Sign up with GoogleAnd people actually want to live in Auckland as apposed to JHB
Luckily after all that saving on private security, healthcare, and education one has more disposable income to buy property.
Really? Enough to buy a $500,000 house??
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Whites leaving SA in droves
- Thread starter EtienneK
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Really? Enough to buy a $500,000 house??
UnoPanelvan
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If you have a friend or family there, go visit, while you are there find a job and apply for workpermit and temporary residence. Works well. I know about a few that used the exact same way to go there and some now have permanent residence after 2 years. They sold everything, went over there and never returned. Simple as that.
Look people, Skinner is CORRECT that house prices are more expensive in many first world countries including and especially Aus and NZ ... this is an easily verifiable fact and impossible to reasonably pretend is not the case.
BUT I disagree that that's an argument *at all* in favor of ZA. Houses are more expensive there because generally speaking you get what you pay for.
It's not just the house itself, you are buying a location - you get to live in an environment of much greater safety where you don't have to worry all the time about getting hijacked in the driveway or about your house being invaded by a gang wielding AK47's eager to gang-rape your wife before they execute you in front of your children ... your kids can safely play in the park or ride their bikes etc. ... heck man if you can afford it then you can't put a price on such things, we can do the whole Mastercard cliché:
House in SA - R1,200,000
Emigrating to Aus - R100,000
Buying a house in Aus - R3,500,000
Knowing you can live and raise your family in a safe, decent environment where your kids have a future - PRICELESS
There's a reason the NZ'ers and Aussies aren't falling over themselves to try get into SA to come take advantage of our cheap beautiful houses. Hell I'd almost rather go live in the gutter there than in a mansion here.
So if the prices of property are so high there...
What about the cost of living?
What about the taxes? Do you know how high the tax bracket is in AUS?
Are you also aware of how they treat you there if youre an immigrant?
SA is fine for me, for the moment, even with the problems!
What about the cost of living?
What about the taxes? Do you know how high the tax bracket is in AUS?
Are you also aware of how they treat you there if youre an immigrant?
SA is fine for me, for the moment, even with the problems!
Done the math, with my skills I'll be better off there financially (though buying a house will hurt a bit).
Yeah I have a family member who has been in Aus about a year who reports that "everyone" has been "extremely" friendly and helpful and welcoming ... there are several SAns in the same community and all are treated like that. Might just be the town she lives in, but that's one anecdote.
When I was in NZ I was never treated anything but well by the NZers, nor my friend who had emigrated there.
(In the UK though South Africans definitely don't get a warm welcome mat rolled out for them, at all ... so this differs from country to country.)
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This is true, however, what you are conveniently leaving out is that when you move there you NO LONGER GET PAID RANDS. You will be able to afford your R3.5m house because you will be earning more money and have more disposable income.
WRONG.
EPIC, EPIC FAIL.
This is one of the biggest myths South Africans actually believe about overseas countries!!
1) A big chuck of that extra money you earn, is eaten up by social taxes (n/a in some countries).
2) A big chuck of that extra money you earn, is eaten up by other higher living costs.
3) An average programming position in Europe can earn you around €50,000 (R600k per year). After taxes you have €25,000 (R300k per year). SA: R480k per year, after taxes: R288k. So in this case you earn a whopping R12k PER YEAR more in Europe. Plus all the work-stress, emmigration stress and costs, etc. Whoopee-ding.
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That is also true, I think. It just especially 'hurts' me though because I've actually more or less just managed to pay off my little townhouse here in SA, and was really warming up to the idea of finally being debt-free
... now I want to emigrate and the value of my townhouse will barely cover a deposit overseas, so I'll have to get used to the idea that I will have to go back into debt for a very long time, maybe even 20 years. Of course that's probably what most people have to do so maybe I shouldn't act so 'spoiled'.SA: R480k per year, after taxes: R288k. So in this case you earn a whopping R12k PER YEAR more in Europe. Plus all the work-stress, emmigration stress and costs, etc. Whoopee-ding.
Hmm, I'm a programmer and wish I was earning R480K/year. I suppose I could get a job like that if I shopped around, though I'd have to work harder and have less time to post on forums like this
(Actually it's a little more complicated because I have my own business, so I'm simplifying a little.)I have crime-and-safety-stress, which right now I'd be willing to try trade for other kinds of stress.
It's true that with skilled work, especially programming and especially if you're good (and slightly less lazy than me), you can earn good salaries anywhere, and if you're careful I'll concede you may be able to save more in SA. But money isn't everything, you also have to weigh that against quality of life issues ... the other factor is having money/assets in Rands is going to be dodgy if the Rand does a Zim$. I'd prefer to own assets denominated in currencies that have a better chance of retaining value over the 30 - 50 years I'll probably still live. Even that you can mitigate though --- my biggest worries really are crime and political instability/uncertainty. That and it's hard to find good programmers in SA for my business.
