Winde says level 1 lockdown is sufficient but wants consequences for not wearing masks

etienne_marais

Executive Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2008
Messages
9,182
People often claim that the virus can go through most masks, but forget about the importance of droplets. Even in conversation you disperse tiny droplets which may help spread the virus (which would be blocked by a mask). Or do I have it wrong ?
 

Lupus

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 25, 2006
Messages
31,315
People often claim that the virus can go through most masks, but forget about the importance of droplets. Even in conversation you disperse tiny droplets which may help spread the virus (which would be blocked by a mask). Or do I have it wrong ?
If you're in a confined space for ten minutes and they're talking loudly yes perhaps.
Out in the open with distance, shouldn't be a problem.
 

etienne_marais

Executive Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2008
Messages
9,182
If you're in a confined space for ten minutes and they're talking loudly yes perhaps.
Out in the open with distance, shouldn't be a problem.
You sure ? We are talking microscopic droplets that goes completely unnoticed, not the "say it don't spray it" kind.
 

Lupus

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 25, 2006
Messages
31,315
You sure ? We are talking microscopic droplets that goes completely unnoticed, not the "say it don't spray it" kind.
Well depends on how intimate you want to get I guess, as long as you're not on top of them breathing every breath they make. You'll more than likely be okay.
Notice in confide spaces.
 

kfc4unme

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2016
Messages
497
Anyone got a link or 2 to a study that shows masks work? I've only seen studies that show they don't work...
 

access

Honorary Master
Joined
Mar 17, 2009
Messages
11,903
Probably worse as then you have a load of virus on your hands which contaminates everything you touch.

lol so the president says sneeze or cough into your elbow, but then also use your elbow to greet instead of shaking hands.

anyway, along with the manners of putting your hand in front of your mouth, you are supposed to wash your hands afterwards and not wipe it on your clothes or ignore the hand you just used.
 

garp

Executive Member
Joined
Aug 2, 2004
Messages
8,835
The truth is the politicians don’t know how to control the spread of the infection, nobody understands why there are these huge second waves and the only thing that seems to work to some extent are draconian lockdowns but only when you have a willing or compliant citizenry, e.g. New Zealand, China, etc. and your economy can survive the assault.

So the only thing that gives everyone a semblance of feeling like they have some degree of control are highly visible signals like wearing masks, using hand sanitizer, measuring temperatures and signing meaningless logs. Deep down, we know it’s mostly pointless, but the Covid19 safety theatre allows us to feel like we’re doing something to be safe, and gives the authorities something to cling to.

In reality, you only have to look objectively at the infection curves of pretty much every region and overlay the dates of their “mask mandates” (and other measures) to see that, short of locking people into their homes for a protracted period, they have had zero effect. The virus doesn’t care, it follows the classic infection curve regardless.
 

Forum Reader

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 25, 2019
Messages
679
Which is why you're sanitizing every time you're going into a shop. Or how about you sneeze into your elbow?
Also if you're not sick, not sneezing or coughing that video doesn't really matter. In fact I sneeze more with the stupid things on my nose. Also if you watch that video, see that vapour going up? It's gonna float back down again anyway.
So yeah masks make sense if you're sick, if you're not sick why wear it? But anyway if you're sick you shouldn't be going out.


It's all about probabilities. Not whether a mask is 100% effective or not. By wearing one the probability of infecting people around you goes down significantly. There is no argument that can ever be made against that.
 

kfc4unme

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2016
Messages
497
It's all about probabilities. Not whether a mask is 100% effective or not. By wearing one the probability of infecting people around you goes down significantly. There is no argument that can ever be made against that.
Significantly? Got a link to the data?
 

thestaggy

Honorary Master
Joined
May 11, 2011
Messages
18,467
So you're out of touch with reality?
Huh?
But you're right there are no problems. Other than constant discomfort, running noses, coughing, etc. Why would sitting for hours in a hot building with a piece of cloth over your mouth and nose not be embraced with enthusiasm? You think people pull their masks down low on their nose or even off just to be difficult?
Really? It gets uncomfortable yes, but lets hold back on the ''I can't breathe'' theatrics. I have a badly deviated septum and chronic sinus issues as result. I haven't suffocated to death, yet.

