US and NATO escalation of conflict with Russia is leading to war

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Defonotaltaccount

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Cant wait for someone to show the supposed Russians captured laying on the ground.
Guns close to the camera.
Tavors and AR-platforms
Since when do Russian grunts get issued with Tavors and AR platform rifles ?
Something is glowing and it aint Chernobyl.
 

Mirai

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Here is my totally accurate not fake report of the war:

People are shooting the poop out of each other and no one knows who is gonna win
Accidents have happened and everyone is blaming Putin for everything including the hole in the ozone layer
The entire world is shouting at each other as if they are actually involved
Corrupt countries world over are using this to draw attention away from internal problems

Yeah. It's like one guy murders another and it's a big deal, so some guys with parking tickets get off scott free.
 

IndigoIdentity

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Yes, because you deliberately changed the article's context to advance an argument into your desired direction, to quote the headline,

I thought you read the article...

My accusation continues to stand, correct.

Did Zelensky write the article? I mean, that is up to the author, no?

Grow up.
I will admit, I did not read that part, or the article entirely as I had said too. I had gone through all of it (at least I thought so) on mobile earlier today when trying to catch up and brought it up in reference to the comment that I had quoted on. I have read it through now.

I highlighted part of the article and said to me, this is what I think and what I think should happen.

You asked me how is he making them shields? Above contributes but also the Russian leadership has been clear on this, the target is the neo-nazi military groups and corrupted leadership of Ukraine. I do believe that they will try to minimize civilian loss of life in doing so as this is not their target in the military action that they have taken.

I will stand to it again, if his family is at risk, there is no point in using them as shields in this campaign of fighting for the people who are not combat targets against the second most powerful military power on the planet. He should try his best to ensure their safety so that he can legitimately focus on the peoples needs.

Do I think Zelensky wrote the article? Obviously not. Does it change my point of view? No, not by much as I don't see him as being the legitimately elected president of Ukraine, just the installed one. I'm sure we will see another installation soon.

The people of Ukraine always have to suffer, it's never been about them. If it was, he would have his support?

Perhaps I do need to grow up, perhaps it's been a long day and a long trip. But you know what? If you want to make it into an arguement then common let's go at it like some boxing heads or something, I still have some time left?
 

Fulcrum29

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There is one accidental positive to this. As far as I know the Russian army is not battle hardened, this would explain why they are having the troubles they are.

This bodes well for anyone China invades as their army is also not battle hardened.

Battle hardened is an odd choice there. Battles change with every enemy and landscape. Militaries adopt a doctrine, but not all doctrine adapts or can adapt to the situation. This is why militaries exercise and increase their readiness. The best measurement remains readiness, but it is pretty much dogma in any case.

A troop who has done 1-3 tours in Iraq, would be more aware, reactive, responsive, but put that same troop now in Ukraine, suddenly the situation changed, and would not display the same readiness as in Iraq.

Somebody here earlier mentioned how much the USA is investing in their military (and R&D), it is, without doubt, unrivalled, but China and Russia only do state contracting, ignoring state corruption (which also happens in the private sector) their expenditure is comparatively and considerably reduced. Countries don't build armies to be the biggest and the strongest, it is built to suit their needs. Though, yes, it needs to be battle-tested, war will always be conducted by the soldier in whichever capacity that soldier may be.

Russia doesn't have troubles; they don't seem intent to invade the metropolitans at this time. They take the outer suburbs but haven't moved on central districts other than in the South and Sumy. Kharkiv is being sieged, and say the reports are accurate, then Russia is still encircling Kyiv. Russia built up their logistics in areas they have captured, most possibly also rotating troops. They can mobilise 5 times as many more troops to the incursion points. At this time it would be crucial to cut any Western support coming into Ukraine, and to prevent said support reaching where it would be most needed.

Now, Russia has been modernising outdated arsenal, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see them use reserves in initial attacks, outnumbering similarly aged arsenal. I have seen many T-90s, but many more T-72s, not so many T-80s, and Russia’s newest and latest hardware are pretty much still a testbed and I haven’t noted a single Armata based unit, but it is notable that more updated arsenal is being brought into Ukraine.
 

Gyre

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Cant wait for someone to show the supposed Russians captured laying on the ground.
Guns close to the camera.
Tavors and AR-platforms
Since when do Russian grunts get issued with Tavors and AR platform rifles ?
Something is glowing and it aint Chernobyl.

