US and NATO escalation of conflict with Russia is leading to war - PART 2

[rambo919]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1502026746903863298

Quite an apt description of leftists in general..... not just communists.

 

[rambo919]

How do you know nobody cried out? Did you go over newspaper archives from the time?

How would you know anything?

30% pass mark.

Any significant protest would have been part of the historical record.... Today we have a flood of protest that is part of the historical record or soon will be.

EDIT: the only protest was from extra bombing of cities at the last stage of the war to break German morale and to exact revenge..... no one was hauled before the Nuremberg trials for those of course.

 

[DJ Yoda]

You consider 400+ destroyed/seriously damaged apartment blocks "a few"?
Ok...

What does that change? The end result is still a whole town being leveled because it happens to be in the way.... whether there happens to be people in it or not.


You mean like Murica used a-bombs to save uhum liberate the Japanese from their government?

But of course a few building bombed, and many probably by mistake, is hardly going all out..... thus far the Russians have not raised any western Ukrainian cities to the ground the way the Allies did Axis cities back then. In comparison they have been using feathers thus far.

 

[rambo919]

You consider 400+ destroyed/seriously damaged apartment blocks "a few"?
Ok...

Drop in the bucket..... rather than the number of buildings give me the percentage of the cities destroyed that had no military reason for the bombardment.... then try and convince me that it was significant.

 

[Mirai]

Any significant protest would have been part of the historical record.... Today we have a flood of protest that is part of the historical record or soon will be.

That's called an argument from silence and is not valid.

Again do you know what Europe looked like in 1945?

I know because I had relatives who went through that and they told me.

You lost relatives, your home was bombed, there's no food, no medicine, if you're in the East you're now fscked by the Soviets.

Now you must protest that a German town was bombed by the Americans - and you even have time to do this while you search for your missing relatives, try to rebuild your life etc... do you know what the flow was information was like back then?

Again 30% pass mark.

You're going to concern yourself about a German city when ending the war sooner meant your neighbour or relative could return from the death camp sooner.

Yes it's selfish but you can't relate bud. That's because you get your knowledge from movies.

 

[Mirai]

Rambo sits in sunny SA, with loadshedding I know, at the computer, defending his defender of conservative values Vlad, and sh-t all over the dead Ukrainians and the millions displaced. And he wonders why destroyed people of post-WW2 Europe did not protest the people who had liberated them.

Fsck me.

 

[Unhappy438]

We don't know the state of how well or not they are equipped, you assume they are poorly equipped. Russia has ~2,000,000 reservists, and an estimate of 1,000,000 active personnel. They have a 1-year conscription, an approximate 400,000 men are drafted for serving in the regular army, annually. Those are a lot of troops, but is small in comparison to their population size.

Yes, they have a lot of territory to protect, but the armies committed to Ukraine are a handful.

I don't assume anything, it's well reported for many years now, even from with inside Russia.

They have roughly 400k contract men and have put half of those in Ukraine. 200k to protect those massive borders isn't much.

If they were so flush with manpower we wouldn't see this idea from them about Syrians.

Not to mention the units of Chechens we have seen lying dead on the battlefield.

 

[rambo919]

That's called an argument from silence and is not valid.

Again do you know what Europe looked like in 1945?

I know because I had relatives who went through that and they told me.

You lost relatives, your home was bombed, there's no food, no medicine, if you're in the East you're now fscked by the Soviets.

Now you must protest that a German town was bombed by the Americans - and you even have time to do this while you search for your missing relatives, try to rebuild your life etc... do you know what the flow was information was like back then?

Again 30% pass mark.

You're going to concern yourself about a German city when ending the war sooner meant your neighbour or relative could return from the death camp sooner.

Yes it's selfish but you can't relate bud. That's because you get your knowledge from movies.

And what exactly do you think all these insults and appeals to empathy is going to get you?

How is all this hysterical emotionalism supposed to change my mind?

I pity anyone mentally weak enough to be so easily swayed.

 

[chrisc]

A different slant from a friend in Israel:

A former speechwriter for Russian President Vladimir Putin currently living in Israel asserted to Israeli media on Sunday that if Putin “had known what was going to happen” after invading Ukraine, “he would never have done this.”

Abbas Gallyamov’s family has resided in Israel for four years while he commuted to Russia to work as a speechwriter and consultant, but he now lives permanently in Israel.

Putin, he told Israel’s Kan broadcaster, “is ready to stop” the invasion, but “he needs some trophy to present to the general Russian public and Russian elites.”

Gallyamov said that Putin believed that his invasion of Ukraine would be swift and decisive, and over in a matter of “two or three days,” after which he would be able to impose a puppet government.

The Russian president, he added, “understands that he got into trouble, and definitely he was not counting on that.”

Moreover, said Gallyamov, the primary motive for the invasion was “nothing to do with Ukraine or with the USA or with NATO,” but with Putin’s waning domestic popularity.

