Why I left South Africa and what can be done to keep IT execs in the country

MidnightWizard

Expert Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2007
Messages
4,818
Can't help wondering why you have such a deadly fear for the 'Jopie Fouries'......
Let me remind you of what something some very famous people wrote...
I am not
I AM afraid on YOUR behalf -- die K@K wat jy kwyt raak

Give me two divisions of those marvellous fighting Boers

You see old chap -- THOSE "Boers" were the ones fighting AGAINST Germany
( The same ones that supported Smuts and Botha in 1914 -- the SAME ones that executed Jopie Fourie
While the "Boers" YOU ( and others support ) were joing the OBW -- an organisation that SUPPPORTED HITLER

BIG DIFFERENCE !

PLEASE try and get your facts -- right !
 

Lew Skannen

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Jun 20, 2012
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2,903
I am not
I AM afraid on YOUR behalf -- die K@K wat jy kwyt raak

Give me two divisions of those marvellous fighting Boers

You see old chap -- THOSE "Boers" were the ones fighting AGAINST Germany
( The same ones that supported Smuts and Botha in 1914 -- the SAME ones that executed Jopie Fourie
While the "Boers" YOU ( and others support ) were joing the OBW -- an organisation that SUPPPORTED HITLER

BIG DIFFERENCE !

PLEASE try and get your facts -- right !
You clearly lack a massive knowledge of history. I'll leave it right here.
 

cda

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2005
Messages
541
Clearly doesn’t take long for any thread about South Africa to be taken over by the crackpot right wing Afrikaaners. WHO always RANDOMLY type in CAPS.
 

InfidelGastro

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Joined
May 21, 2018
Messages
1,274
People like this should just leave... and if you have left already move on and leave the ret of us in our beautiful “shithole” where we are happy.
It looks like you've already made your bed but only you have to sleep in it. One of these days you'll be rudely awoken by the facts that you've shortsightedly and obtusely chosen to ignore. Wake up now man, smell the sewage and do something about it. If you don't, you may just live long enough to regret your naivety.
Personally speaking, I couldn't care any less if you do or if you don't, it's entirely up to you. Patriotism is for fools and the narrow minded.
 

Brenden_E

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Aug 30, 2006
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4,237
Good execs will still get opportunities in spite of BEE. These must be people who rose to management just because they were white even though they were not qualified.
There's a ceiling. I worked in one of the banks and we had one the best execs I have ever worked with. The man was truly amazing. Restructuring happened and he was overlooked because he was white. Left the country shortly thereafter.

About two months later, his stand in who is also white, also quit the company for the same reason.
These are not the type of people you can just replace. RSA is much poorer without them.
 

Beyond.Celsus

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May 29, 2018
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1,883
I have no illusions about this country and if I was able, I would also probably leave.

However.

All those who have left, yet still feels the need to hang around these forums giving their opinions about what is going on here should rather just stay out of it.
So I agree.
You left. Why still so obsessed with what is going on here? Why the constant need to inject your views regarding a country you abandoned?

Quite frankly
Every time someone comes on here to state 'I am so glad I left' I feel like strangling them.
It's obnoxious and conceited.

Good for you. No need to brag about it.
 

Chris_the_Brit

High Tory
Joined
Mar 6, 2004
Messages
26,404
I have no illusions about this country and if I was able, I would also probably leave.

However.

All those who have left, yet still feels the need to hang around these forums giving their opinions about what is going on here should rather just stay out of it.
So I agree.
You left. Why still so obsessed with what is going on here? Why the constant need to inject your views regarding a country you abandoned?

Quite frankly
Every time someone comes on here to state 'I am so glad I left' I feel like strangling them.
It's obnoxious and conceited.

Good for you. No need to brag about it.
Many people who have left SA have family and friends here....
 

