US Politics and Trump Category IV - I've never even heard of one that big before

[greg0205]

Politics and witnesses are easy things to twist.

You've never been in the military anywhere, have you? I can tell from your asinine response.

 

[cerebus]

Given how slippery your responses usually are you will have to excuse me from playing this game. You have already falsely accused me of being the one to shift the goalposts.

 

[rambo919]

You've never been in the military anywhere, have you? I can tell from your asinine response.

Even the military has internal politics and bodies in closets.

 

[Emjay]

The Queen of Whataboutism whatabouts.

Now there is a suprise.

And speaking of melt downs, maybe you recall the string of direct messages you sent me a little while ago? That was a proper meltdown!

Why don't you share them, you little weasel?

 

[greg0205]

Even the military has internal politics and bodies in closets.

Eish. Just eish.

Don't you have some COD to play rambo?

 

[rambo919]

Eish. Just eish.

Don't you have some COD to play rambo?

Nope, I will leave childrens games to you

 

[Cray]

Even the military has internal politics and bodies in closets.

One of the pardoned men....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clint_Lorance

At his trial in August 2013, nine members of his platoon testified against him.[5] Lorance never testified in the court hearings, though he did take responsibility for his men's actions. Three men on a motorcycle were speeding towards the platoon and ignoring commands to stop.[5] His soldiers testified that the platoon was walking through a dangerous valley in southern Afghanistan on patrol when a motorcycle was spotted approximately 600 feet away, and that the motorcycle could not have reached the platoon's position.[5] Attorneys for Lorance attempted to cast doubt on four of the soldiers' accounts, arguing that they were granted immunity in exchange for their testimony.[5] The other five soldiers who testified against Lorance did not receive immunity.[6] At the end of a three-day trial, Lorance was found guilty of two counts of second-degree murder, obstruction of justice, and other charges "related to a pattern of threatening and intimidating actions toward Afghans" as the platoon's leader.[2] He was sentenced to 20 years in prison, forfeiture of all pay, and dismissal from the Army

Internal politics is one thing by nine soldiers...?

 

[cerebus]

One of the pardoned men....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clint_Lorance

Internal politics is one thing by nine soldiers...?

Even after the pardon the Navy wants Gallagher out:

Navy could remove Gallagher from SEALs, even after Trump intervention

A U.S. Navy SEAL whose rank was recently restored by President Donald Trump following a court-martial is now facing a bid by Navy brass to remove him from the SEALs, U.S. officials and his lawyer told Reuters on Tuesday.

www.reuters.com

 

[rambo919]

One of the pardoned men....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clint_Lorance



Internal politics is one thing by nine soldiers...?

Never discount anything as being either true or false without waiting for the dust and sensationalism to settle. The bigger the sensation the more cautious the opinion should be.

 

[Cray]

Never discount anything as being either true or false without waiting for the dust and sensationalism to settle. The bigger the sensation the more cautious the opinion should be.

So let the outrage blow over so we all forget just how morally dubious this is....?

He was convicted in 2013 and that conviction was reviewed and upheld in January 2015 by the commander of the 82nd Airborne, am not sure what dust settling will do to the facts of the case that 9 of his subordinates testified to him committing war crimes..

 

[rambo919]

So let the outrage blow over so we all forget just how morally dubious this is....?

He was convicted in 2013 and that conviction was reviewed and upheld in January 2015 by the commander of the 82nd Airborne, am not sure what dust settling will do to the facts of the case that 9 of his subordinates testified to him committing war crimes..

I did not say forget, no one will forget this, clearly.
EDIT: tbh when I first heard about this I thought it was the usual "the sky is falling" exaggeration.

 

[AlmightyBender]

Never discount anything as being either true or false without waiting for the dust and sensationalism to settle. The bigger the sensation the more cautious the opinion should be.

5/7 for trolling for two pages. Epic.

@cerebus @greg0205 @buka001 @Cray don't you recognize this tactic that Rambo constantly pulls?
Step 1: ask what the fuss is about
Step 2: ask for evidence
Step 3: cast doubt on evidence and dismiss it
Step 4: claim that the true truth can't be known until some time has past

Pulls the same routine in every discussion. Your choice to feed the troll or not, but I acknowledge it is fun. No amount of evidence will ever satisfy, cause what you must realise is that this Agent Smith has fully deleted the goalposts from his implementation of the matrix

 

[greg0205]

Nope, I will leave childrens games to you

Here comes a one-post derail... Y'all better sit down for this.

Back in the day, probably before you were born, I spent some time wearing the brown (and for a while green, but I'll get to that later) uniform of the South African Defence Force... For my troubles I got a free flight and an all-expenses-paid trip to South West Africa. You kids call it Namibia now.