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onebrickshort
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That is also true, I think. It just especially 'hurts' me though because I've actually more or less just managed to pay off my little townhouse here in SA, and was really warming up to the idea of finally being debt-free
Depends where you move. If you move to say, Miami you can pick up a mansion or a penthouse for next to nothing.Everyones almost in forclosure and compared to SA prices- it's actually cheaper in Miami and with those interest rates you don't have a millstone around your neck for ever. In any case, the UK and Eire housing markets are cooling quicker than Rooikrans coals after a fire so now is not the time to buy. Wait for the prices to drop at least another 20% and in Eire between 20-40% over the next 12 months.
There are positions like this in Cape Town and JHB. For around 5+ years programming experience.Hmm, I'm a programmer and wish I was earning R480K/year. I suppose I could get a job like that if I shopped around, though I'd have to work harder and have less time to post on forums like this
Probably in other fields, there are similar examples. Point is, I just illustrated that assuming you will ALWAYS earn SUBSTANTIALLY more doing the same job in a 1st world country, is not always the case.
Yep, that's pretty much how it is.
I had and will have no QoL issues living in the right suburb in CPT. So does many other people in SA and so can YOU.
Invest in foreign currency.
Exactly as I proposed in my previous sentence, even before I read this one of yours!
Invest in foreign currency.
Exactly as I proposed in my previous sentence, even before I read this one of yours!
Yup, you can invest your extra cash in foreign currency, sure ... but what you can't change so easily is the value of your house, which for most people ends up being the most valuable thing they'll ever own :/ ... most spare cash tends to get sunk into that primary property. So if we do have 'Zim 2' and the property loses most it's value and then you try emigrate, you could lose a lot.
Being in Gauteng that clouds my view and it's true I could definitely get a better-than-Gauteng quality of life elsewhere while remaining in SA (I really like Stellenbosch for example), but if I think long-term e.g. 20 or 30 years out I cannot picture it anymore, I can't see it remaining stable that long ... and I don't want to risk having to try emigrate when I'm much older. I think the Cape is just five to ten years behind the curve of whatever happens in Gauteng.
onebrickshort: Thx, will google Miami real estate, see if I can get an idea ...
What is the best way to invest in foreign currency now, if you have spare cash and want to get some money overseas, for "just in case".
I've been looking at Isle of Man which standard bank can do, to open the account. Or is it better to use a broker from there or even a different bank?
I am nervous to wait until next year when I go overseas to do this, as our rand may drop drastically by then. If it doesn't, I can always take out more on my tourist/overseas travel limit and add to the account when I am there, without incurring the transfer fees, but not sure which bank or method is best to use.
Any suggestions?
I've been looking at Isle of Man which standard bank can do, to open the account. Or is it better to use a broker from there or even a different bank?
I am nervous to wait until next year when I go overseas to do this, as our rand may drop drastically by then. If it doesn't, I can always take out more on my tourist/overseas travel limit and add to the account when I am there, without incurring the transfer fees, but not sure which bank or method is best to use.
Any suggestions?
LancelotSA
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Read more: http://www.int.iol.co.za/index.php?...click_id=79&art_id=nw20080722175042996C148079
Kind of sad, but understandable
I'm making a point of it to see the world. Once I'm back from Brazil, I'm going to visit Australia and Europe... Things in SA are not good...
Kind of funny how the increased number of people selling and giving the reason as emigration seems to correlate perfectly with the rising interest rates.
Some people just find it easier to blame crime than admitting they cannot handle their finances properly. I know three individuals who are leaving as they are battling here, through their own bad decisions, and see the grass as being greener! Two of these are using the fact that if they up and leave they can get their hands on their provident fund money when they resign as a further motivating factor!!
Nick London
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Move in / Move Out
Views wanted...
I grew up in Lagos for 13 years. We saw the decline of Rhodesia and now hopefully not SA.
But I still believe in Africa. Is it nuts to think about relocating now to SA or even Zimbabwe?
There will always be money to be made, even if it seems obsure now.
Nick
Views wanted...
I grew up in Lagos for 13 years. We saw the decline of Rhodesia and now hopefully not SA.
But I still believe in Africa. Is it nuts to think about relocating now to SA or even Zimbabwe?
There will always be money to be made, even if it seems obsure now.
Nick
UnoPanelvan
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Well those that left hardly return. Living is good so is medical care and other expected public services which your tax pay for.
Those that return is mostly those that could not make it there and was as useless there as the were in SA. There is those that return for personal reasons but mostly they do not want to come back to their self inflicted lock in jails style lifestyle we are becoming so accustomed too.