You juts love being proven wrong :)
 

rambo919

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Battle hardened is an odd choice there. Battles change with every enemy and landscape. Militaries adopt a doctrine, but not all doctrine adapts or can adapt to the situation. This is why militaries exercise and increase their readiness. The best measurement remains readiness, but it is pretty much dogma in any case.

snip
I admit I might be being overly optimistic out of an emotional desire to see China suffer militarily when it has it's outing.
 

Defonotaltaccount

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I wanted to add one more thing to your post.

Defonotaltaccount profile, fake
Better go change your reddit/twitter to Ukrainian flags too, wouldnt want anyone there to be unaware of your support of genocide and neo nazism.
Every single one of those mentioned by me was proven fake.
This profile is patently real as you are replying to it.
 
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Grant

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Its always interesting to take a step back in time.
Some gems from the very first post:

All the talk of imminent war is emanating from Washington, the European capitals and filthy pro-imperialist media on both sides of the Atlantic. The claims that Russia is about to invade are supplemented by dire warnings, for which absolutely no evidence is presented, that Moscow is planning to stage a “false-flag” operation, which it will then use to justify an invasion.

Further “proof” of an imminent Russian invasion are meaningless images of 1) tire tracks allegedly created in the snow by the weight of military vehicles being loaded for transport near Lake Baikal; 2) “Iskander-M launch vehicles covered in tarp at an unspecified location;” and 3) a train allegedly parked near a station in Primorskiy Krai “fully loaded with what appears to be military vehicles.” All of this amounts to nothing.

The claim that the time for negotiations is coming to an end is a ploy used by those who are planning to launch a war, not by those who are seeking to avoid it.

Schools, hospitals, essential infrastructure, production—all of this is breaking down under the weight of the mass infection program pursued by these governments.

The rush, led by the United States and Germany, to draw Russia into a bloody conflict can be stopped only by an international movement of the working class, united on an anti-capitalist and socialist program.
 

IndigoIdentity

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Russia will exhaust itself in this conflict.
They are over-committing.
Not progressing as fast as they had hoped.
Are experiencing more resistance than they expected.
Have squandered diplomatic capital worldwide. Getting in bed with China which has its own price.
Is facing a veritable nuclear winter of sanctions.
Even faces the wrath of many of their own citizens domestically.
Forever turned Ukraine against them.

Frankly... Putin told business people in Russia that he had to do it to save Russia, but no matter how bad it looked then (whatever the perceived threat was... take a pick) - After this will be way worse.
Hmm, interesting take.

So basically Russia will expend itself in Ukraine after a long and protracted battle over several months, years and lead to a military ultimate failure?

I know it's basically impossible to tell at this point, but what is your point of view on that?

On the progressing as far as they had hoped part, will admit I did skip some pages earlier from where I was at to respond to the recent comments so have not fully caught up. Are you drawing from opinion too or are there any links which discussed the expectations vs current progress of the campaign?

Last few points I agree with for the most part but I don't think the sanctions will have much of direct threat on their current military position. To me, it seems that they are well stocked and ready to wage a war on the borderlands.

To be honest, the day NATO deploys troops to Ukraine is the day that we see escalation of conflict the likes of which the world has never seen. So yeah, I kind of get his point of view on this in saying that should he not have made this move then it would be the end of Russia.

The bear was poked, this time it has not stepped back. This is a major shift in world climates either way.

EDIT: Typo
 
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Fulcrum29

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This is NATO's view,


Russia is spinning slow advance as pause for negotiations, NATO official says​

A NATO military official claims that Russia is spinning its slow advance in the invasion of Ukraine as having stopped to allow time for negotiations.

“They are having problems,” the official explained, pointing to the alliance’s latest intelligence. “They lack diesel, they are proceeding way to slow and morale is obviously an issue.”

but Russia would most certainly establish logistics within Ukraine, it takes time. I also, doubt that NATO would so bluntly and openly speak out about their intelligence.
 

IndigoIdentity

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Its always interesting to take a step back in time.
Some gems from the very first post:
On this part:

"conflict can be stopped only by an international movement of the working class, united on an anti-capitalist and socialist program."

Yes, chop their d*cks off and the measuring contest ends.
 
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