Now when I say all-expanses-paid that's not totally true. Of the 150 of us that made that particular trip, I was one of six who were sent to hang with a bunch of cowboys called Koevoet (the green uniform) who were all drunken madmen. It's a penance, I'll tell you that.

It was the heady days of Resolution 435, Chester Crocker, UNTAG and South African boys being restricted to base so politicians could politician.

Anyway, one Friday morning, a bunch of cats who called themselves the people's liberation army of Namibia decided that South African boys being restricted to base was a good time to flood across the border from Angola

Immediately PIK Botha (ask your parents) called Chester and said, "Chester, daar is groot kak and I'm letting my dogs out"... And by dogs he meant Koevoet.

Long story short, there was a sternly worded and vigorous debate and the liberation army gang ran back to Angola.



Reporting folk who walk away from days like those with isn't just difficult, it's near impossible. Recognising the difference between force and atrocity is also blurred...

If it was obvious enough for those grunts and operators to report their mates, it was a war crime.

Derail over and as you were "rambo" 919

 

[rambo919]

5/7 for trolling for two pages. Epic.

@cerebus @greg0205 @buka001 @Cray don't you recognize this tactic that Rambo constantly pulls?
Step 1: ask what the fuss is about
Step 2: ask for evidence
Step 3: cast doubt on evidence and dismiss it
Step 4: claim that the true truth can't be known until some time has past

Pulls the same routine in every discussion. Your choice to feed the troll or not, but I acknowledge it is fun. No amount of evidence will ever satisfy, cause what you must realise is that this Agent Smith has fully deleted the goalposts from his implementation of the matrix

It's hardly trolling or steps, most of what goes on in this thread is much ado about nothing.

Much of the supposed evidence given does not pass muster or is utterly subjective. Real truth has to meet a high standard not just one low enough to satisfy one's ideological leaning.

It is true for all truths that they are difficult to fully know while everyone is ranting and raving at each other, only when you distance yourself from the furor can you understand what actually happened.

 

[buka001]

5/7 for trolling for two pages. Epic.

@cerebus @greg0205 @buka001 @Cray don't you recognize this tactic that Rambo constantly pulls?
Step 1: ask what the fuss is about
Step 2: ask for evidence
Step 3: cast doubt on evidence and dismiss it
Step 4: claim that the true truth can't be known until some time has past

Pulls the same routine in every discussion. Your choice to feed the troll or not, but I acknowledge it is fun. No amount of evidence will ever satisfy, cause what you must realise is that this Agent Smith has fully deleted the goalposts from his implementation of the matrix

I was about to post something in this regard.

He famously claimed to me, you cannot trust WW2 history (even actual contemporary documents written by people at the time), but you can absolutely trust 100% everything that was written in the bible. Everything there is factual.

 

[rambo919]

snip

Reporting folk who walk away from days like those with isn't just difficult, it's near impossible. Recognising the difference between force and atrocity is also blurred...

If it was obvious enough for those grunts and operators to report their mates, it was a war crime.

Derail over and as you were "rambo" 919

Are you not leaving yourself victim to a number of assumptions here?

That the SA military of old is identical to current US military.
That soldiers of both are identical at root level.
That the leadership is identical.
That the cultures are identical.
etc

Outright atrocities happened in the Namibia conflict on both sides, no one really talks about them today and when they do it is rarely objectively.

The American military has a history stretching as far back at least as WWII of atrocity either real or imaged as well as internal power struggles, SA not so much until the last maybe 5 decades unless I am mistaken.

I'm not saying it's false but I'm also not saying it's true, I am saying it is a mistake to assume that someone told the truth without funny business simply because he/they happened to be in "a" military force.

 

[rambo919]

I was about to post something in this regard.

He famously claimed to me, you cannot trust WW2 history (even actual contemporary documents written by people at the time), but you can absolutely trust 100% everything that was written in the bible. Everything there is factual.

If you want to believe probable propaganda or skullduggery at face value that's your business.

Also you are attacking a strawman here, I did not say you cannot trust any/all WWII history. I said you cannot completely trust the parts vulnerable to tampering.

 

[Unhappy438]

It's hardly trolling or steps, most of what goes on in this thread is much ado about nothing.

Much of the supposed evidence given does not pass muster or is utterly subjective. Real truth has to meet a high standard not just one low enough to satisfy one's ideological leaning.

It is true for all truths that they are difficult to fully know while everyone is ranting and raving at each other, only when you distance yourself from the furor can you understand what actually happened.

Please tell us about Hillary again, dying to hear about her.

 

[rambo919]

Please tell us about Hillary again, dying to hear about her.

Was it you I told what to do with a duck? Can't remember.

 

[AlmightyBender]

Much of the supposed evidence given does not pass muster or is utterly subjective.

This is the problem right here, your level of muster is so high that it goes all the way up to outer space and beyond, circles around the curvature of the universe to finally rest up your own ass.

Your method is transparent, you do it so often.