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What Are We Doing As White English Speaking People in SA?
- Thread starter Zoomzoom
- Start date
Ok let's try this again in very plain English. And correct some errors made people who clearly cannot read English. And who jump to six kinds of assumptions before breakfast.
1. I am NOT blinking over 60 years old - I merely associate mostly with people in that age bracket.
2. MOST not blinking ALL Afrikaans people I come into contact with (including apparently a large number of people on this forum) have hang ups up about two things - the English and Black people (and Black people coincidentally also have hang ups about Afrikaans people - I blinking wonder why?).
3. There are several groups looking out for Afrikaans interests in SA, mainly Afriforum as the most public.
4. Afriforum is primarily there to look out for Afrikaans interests. It is in black and white on their website. There is no contesting this. Want to argue the point, go argue with them about what they wrote, and what they meant by it.
They are perfectly entitled to do so and the fact that sometimes their interests coincide with helping others does not in anyway contradict or negate what you can go read on their website with your own two eyes.
5. Given that the 1976 riots and much unhappiness since then revolves around AFRIKAANS and AFRIKAANS people - they ain't singing 'kill the whites' but 'kill the boer' OK and given that English is the chosen medium of education there seems to be a whole lot fewer issues against ENGLISH than there is against Afrikaans.
6. I and many other people can't up and leave. We are stuck here for better or worse.
7. I'd prefer it to be for the better.
8. I think there is an opportunity for ENGLISH speakers to CONTRIBUTE something POSITIVE to the generally very negative dialogue in South Africa that can help mitigate some of the hate, and create a more positive future. At very least we won't run into the automatic hatred that there is for Afrikaans.
(Are you following me?)
So what are we doing? Can we do something? Can we get something going? Can we put a different message out there to counter (like PR type campaign) to provide balance to all the racist garbage that is repeated ad nauseum. Is there anyway to do that that isn't going to be perceived as racist blah blah blah. Because honestly something has to change. We have to start finding ways in which to see each other as human beings, with common interests, with common desires for home, family, job, a decent life and a better future. If we don't stop with hating on each other we are going to end up in serious trouble sooner or later - all of us.
1. I am NOT blinking over 60 years old - I merely associate mostly with people in that age bracket.
2. MOST not blinking ALL Afrikaans people I come into contact with (including apparently a large number of people on this forum) have hang ups up about two things - the English and Black people (and Black people coincidentally also have hang ups about Afrikaans people - I blinking wonder why?).
3. There are several groups looking out for Afrikaans interests in SA, mainly Afriforum as the most public.
4. Afriforum is primarily there to look out for Afrikaans interests. It is in black and white on their website. There is no contesting this. Want to argue the point, go argue with them about what they wrote, and what they meant by it.
They are perfectly entitled to do so and the fact that sometimes their interests coincide with helping others does not in anyway contradict or negate what you can go read on their website with your own two eyes.
5. Given that the 1976 riots and much unhappiness since then revolves around AFRIKAANS and AFRIKAANS people - they ain't singing 'kill the whites' but 'kill the boer' OK and given that English is the chosen medium of education there seems to be a whole lot fewer issues against ENGLISH than there is against Afrikaans.
6. I and many other people can't up and leave. We are stuck here for better or worse.
7. I'd prefer it to be for the better.
8. I think there is an opportunity for ENGLISH speakers to CONTRIBUTE something POSITIVE to the generally very negative dialogue in South Africa that can help mitigate some of the hate, and create a more positive future. At very least we won't run into the automatic hatred that there is for Afrikaans.
(Are you following me?)
So what are we doing? Can we do something? Can we get something going? Can we put a different message out there to counter (like PR type campaign) to provide balance to all the racist garbage that is repeated ad nauseum. Is there anyway to do that that isn't going to be perceived as racist blah blah blah. Because honestly something has to change. We have to start finding ways in which to see each other as human beings, with common interests, with common desires for home, family, job, a decent life and a better future. If we don't stop with hating on each other we are going to end up in serious trouble sooner or later - all of us.
We are following my dear, we are following you perfectly. But once again you're opening your proverbial mouth to change feet. Yes, you are tryign to candy coat it better, but you still miss the plot.
1: Good to hear. Hope you have many more hopefully happier years ahead of you. It seems I may have a bit less left. So take it from a sincere Uncle/Oom who has enjoyed the company of many South Africans, good and bad. Having the advantage of roots in Afrikaans and South African English culture, add farm rural culture, as a kid fighting Dutchmen in kleilat fights, or Souties on the opposite side - depending on who was in which group. I won't even go to the part of black kids who I grew up with as well on the farm, some Madalas who were like family, whom I respected.
