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Whites leaving SA in droves
- Thread starter EtienneK
- Start date
Simple but important question then:
Do you believe you tried everything in your power to improve things for yourself in SA (employment, your safety, etc.) before you decided to leave?
I don't think Jesus is the problem....
LOL so you lived in the "good times"(only for some) and pissed off when the going got a bit though?
LOL
You talk to much, ag shame poor little pansy boy sitting STILL moaning about SA.
What does that help genius?
Lol, you are either to lazy or to scared to do anything constructive, or maybe both....
Now you just sit and complain. People like you are what is wrong with the world. Always moaning and never DOING anything.
Like I said nothing will ever be solved with running away.
‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’ (or run away)
There have been other nations that have turned their countries around. I still have hope for this country and yes the day that I have NO more hope and know that I have done my best to make a difference then I will leave.
But that day is far in the future, if ever.
I don't think Jesus is the problem....
LOL so you lived in the "good times"(only for some) and pissed off when the going got a bit though?
LOL
You talk to much, ag shame poor little pansy boy sitting STILL moaning about SA.
What does that help genius?
Lol, you are either to lazy or to scared to do anything constructive, or maybe both....
Now you just sit and complain. People like you are what is wrong with the world. Always moaning and never DOING anything.
Devill although you and me seem to be on the same side regarding this topic, I don't think it is necessary to grind him like that, let's rather discuss the issues constructively or maybe even offer him some advice if that's what he would like.
We all have our own opinions but there are a wealth of information and advice to be shared; my 3 main words of advice for "pulling it" in SA are:
1) be in the right profession (~ employment)
2) live in the Western Cape (~ security)
3) have a positive attitude (~ life)
If you can manage the above 3 cornerstones then you still have a very good chance of living a very good life in SA.
All the people I know who are successfull in SA nowadays, I have observed the abovementioned 3 cornerstones in.
And it is actually ironic that people are willing to go through all the effort and costs of emmigrating, when they can (in my opinion) rather channel the same effort and less costs into the 3 abovementioned tasks to achieve good chances of good results.
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You are right, I am sorry.
But he does deserve to be disillusioned about himself and his self-justified attitude.
I just don't like people who run away and then critisize.
I agree 100% with point 1 & 3.
Point 2 is up for debate.
There are still a couple of suburbs in G'teng that are safe and secure. Ours was rated one of the safest in SA. 1 murder and 12 house robberies in 2006. I have been living here for 23 years now and in my street there hs only been 3 breakins in that time.
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Dude, my safety is not under my control. I live in a compound, with electric fences, 24 hr armed response etc. And still the f*ckers managed to get in. I am not willing any longer to give up MY freedom so that I can stay alive in this place. For what? Why should I pay 40% taxes, to get no decent health care, no support from Police in crime prevention, roads in a state not even mentionable, just to line the pockets of corrupt politicians I have no power over getting elected? And yes, I do vote, but in the end, what difference does it make? The masses will ALWAYS vote for the ANC, that is tradition. And wait until the day that the election officials count the votes and find another party won, do you think the likes of Jacob Zuma and Cosatu will freely give up power to another party? Think hard about that one. Look around and you will see. A quote jumps to mind: "Eliminate the counter-revolutionary forces". WTF do you think that means???
marine1
Honorary Master
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2006
- Messages
- 49,503
Rubbish. Who says so? You? You dont have the right to tell anyone what they can or cannot do.
I don't think Jesus is the problem....
LOL so you lived in the "good times"(only for some) and pissed off when the going got a bit though?
LOL
You talk to much, ag shame poor little pansy boy sitting STILL moaning about SA.
What does that help genius?
Lol, you are either to lazy or to scared to do anything constructive, or maybe both....
Now you just sit and complain. People like you are what is wrong with the world. Always moaning and never DOING anything.
the reason i left is i believe there is nothing that can be done. the only people who can really make a huge difference in the country at national level for the better and resolve the problems sa faces are the government. i just dont see the anc being capable of doing that. going by track record i dont see any african government capable of doing it. and life overseas is just soo much easier.
See there is a saying "No single raindrop thought it was responsible for the flood"
Ps I don't have a problem with people that leave, but then they lose all right to comment.
thats ridiculous, it like saying you have no right to have an opinion on the springboks because you dont play for them.
Don't you think that is an infantile approach? Goodness, makes me think of kindergarten when the annoying kid would stick his fingers in his ears singing "na na na na naaaa naaaa", to not hear the voice of reason. Whatever, dude, I do think people have the right to comment on WHATEVER they want to. People leaving still have an interest here, most of us have families staying behind, business interests, investments etc. So, yeah, we can comment! And we will! And maybe we can open the eyes of some poor f*cker who might end up dead tomorrow, and get him out of this place before that happens!
But then why not try a safer suburb?
Did you leave immediately after that or did you try a safer suburb or maybe another province or area in SA?
Which suburb was this BTW?
Dude, taxes are always unfair, no matter where you are in the world. Even in highly civilised 1st world countries, people complain about their taxes being abused, not visible, breaking roads, whatever. Some people even make a living of it, complaining about unfair taxes. Leaving SA for that reason will not make much difference, I can tell you that. Seriously.
SA taxes are still low relative to 1st world countries, mainly because of all the additional social taxes you have to pay there. I guess you are not complaining that you don't have to pay any social taxes in SA, now do you? And even if you consider the tax you pay in SA as being used for social purposes anyway in SA, it is still less than most 1st world countries.