Milano

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Joined
Feb 7, 2004
Messages
12,281
I’ve also never experienced any Saffer specific toxicity.
No I just mean it is a toxic environment in terms of inheriting much of the same political/racial nonsense that one tried to escape. There are better options globally.
 

Chris_the_Brit

High Tory
Joined
Mar 6, 2004
Messages
26,404
You don't need to comment on this forum about how 'glad you are' for leaving to speak with them now do you?
I have not seen an expat on this forum do this on a constant basis. I have seen interjections - say when there is a power crisis that they are glad they don't have to worry about electricity interruptions - which is fine by me.
 

maumau

Honorary Master
Joined
Aug 13, 2009
Messages
13,609
Many people who have left SA have family and friends here....
.... and have spent their lives here so obviously can relate. Where they are people don't know their schools, their neighbourhood, the shopping centres, cars and things we generally discuss on myBB.

Obviously they'll hang around here for a while.
 

Barbarian Conan

Expert Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2017
Messages
1,306
I have no illusions about this country and if I was able, I would also probably leave.

However.

All those who have left, yet still feels the need to hang around these forums giving their opinions about what is going on here should rather just stay out of it.
So I agree.
You left. Why still so obsessed with what is going on here? Why the constant need to inject your views regarding a country you abandoned?

Quite frankly
Every time someone comes on here to state 'I am so glad I left' I feel like strangling them.
It's obnoxious and conceited.

Good for you. No need to brag about it.
There are many South Africans hanging around giving their opinions about the US, even though they have never lived there. What's so strange about reading and giving opinions about a country that was your home for 25+ years, that you still have many friends in and actually care about?

It is also human to compare the two less-than-ideal paths regularly when you have been forced to choose one, to reassure yourself that you made the right choice.
I would say most people who left wishes that SA could be in such a state that they did not feel the need to leave.
 

Kryptonite

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 14, 2006
Messages
317
It's not lekker to have to leave, let's all just agree on that point. I think every single person here wants to see our beautiful country succeed however there are literally blockers to that such as

1. Continuous vitriol against white / indian and coloured people by the EFF / BLF who are only going to get larger support bases.
2. BEE
3. Rampant corruption and tribal mentality.

We are about to jump ship and to be honest, i wish we could stay. The only reason we doing it is for our kid and no other, i reckon this generation born in the 70's to 90's would survive and be ok if we didnt have kids, however our kids will have to go through worse so in reality there is no other choice but to leave where they wont be discriminated against.
 

SlinkyMike

Executive Member
Joined
Jan 23, 2006
Messages
5,848
IT exec here who left recently.

I didn’t leave for money, and I have no children. I left because the stress of seeing people suffer and being exposed to the rampant race based politics and ostrich-head-in-the-sand attitude like yours signald the end of rational thought and any interest in making things better.

Probably you are not exposed to IT management politics but due to the growing void of competence in the hiring base and massive corruption above it simply became impossible to do business or make any real impact to rapidly collapsing infrastructure.

The economic situation has killed IT budgets nearly everywhere, along with out investments and savings, and companies have outsourced almost everything to money grabbing useless management consultants for the kick backs and because they are unable to get competent staff with the funds available to them.

Unless you want to click buttons in a web interface and spend your life talking to idiots there is no more IT happening in SA, people are not innovating and they have no imagination or drive left.

And of course, computers don’t work terribly well without electricity.

Sorry to say if you are one of the many millions not fortunate enough to qualify for immigration but your future is very very bleak for the next few years.
Translation: I'm brainwashed by right wing propaganda and so I'm running away screaming with my panties in a twist.

Apart from the fact that we do in fact have loadshedding, nothing in your post is fact, it's just histrionics from a rightwing sissy. Africa is not for sissies.

Good execs will still get opportunities in spite of BEE. These must be people who rose to management just because they were white even though they were not qualified.
This has been my experience. In most cases, especially for specialist roles there are very few BEE candidates and so the roles go to non-BEE candidates. One might take issue with BEE candidates getting first shot but that is the nature of reparations. You are free to not like that. I'd prefer it weren't the case but apartheid happened and we must all pay the price now. Blame the Nats if you need someone to blame.