2: Actually, my take on what people have said so far is that, while there is a lot of jibing to and fro between English and Afrikaans speaking people, most have long since moved on from 1899-1901. It's also amazing how many people took revenge, marrying across that hate barrier.
The second issue of Black people having issue with Afrikaans as opposed to white people is not quite true. It's more a case of popular narratives and projection, one into which you yourself put your foot into.
3: Afrikaans as a language has been under attack for a long time in history, incidentally starting off with the English in the old Cape Colony, which also gave rise to the Groot Trek. So yes, they are acutely aware of any attack on Afrikaans. Let's also not forget that is is not just the language of the white. The "kombuis" taal came a long way and blood was shed to preserve it.
4: Once again on the Afriforum bandwagon that "is fundamentally racist" (quoting you)? I believe that narrative has been challenged previously, never proven. It is refreshing to see a group of people do exactly what they say and not having been caught out to be dishonest yet, despite many attempts. Hell, I may even consider joining them. While focusing on the Afrikaans aspect of their organization, they have reached out as worthy citizens across language and colour boundaries, helping all South Africans, not only Afrikaans. What you fail to seem to understand, but which they do, is that attacking White Afrikaners is just the thin cutting edge of the wedge. Once Afrikaans goes, what is next? White (English is not special), then Indian, then Coloured. Then tribal wars?
5: Read 4. It also disregards Afrikaans is the home language of many non-white people.
6 & 7: Agreed. Nobody should even have to consider leaving, much less feeling stuck. Incidentally, why do Afrikaners have to defend Afrikaans. As per our constitution, it should not even have been needed, just like you should not have to be thinking about being pushed out of a country you love. If you left out of free will, that is another matter. Us discussing this shows how our politicians and constitution have failed us.
8: I'd change that to South Africans. Once again you're creating even more walls. South Africa is a beautiful country with beautiful people. Even in some of the more negative normal living moments, it brings out the best in us. As opposed to creating more differences, we need something, pride. We all are survivors. Much as anybody says we mustn't be proud of being white/black/..., it is part of our traditions that makes us what we are, what we are leaving for the future. Being proud also sets the high bar for future achievements. If we see ourselves as victims, we will be conquered, even if only politically (and we know how politicians can twist anything). What we need is pride, a national pride, uniting us all. Tbh, we have so much going for us, if we can't make it, we only have ourselves to blame.
Unfortunately we have much flaming by politicians who haven't got a clue. Do you know JvR arrived at the Cape 2000 years ago ...? Really? WTF!? Are these our "leaders". Ever heard JM talk about how his people civilized the whites? At first I thought it was somebody having the mickey. It may even be where ... Chicken got the idea of Big John conquering Europe from. At least the ad was funny. Yet politicians are the ones in control, setting the stage for success or failure, because we let them.
We as South Africans need some serious sit down time across colour/language borders to first figure out what our history really is, understand why we are here today. Even now history is repeating. What is not needed is political/self serving discourse and trolls.
1: Good to hear. Hope you have many more hopefully happier years ahead of you. It seems I may have a bit less left. So take it from a sincere Uncle/Oom who has enjoyed the company of many South Africans, good and bad. Having the advantage of roots in Afrikaans and South African English culture, add farm rural culture, as a kid fighting Dutchmen in kleilat fights, or Souties on the opposite side - depending on who was in which group. I won't even go to the part of black kids who I grew up with as well on the farm, some Madalas who were like family, whom I respected.
2: Actually, my take on what people have said so far is that, while there is a lot of jibing to and fro between English and Afrikaans speaking people, most have long since moved on from 1899-1901. It's also amazing how many people took revenge, marrying across that hate barrier.
The second issue of Black people having issue with Afrikaans as opposed to white people is not quite true. It's more a case of popular narratives and projection, one into which you yourself put your foot into.
3: Afrikaans as a language has been under attack for a long time in history, incidentally starting off with the English in the old Cape Colony, which also gave rise to the Groot Trek. So yes, they are acutely aware of any attack on Afrikaans. Let's also not forget that is is not just the language of the white. The "kombuis" taal came a long way and blood was shed to preserve it.
4: Once again on the Afriforum bandwagon that "is fundamentally racist" (quoting you)? I believe that narrative has been challenged previously, never proven. It is refreshing to see a group of people do exactly what they say and not having been caught out to be dishonest yet, despite many attempts. Hell, I may even consider joining them. While focusing on the Afrikaans aspect of their organization, they have reached out as worthy citizens across language and colour boundaries, helping all South Africans, not only Afrikaans. What you fail to seem to understand, but which they do, is that attacking White Afrikaners is just the thin cutting edge of the wedge. Once Afrikaans goes, what is next? White (English is not special), then Indian, then Coloured. Then tribal wars?
5: Read 4. It also disregards Afrikaans is the home language of many non-white people.