“His ratings are going down within the last three, four years,” he said, “and the protest sentiments grow, and Putin is going to face serious problems.”

This, he added, prompted Putin to start the war in hopes of a “rally around the flag effect” that would boost his popularity.

Asked about the recent diplomatic moves by Israel to mediate between Moscow and Kyiv — including Prime Minister Naftali Bennett’s weekend visit to Russia, where he met personally with Putin — Gallyamov said that if the Russian leader is willing to listen to reason, “definitely it is only the Israeli prime minister who will be able to deliver it.”

“We all know that, out of all the countries of the first world, out of all the democratic countries, Israel has the best relations with Russia,” he explained. “And Putin really treats Israel differently. … So, if there is anything in general which can help the West and Russia find common ground, then it’s through Israel.”

 

[Mirai]

And what exactly do you think all these insults and appeals to empathy is going to get you?

What empathy? It's appeal to facts. How do you want refugees and people who must rebuild, who don't have time to read newspapers or check their tiktok, who lost family members in WW2, how are they going to protest?
or cry out? What are you on about? This isn't about empathy? It's about knowing the situation and you being hopelessly ignorant.

How is all this hysterical emotionalism supposed to change my mind?

You're the histerical one bringing up a city - and then wondering why people who had already been fscked by WW2 didn't march like you do for all the wars out there. You keyboard warrior you.

I pity anyone mentally weak enough to be so easily swayed.

30% pass mark with zero comprehension skills on top.

 

[The Trutherizer]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1502026746903863298

I was curious to get the context.

I see the origin is widely attributed to Elena Gorokhova in A Mountain of Crumbs

A Mountain of Crumbs Quotes by Elena Gorokhova

8 quotes from A Mountain of Crumbs: ‘The rules are simple: they lie to us, we know they're lying, they know we know they're lying, but they keep lying to...

www.goodreads.com

Or maybe she plagiarised it?

Nice quote in any case.

 

[rambo919]

“We all know that, out of all the countries of the first world, out of all the democratic countries, Israel has the best relations with Russia,” he explained. “And Putin really treats Israel differently. … So, if there is anything in general which can help the West and Russia find common ground, then it’s through Israel.”

This is interesting.... previous Russian regimes tried to help wipe Israel from the map.

Does this not conflict with Russia's friendship with Iran, PLO, etc?

 

[borro]

 

[DJ Yoda]

The war has only just started, putin is not angry enough yet. Also, considering his past career in KGB, he won't go straight full on bombing and levelling the cities, he will create some sort of KGB style story first to justify the full on bombing.

Drop in the bucket..... rather than the number of buildings give me the percentage of the cities destroyed that had no military reason for the bombardment.... then try and convince me that it was significant.

 

[rambo919]

I wonder how many of the Russian bombing are actually Ukrainian and how many Ukrainian bombings are actually Russian.....

All these hoaxes and false flags are gonna be the topic of future books all on their own.

 

[Mirai]

I wonder how many of the Russian bombing are actually Ukrainian and how many Ukrainian bombings are actually Russian.....

All these hoaxes and false flags are gonna be the topic of future books all on their own.

There are Russian troops shooting and bombing in a sovereign nation which is against the UN charter.

You don't need to know more that it's a bad thing and the Russians should pull out to their own border.

They have no right to be there.

 

[DJ Yoda]

Well, Russia says that they have destroyed all, or most of Ukrainian air force. So, if you believe Russians, there are no Ukrainian bombings.

I wonder how many of the Russian bombing are actually Ukrainian and how many Ukrainian bombings are actually Russian.....

All these hoaxes and false flags are gonna be the topic of future books all on their own.

 

[Dave]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1120407477659553792

Can we stop using the Nazi propaganda newspaper ?
You guys, can you find a better source than a Nazi/Nazi sympathizer ?
Works for the Kyiv independent.

Made up name for Kiev.

and yet named after someone called Kyi who was there about 1000 years ago...

 

[rambo919]

The war has only just started, putin is not angry enough yet. Also, considering his past career in KGB, he won't go straight full on bombing and levelling the cities, he will create some sort of KGB style story first to justify the full on bombing.

That may well happen.... but still you have to compare apples to apples. If something was excused before and is not now... a reason must be given for why that changed. And the reason must be able to stand up to critical scrutiny.... otherwise it's just religious belief speaking which is especially illegitimate if there is a refusal to admit to the religion involved.

Everyone at this point instead of comparing this war to previous wars of similar nature are exclusively comparing it to wars Russia specifically fought in recent history.... or to peace conditions. This is dishonest.

 

[rambo919]

Well, Russia says that they have destroyed all, or most of Ukrainian air force. So, if you believe Russians, there are no Ukrainian bombings.

I don't believe anyone implicitly at this point.

I am not saying anything specifically is actually happening but there are many ways to blow up a building and only some need bombers or jets.