Voortrekker Monument.

[IamCanadian]

It is the 16th of December and you know what that means. (Blood and all)

It occurred to me to ponder this thought. How long will the Voortrekker Monument be left to stand considering what it means to many Africans and also considering all the name changes going on throughout the country?

Just a thought.

 

[Skeptik]

From what I can tell, the government is leaving this monument alone. Their relationship with the Afrikaner is better than that with the British 'colonialists'.
Time will tell just how sincere they are.

 

[Syndyre]

Their relationship with the Afrikaner is better than that with the British 'colonialists'.

Seems to be true, the question is why, considering the history.

 

[supersunbird]

Those buggers know it would be the last straw, thats why they leave it alone...

 

[IanC]

Time will tell just how sincere they are.

Indeed ...

 

[kilo39]

Seems to be true, the question is why, considering the history.

Many of the english can leave (little encouragement goes a long way.) Divide and conquer. Or at least to make the white population even less consequential than they are.

 

[BTTB]

The English

The English were in South Africa from 1795 and onwards.
Many English people married Afrikaners, Germans etc.
It was only late in the 1800's at the time of Bernato, Jameson and Rhodes that the trouble started between the British Empire's quest for the Gold and the old Boer Republic of Transvaal.

Many English folk by this time had been settled in South Africa in the Cape Colony, Eastern Cape and probably a certain amount had even trekked in the wake of the Voortrekkers post the 1830's up into the Orange Free State, Northern Cape and Transvaal.
Several Generations of English people were already living in South Africa before the likes of Rhodes et al placed their mark on the African soil.

When the Boer War started people could have been shot for treason if they were seen to be helping The Boers. English people and the Non-English people they married had to play fiddle to the politics of the era at the turn of the Century when Britain sent forces to South Africa to fight the Boers.

So for about 100 years English folk had mingled with the Afrikaners/Boers only to be put between a rock and a hard place when the British Empire declared War on their new country. Think of the scenarios that must of played out.
I am sure there were many English folk living in South Africa that joined forces against the Boers, but there were many that did not.

Example: My own surname is English and I am the 4th Generation to be born in South Africa, yet only one of the three mothers to that 4 generations had a English surname, whereas two were German and one was Dutch.
And I also know the early people spoke the forerunner of what is now called Afrikaans, formerly Kitchen Dutch and ate traditional Boere Kos dishes.

The Voortrekker Monument will outlive us all.
They built it to last.
I was born on Dingaan's Day/Day of the Vow.

 

[xtermin8or]

Happy belated Birthday - BTTB

 

[GougedEye]

So for about 100 years English folk had mingled with the Afrikaners/Boers only to be put between a rock and a hard place when the British Empire declared War on their new country.

You may want to check your history with regard as who declared war on who. Of course, thats just a matter of timing.

On the monument itself, that architectural monstrosity was built to last. Not sure that a H Bomb could demolish it completely. More trouble than it's worth. Doesn't mean they might not decide to change it's name to something like "the Dingaan Memorial". Now that would be funny.

 

[BTTB]

Happy belated Birthday - BTTB

Thanks xtermin8or.

 

[LabAnimal]

Sipho, No offence to you but :

non-african - what a load of crock!. if you're born on african soil, you're an African. African doesnt define you as pink of blue, it defines where you're from

I think this a common misconception that if you're white, and you look at your black neighbour, you call him an african - which is wrong.

Honestly, if you want to start labeling anybody NON, whynot label people as either Black-African, White-African, Indi-African, Coloured-African - not sure if this is Illegal (if i remember correctly there was some stupid hoo-haa about it a wile back) - but atleast then you are acknowledging that we are all african.

By saying NON - you are indirectly saying we are not welcome, we are not of africa.

 

[IamCanadian]

But I do live in Europe. But I am not European.
So you are correct.

Why do you ask?

Just curious.

Here is another question. I don't know if you are married. But let's say you are married and then let's say that you also are married to a beautiful black South African lady and then let's say you have a beautiful child born in Europe.

Would your child be European or African?

 

[ToxicBunny]

Just cos i'm in the mood to argue a little bit.

Pray tell how you feel you only have an attitude of positiveness when you basically say that all light-skinned people are NON-African. That in itself is a racist, negative and non-unifying attitude if I've ever come across one.

And yes people moan alot because ALOT is going wrong in this country, and its not simple things, its very major things that are going wrong. When people try and act on them, they government turns a blind eye, or ignores it, or tries to hide it.

What this country NEEDS is accountability.

 

[LabAnimal]

Hi Labanimal (I like the Name!)
Africans are dark skinned.
Non africans are light skinned.It is not about where you were born.
Again: there is nothing bad about calling NON. I repeat that! .

thanks about the nickname

I disagree with the NON statement - i realize what you're saying about " Nothing Bad about calling us NON" - ofcourse your view.

I appear as a Caucasian male. My Family is white. My Father is white. From my Father's side, My great Great Grandfather is coloured, he was blessed with a fairly light complexion. His parants, mother was black, father was white.

so - honestly, your NON theory don't hold water. I'm as much African as you are, and every other White, Black & Coloured person that's appart of South Africa whether you or anybody else likes it or not.

To judge people as African or NON African by skin color is not logic. My family have lived here, born here in South Africa & Zimbabwe (Rhodesia in those days) they have all contributed in south africa in their own little way, and that makes us african - no matter what anybody says.

Anyway - my episode of Smallville is waiting.

Happy Debating NON

 

[Gunny]

So even though I live in africa have an SA passport and ID and my family has been here for generations I am non african ? how does that work ?

 

[ToxicBunny]

Well to be honest, I trust that census about as much as I trust her Poisonous Ivy to actually do her job properly.

Stats SA has on many occasions had to recall publications because of incorrect data, or calculations. They are far from gospel on anything, and anyway, I still disagree with there classification, I am as African as you and LabAnimal are. None of my ancestors are Black, or Coloured or Indian to my knowledge, but that does not change the fact that I AM African.

In all honesty now that I think about it. Those racial classifications are a legacy of the Apartheid government, and to me it says alot that they haven't been revised in our new Rainbow Nation.

 

[LabAnimal]

wasnt there a big thing about calling people black/white or something - about a year or 2 ago? I thought it was a big no-no to refer to someone as a "black man"... Anybody ???

 

[ToxicBunny]

I would like to know where you get your statistics that ALL "Africans" refer to whites as non-African. I for one am an African and do not refer to whites as non-african. I work with quite a few "Africans", as you call them, and am not referred to as a non-african.

When you make a sweeping statement like that, please do back it up with facts and figures, not heresay and opinion.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Thank you w1z4rd. I was just too tired and lazy to go hunting through dictionary.com. Of course it won't change his mind, he will still insist on calling us non-African because we're colonialist pig-dogs..... anywho....

 

[werner]

Thank you w1z4rd. I was just too tired and lazy to go hunting through dictionary.com. Of course it won't change his mind, he will still insist on calling us non-African because we're colonialist pig-dogs..... anywho....

colonialist pigs....who, coincidentally, are paying his salary right now through our SARS payments.(if he apparently is the diplomat he says he is...and isnt just some lowly broomsweeper on another handy-dandy fact finding mission)