6 & 7: Agreed. Nobody should even have to consider leaving, much less feeling stuck. Incidentally, why do Afrikaners have to defend Afrikaans. As per our constitution, it should not even have been needed, just like you should not have to be thinking about being pushed out of a country you love. If you left out of free will, that is another matter. Us discussing this shows how our politicians and constitution have failed us.
8: I'd change that to South Africans. Once again you're creating even more walls. South Africa is a beautiful country with beautiful people. Even in some of the more negative normal living moments, it brings out the best in us. As opposed to creating more differences, we need something, pride. We all are survivors. Much as anybody says we mustn't be proud of being white/black/..., it is part of our traditions that makes us what we are, what we are leaving for the future. Being proud also sets the high bar for future achievements. If we see ourselves as victims, we will be conquered, even if only politically (and we know how politicians can twist anything). What we need is pride, a national pride, uniting us all. Tbh, we have so much going for us, if we can't make it, we only have ourselves to blame.
Unfortunately we have much flaming by politicians who haven't got a clue. Do you know JvR arrived at the Cape 2000 years ago ...? Really? WTF!? Are these our "leaders". Ever heard JM talk about how his people civilized the whites? At first I thought it was somebody having the mickey. It may even be where ... Chicken got the idea of Big John conquering Europe from. At least the ad was funny. Yet politicians are the ones in control, setting the stage for success or failure, because we let them.
We as South Africans need some serious sit down time across colour/language borders to first figure out what our history really is, understand why we are here today. Even now history is repeating. What is not needed is political/self serving discourse and trolls.
- Joined
- Nov 14, 2007
- Messages
- 4,353
ESSA are in a minority ( English speaking ) within a minority ( white South Africans )
As much as is denied I am afraid we ARE different ( I am NOT claiming superiority )
What ESSA need to do is interact in an open and friendly manner as much as possible with Afrikaans speaking South Africans in order to find and encourage the similarities ( there are many ) While STILL keeping their unique South African identity.
There is NOTHING stopping them propagating the same message -- with common interests, with common desires for home, family, job, a decent life and a better future
Whatever Afriforum and other organisations may say or think -- in the end we will ALL be together in the same trench
It is time to get over / past the history and think about the future.
UNITED WE STAND DIVIDED WE FALL !
( Now please sent photos of pretty and beguiling Boere Meisies .......... )
As much as is denied I am afraid we ARE different ( I am NOT claiming superiority )
What ESSA need to do is interact in an open and friendly manner as much as possible with Afrikaans speaking South Africans in order to find and encourage the similarities ( there are many ) While STILL keeping their unique South African identity.
There is NOTHING stopping them propagating the same message -- with common interests, with common desires for home, family, job, a decent life and a better future
Whatever Afriforum and other organisations may say or think -- in the end we will ALL be together in the same trench
It is time to get over / past the history and think about the future.
UNITED WE STAND DIVIDED WE FALL !
( Now please sent photos of pretty and beguiling Boere Meisies .......... )
- Joined
- Nov 14, 2007
- Messages
- 4,353
FTFY
I am told the "Boere" ones bake good , obey orders , and do not give k@k
Not to mention -- kat in die donker
KNYP
Sounds good to me ..????
That would include a rather descriptive group of people that will tell you directly "jou ma se ..."
At one of the companies I worked, there was a large group of the Coloured community. They tend to call a spade a spade, also a great sense of humour. Racism? no, rather acknowledgement of a group with probably the sharpest wit. Said company had a fish pond at the entrance/exit, near to the director's office. It had quite a few goldfish in it. Then retrenchments started. One afternoon as we were leaving, we passed the pond. It had been cleaned, only two goldfish left in it. From the group directly in front of us, just about hard enough to be heard on the other side of South Africa, nvm the director:
Haai, waar's jul maaitjies? Is hull ook ge-retrench?
I was totally broken, so was everybody in the area. The above incident was probably also the tamest I remember. I had to fix something next to two ladies, one discussing her previous night's date ... Nvm, wait, I'll get into trouble here.
At one of the companies I worked, there was a large group of the Coloured community. They tend to call a spade a spade, also a great sense of humour. Racism? no, rather acknowledgement of a group with probably the sharpest wit. Said company had a fish pond at the entrance/exit, near to the director's office. It had quite a few goldfish in it. Then retrenchments started. One afternoon as we were leaving, we passed the pond. It had been cleaned, only two goldfish left in it. From the group directly in front of us, just about hard enough to be heard on the other side of South Africa, nvm the director:
Haai, waar's jul maaitjies? Is hull ook ge-retrench?
I was totally broken, so was everybody in the area. The above incident was probably also the tamest I remember. I had to fix something next to two ladies, one discussing her previous night's date ... Nvm, wait, I'll get into trouble here.