something together

 

[Drifter]

ANC without accrual. Finish and klaar.

 

[AdrianH]

I got married in COP with two properties (only one now) in my name. People said why this, it's bad that, if you get divorced she will get half, etc

Then in 2019 her well-off uncle died and she got a decent sum from him which we have used some for the immigration and some will be used to by our UK house. Never once did she say "it's her money" and always discussed what "we"
would do with the money.

Point is, it works both ways. I made a choice against my better judgement and got married in COP knowing if it went south I would likely lose one of my property's. Ultimately though I like to believe the fact I gave her the trust and respect to get married in COP, she reciprocated it back to me she came into money.

 

[Sinbad]

I got married in COP with two properties (only one now) in my name. People said why this, it's bad that, if you get divorced she will get half, etc

Then in 2019 her well-off uncle died and she got a decent sum from him which we have used some for the immigration and some will be used to by our UK house. Never once did she say "it's her money" and always discussed what "we"
would do with the money.

Point is, it works both ways. I made a choice against my better judgement and got married in COP knowing if it went south I would likely lose one of my property's. Ultimately though I like to believe the fact I gave her the trust and respect to get married in COP, she reciprocated it back to me she came into money.

How does it feel having to have her co sign every financial agreement you enter?

 

[AdrianH]

How does it feel having to have her co sign every financial agreement you enter?

Apart from immigration stuff and rental agreement in UK, we haven't co-signed much. We haven't applied for loans yet and pretty much everything we bought here was cash. We have our own bank accounts and cards, own cars, own insurance, own mobile contracts which didn't require co-signing.

Doesn't bother me though to be honest.