And then we will not even start about the costs of things in 1st world countries. Do you think SA is the only country in the world where things get more expensive? Ha. You should see Europe / Australia / Americas. Skyrocketing at Mach 10 would be an understatement.
So what? What is the direct effect this has on you? Let's say you have a good job in SA, you live in a good house, have a car, your kids go to good schools, and the whole shebang. What do you care if the masses vote ANC? If you are happy in your current lifestyle, does it really matter?
Personally I will wait until that day comes, if it does, and see it with my own eyes.
Until then, I will follow my 3 cornerstones and try make a better life for myself in SA. There is no reason why, if you want to emmigrate now, you should not be able to emmigrate later.
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Who says one man can't make a difference?
Everyone is running away in fear and thats just what some people want, i won't say it isn't so.
I think if even each of us south africans are left just tries and makes a difference we can, but only if we really want to, because negative attitudes are not going to help anything!!!
Regards
Peder
Everyone is running away in fear and thats just what some people want, i won't say it isn't so.
I think if even each of us south africans are left just tries and makes a difference we can, but only if we really want to, because negative attitudes are not going to help anything!!!
Regards
Peder
Ok I will explain this....slowly: It is like saying you cant comment on the springboks if you don't support them.
What do you know about Russia's rugby team? mmm very little I am guessing. Is it maybe because you don't have an intrest in them....
You are right, I can't stop you from commenting on SA. Just don't expect to be taken seriously.
How can you comment on the general situation in SA if you are not living here anymore?
It is like me commenting on the general situation in England. (I have family friends and business intrests there, I also lived there for a year)
Nothing that can be done about other people's problems or nothing that can be done about your problems? What was the case? Did you leave because of other people's problems or your own? If the latter, are you for yourself convinced you did all you could to alleviate them, and it did not work?
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TooFastTim
Expert Member
- Joined
- Nov 15, 2006
- Messages
- 2,017
I tell you what, I'll stop calling you a git when you stop patronising me.
Now I will answer you questions:
Firstly I knew many people who were murdered in CT, offhand probably numbering about 50.
I said I'm sure there are many engineers who get high paying jobs. How long before they too are put out to grass at 30 or 35. Eskom is quite explicit, they will offer CONTRACTS to engineers they laid off. During the tenure of their contract they must train (usually a black female soc sci grad, and completely unsuited to the job) somebody to do their job. Then what do they do?
(Once again) As I mentioned there are many engineers who couldn't get employment. It is these (and the above contracted engineers) who are leaving or intend to leave.
Tax: less tax period, VAT or PAYE. And I see the benefits. Reliable water, electricty, a brilliant roads infrastructure. I pay NO schoolfees and the govt schools my kids attend are on a par with the (very) expensive private school they attended in Cape Town. The state healthcare here is superb. The local state hospital resembles a 4 star hotel and the surgeons/doctors are (mostly) ex South Africans. Doesn't get any better.
I'm not forcing you to leave SA, whether you choose to remain is your indaba. However what I am trying to do is make people realize how serious the situation is regarding SA treatment of white skills, the sheer volume of those people who have emmigrated or are (very) likely to do in the near future and the logical consequences of continuing to treat those skill so shabilly, i.e. their flight and the subsequent collapse of infrastructure. This can be seen in the awful pickle in which Eskom now finds itself. Did you know that the loadshedding has aged the distribution/switching infrastructure so much that the ENTIRE countries switching networks needs to be replaced?
Your OE: sorry you are correct. I should have ommitted 'brief'.
Culture? I'm afraid the govts opinion differs from you. They don't give a toss about your culture, or their own for that matter, and they can and possibly will take it away from you.
I assume you've heard the expression "Those who cannot remember history are condemned to repeat it"? Well this govt has repeated every mistake made in post independence Africa. Why should the result be different?
Experience: 20 years. Electronics (control and instrumentation), 10 years in nuclear. 15 years C/C++, SQL, micros, Delphi etc. I applied to the PBMR. No reply. I applied to Koeberg and their numerous contractors. Zip. Nada.
Devill, I worked in job that payed crap but gave me tremendous experience (see above), so don't come with the "fair weather friend" argument. You and your ilk fail to realize that the people who left are a) extremely skilled and the very sort of people that the country needs and b) feel betrayed by the country (or more specifically the govt). Those people were also prepared to pitch in and build for more than ten years. They have now realized that they are not wanted and their attempted or possible contributions are not valued. Like me many were taxpayers for many years and have every right to criticise.
So how long do you remain when you are unable to earn money, you get shot at? Your house broken into, your car stolen and told you are lower than a snakes belly? How long do you beat your head against a wall?
i ran a free introduction to programming course for the black kids that worked for us for a while to try and motivate them to do something with thier lives other than being data capturers. i did my best to try and transfer my linux skills onto to my bee juniors. i would say i gave it a good try it. it was a couple years of my weekends being screwed. honestly i think we're just swimming upstream. the responsibility of education and social upliftment lies on the government not the private sector. imo the countries ills are far to complex to ever be solved in my lifetime. if you want to sacrifice your life for future generation well good for you. i would rather enjoy mine
if you have been in IT for 28 years and then change to being a mechanic does your IT knowledge become void?
and i can tell you the all blacks dont support the springboks but thier opinion on them is probably alot more informed than the majority of springbok supporters
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LOL
Nope but who would you trust, the person with the up to date IT knowlage or you that has been out of IT for a year or 2?
Thus you can not comment on CURRENT events.
Because the all-blacks tour here a lot and because they have INTREST in the springboks. Ever hear how the majority of ABs have respect for SA? Do I need to elaborate on this?
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