It was the lockdown nuts that punted them as an outlier. They were all supposed to be dead by now because they failed to follow the pack. Then when they somehow failed to do so the story changed to Sweden really had a lockdown.
No, it was the anti-masker crowd trumpeting Sweden. Sweden was very ''soft'' in terms of regulations and lockdowns from the start, leaving it up to the people to take responsibility. All the boomers and Karens in the rest of the world started citing them as a reason why they won't wear masks.
Are you saying the Swedes don't just follow the rules or lock themselves down without even being asked?
I quoted the Swedish prime minister. What he is saying is Swedish people stopped taking necessary precautions and ''policing'' themselves, hence government had to impose tighter regulations. People could not do the little things and behave on their own, so government now has to step in.
 
Last edited:

noxibox

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
20,097
People often claim that the virus can go through most masks, but forget about the importance of droplets. Even in conversation you disperse tiny droplets which may help spread the virus (which would be blocked by a mask). Or do I have it wrong ?
Depends on the mask. Tiny droplets from breathing and talking are going to exit around the sides of the mask if it isn't sealed or the cloth is sufficiently porous (plenty of masks are made of such material). Assuming it is indoors it requires extended exposure to an infected person to catch it from just breathing or normal volume talking. We're talking hours. And it also requires inadequate ventilation.

Outdoors it becomes significantly less likely still.

The likely reason that restaurants, pubs and coffee shops are turning out to be higher risk is probably a combination of a loud indoor environment with poor air circulation.
 

kfc4unme

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2016
Messages
497
So no link then.... Just your assumptions asserted as "facts".
Don't get me wrong. It makes sense what you saying. I just want to see the study. Often results of a study go against intuition. For example, perhaps non N95 masks don't prevent micro particles escaping enough to make a difference. Perhaps the main form of transmission is people touching objects that have the virus on. I don't know.... Just want to see the study that the government and my work refer to when they say masks are compulsory.
 

noxibox

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
20,097
I haven't suffocated to death
Nobody mentioned suffocating to death.

Significantly? Got a link to the data?
There's mostly conjecture. What data there is shows a benefit in enclosed areas with poor air circulation where people spend extended periods in close proximity. An example would be public transport. That seemed the likely sort of environment even without research. Outside of that type of environment the numbers show minimal benefit. Which is why these nutty measures of trying to force everyone to wear masks constantly whenever they leave their own property are being resisted. There's also the comfort issue. Big difference between popping on a mask before you hop out of your car or even waiting until just before you enter a mall, and having to spend hours with one on. Especially in places with no air-conditioning. Never the oppressive heat common in countries like South Africa. We've watched teachers almost rip their masks from their face the moment they get a break and can go outside to where they're allowed to take their mask off. Their relief at getting some fresh, cool air is very evident.
 

noxibox

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
20,097
Do you know anything about physics? Some things don't need to be tested because they are obvious to anyone with a brain.
Doesn't tell us the slightest thing about the efficacy of a safety device. Especially something like masks for which there are effectively no standards. I can wear an N95, surgical mask, piece of t-shirt, stocking material, in fact pretty much any type of cloth and a single layer to boot. I can wear my N95 so loose that all the air escapes. When my children wear a surgical mask it's just an air redirector.

But all this is should be obvious to anyone. Apparently not to members of the mask cult.
 

noxibox

Honorary Master
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
20,097
Don't get me wrong. It makes sense what you saying. I just want to see the study. Often results of a study go against intuition. For example, perhaps non N95 masks don't prevent micro particles escaping enough to make a difference. Perhaps the main form of transmission is people touching objects that have the virus on. I don't know.... Just want to see the study that the government and my work refer to when they say masks are compulsory.
One of the things tests found was that N95s don't block sneezes. Assuming a proper seal the mask slows it down and smashes the large droplets into much smaller ones.

Governments are not basing mask regulations on research. It's mostly based on desperation and hope. Some places require them in very limited specific circumstances, others have a wear them everywhere policy. The former are the closest to being scientific. The latter are just panic.
 
Top