Why you don't really have free will

Prawnapple

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Willful ignorance almost to the point of outright dishonesty.

You admit something is possible in one post and then in the next you pretend to understand nothing, that makes me think you are actually smarter than what you give yourself credit for.

The struggle is real.
You have no place to talk about dishonesty. You believe in a supernatural deity.
 

Prawnapple

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You cannot know A) because of B). And you are wrong on A) and you will never know why... because of B). It is now a case of where your self-admitted ignorance and inability to understand prevents you from... understanding.
Haha typical. MY interpretation of the QM is correct, yours isn't. Nice try.

You clearly might have the capacity to understand, but you are refusing to grasp/understand anything.
You either lack the capability/capacity to grasp/understand, or you are willfully refusing to grasp/understand.

So.
Are you stupid or obtuse.
Can you stop projecting for like 5 mins?
 

Swa

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I'm convinced you guys are just taking the piss now.

It's either deterministic or not. Wtf is so hard to understand?

INDETERMINISM IS ACASUAL AND THUS A MIRACLE. THIS IS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE!!!!!! THERE'S NOTHING TO EMBRACE. A CHILD CAN UNDERSTAND THIS FFS

Or let's go with the alternative that God and his actions is completely slave to causality shall we? Let's see how far you get with this...

I can't believe what I'm reading right now. Wow. And you have the gall to call it silly and dilemma etc... Haha hahaha ah. You ****ing okes are going to drive me absolutely mad. :ROFL:

I wish I could draw this **** out for you in person... Clearly something is not getting through.
Indeterminate does not imply acausal. That's like saying analog implies non-computer.
 

Techne

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Haha typical. MY interpretation of the QM is correct, yours isn't. Nice try
No interpretation will explain away the empirical observation of indeterministic change of electron spin. You are welcome to try. :D
 
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Ponderer

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... THIS IS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE!!!!!! .... A CHILD CAN UNDERSTAND THIS FFS....
...Clearly something is not getting through....
"...THIS IS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE!!!!!! .... A CHILD CAN UNDERSTAND THIS FFS"
A child easily understands the concept of free will.
You don't.
What does that say about your intellect, huh?
FFS

"...Clearly something is not getting through..."
Clearly.
 

Bobbin

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"...THIS IS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE!!!!!! .... A CHILD CAN UNDERSTAND THIS FFS"
A child easily understands the concept of free will.
You don't.
What does that say about your intellect, huh?
FFS

"...Clearly something is not getting through..."
Clearly.
Not an argument.
 

Bobbin

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Indeterminate does not imply acausal. That's like saying analog implies non-computer.
Determinism often is taken to mean causal determinism, which in physics is known as cause-and-effect. It is the concept that events within a given paradigm are bound by causality in such a way that any state (of an object or event) is completely determined by prior states. This meaning can be distinguished from other varieties of determinism mentioned below. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Determinism

Unfortunately I don't understand your analog/computer analogy so you're going to have to explain the difference between indeterminate and acausal before I can agree/disagree. And considering our track record I will likely disagree. But let's see. Maybe you have some profound understanding to reveal that you've been withholding all this time.
 

Prawnapple

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So far there's only one interpretation. All others fall flat.
lol not really. There's at least 13-14 major interpretations. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interpretations_of_quantum_mechanics), Pilot Wave theory (De Broglie–Bohm theory), Many-Worlds, Ensemble Interpretation and then the old-school Copenhagen Interpretation to name a few.

How is that dishonest?
It's dishonest when played off as truth while dismissing counter-positions as false.
 

Ponderer

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Determinism often is taken to mean causal determinism, which in physics is known as cause-and-effect. It is the concept that events within a given paradigm are bound by causality in such a way that any state (of an object or event) is completely determined by prior states. This meaning can be distinguished from other varieties of determinism mentioned below. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Determinism

Unfortunately I don't understand your analog/computer analogy so you're going to have to explain the difference between indeterminate and acausal before I can agree/disagree. And considering our track record I will likely disagree. But let's see. Maybe you have some profound understanding to reveal that you've been withholding all this time.
Like your "profound understanding" of things?
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
 

Ponderer

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Ponderer

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Yet again you pose no argument whatsoever. Same **** different day.
I argue that free will clearly/obviously exists.
Do you argue that free will exists, or do you argue that free will does not exist.

This is not Rocket Science.
A child can understand this.
FFS.
Clearly something is not getting through.
 

Bobbin

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I argue that free will clearly/obviously exists.
If choice is an illusion then what?

Do you argue that free will exists, or do you argue that free will does not exist.
I've argued for both. And I've stated we cannot know either. I think I'm the only one here who's attempted a tangible view of compatibilism as well and have been prepared to compromise my position more than once. But you guys are collectivists, you eat compromise up and spit at it with your own agenda - I'm dishonest and desperate if I recall correctly and I haven't learned anything. pffft yeah right, I will only "learn" something if it's your ideology 1000% of the way and damn anyone who disagrees. Prove me wrong.
 
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