When you come to think about it, there is no good reason to suffer in this sh1thole of a country. Get out while you still can and enjoy what's left of your life. Leave this country to it's inevitable fate. It's not going to end well.
Citation needed.

Is not difficult to predict South Africa's future. #LiveWithIt
If you are able to do this then you must be like Rain Man for the JSE. Are you an investment guru, because buddy you should be with this kind of knowledge.

But you're not are you? You're just a whiny white oke on MyBB talking out your ass.

The ANC has failed this country in each and every aspect possible. There is not one single good thing they did from 1994.
Go tell this to the folks who lived in shacks with no electricity that now live in RDP homes with running water and solar panels.

There's a ceiling. I worked in one of the banks and we had one the best execs I have ever worked with. The man was truly amazing. Restructuring happened and he was overlooked because he was white. Left the country shortly thereafter.

About two months later, his stand in who is also white, also quit the company for the same reason.
These are not the type of people you can just replace. RSA is much poorer without them.
I have seen this too. It's tough as hell but it's not as tough as coming from a subset of the population that was systematically oppressed for 50 years.

Cases like the one you have raised are rough when you look through a 5 year lens, woden that window to 50 years and the perspective changes dramatically.

The guy you mention had every opportunity to achieve at the level that he did. He's risen to a high level in the corporate world through hard work and intelligence. Imagine trying to do that if you grew up in a village in Limpopo, hell, imagine simply trying to get into university when you are the first person in your family to be able to read.

I have no illusions about this country and if I was able, I would also probably leave.

However.

All those who have left, yet still feels the need to hang around these forums giving their opinions about what is going on here should rather just stay out of it.
So I agree.
You left. Why still so obsessed with what is going on here? Why the constant need to inject your views regarding a country you abandoned?

Quite frankly
Every time someone comes on here to state 'I am so glad I left' I feel like strangling them.
It's obnoxious and conceited.

Good for you. No need to brag about it.
Emigration is tough as hell. I think a lot of people go through periods of profound regret. What you are seeing is buyer's remorse essentially. I also think many folks eventually get over this and fully embrace their new identity.
 

Brenden_E

Expert Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2006
Messages
4,237
The guy you mention had every opportunity to achieve at the level that he did. He's risen to a high level in the corporate world through hard work and intelligence. Imagine trying to do that if you grew up in a village in Limpopo, hell, imagine simply trying to get into university when you are the first person in your family to be able to read.
And it's incomprehensible that we as a society now put thousands, possibly hundreds of thousands of jobs and our economy at risk to give a kid from Limpopo that's not the best there is a chance to be an exec. For example standard bank just fired more than a thousand employees. But at least they have a black CE. Lungisa Fuzile is a smart man, but he's nowhere near the best our country has to offer - there's a price to pay for one person to have his ego stroked.

Hey, South Africa is sitting in the dark. But at least...

If education is on par the cream will rise to the top. Companies want to make money and they will hire the best and smartest talent out there, regardless of skin color.
 

SlinkyMike

Executive Member
Joined
Jan 23, 2006
Messages
5,848
Lungisa Fuzile is a smart man, but he's nowhere near the best our country has to offer - there's a price to pay for one person to have his ego stroked.
You can't really believe that BEE is about stroking egos, that is very disingenuous.

Clearly the country could not carry on in the way that it had been up until 1994, the changes we are seeing are an effort to make the requisite changes. Like you (I think) I have some reservations about how this is undertaken but in the broader strokes it must happen.

I think a lot of people forget how close we came to civil war. You can still see utter idiots suggesting it in response to the new Expropriation Bill in the same breath as they claim that SA is being destroyed by BEE.

Literally nothing will destroy this country quicker than civil war.
 
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