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Thread: GPU Value Comparisons

  1. #871
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    Hi all.

    Really the worst time to be buying a GPU I know but I have just finished exams and would love to play a few games. I'm an AMD guy but know Rx580s ANYWHERE and guys are selling them second hand on carb for between 7 and 10k lol.

    My system is currently:
    i5 4670k, 8GB RAM, R9 270, 1920x1200 monitor

    I doubt I will upgrade my monitor to a higher res one until my current one breaks.

    Will a 1060 be a nice big upgrade? Stock seems to be an issue but this one looks quite good and cheap:
    http://www.landmarkpc.co.za/store/ev...9b34q9thah1394

    It doesn't look like there are any new cards on the horizon (next 3 months?)

    I mainly play Battlefield and would like to play on Ultra at good FPS.

    thanks/

  2. #872

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    Any word on when the AMD RX 560 is hitting stores?
    I want to complete an HTPC build.
    i5-4670K|Air Cooled |16GB Kingston Beast Series Ram|Asus Maximus Impact VII|AMD Sapphire HD 7950|Lian Li PC-C60|250GB Samsung EVO|CM Silent Pro M2 850w

  3. #873
    Super Grandmaster DrJohnZoidberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CamiKaze View Post
    Any word on when the AMD RX 560 is hitting stores?
    I want to complete an HTPC build.
    Been available for a few weeks, e.g.: https://www.rebeltech.co.za/14978-gi...2x-with-b.html

    Any specific reason you want a 560 though? I'd recommend the 1050 over it and for an HTPC would rather get a RX 550 or GT 1030.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zolani99 View Post
    The atheists won't be forced to bow their heads, they can just imagine themselves burning in hell.

  4. #874

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrJohnZoidberg View Post
    Been available for a few weeks, e.g.: https://www.rebeltech.co.za/14978-gi...2x-with-b.html

    Any specific reason you want a 560 though? I'd recommend the 1050 over it and for an HTPC would rather get a RX 550 or GT 1030.
    I would've bought the RX 550 but I wanted to add a bit more power for some light gaming as well.
    i5-4670K|Air Cooled |16GB Kingston Beast Series Ram|Asus Maximus Impact VII|AMD Sapphire HD 7950|Lian Li PC-C60|250GB Samsung EVO|CM Silent Pro M2 850w

  5. #875

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    ok no, the 1050 is waaay more expensive than the machine I have. Going for RX 550 then.
    i5-4670K|Air Cooled |16GB Kingston Beast Series Ram|Asus Maximus Impact VII|AMD Sapphire HD 7950|Lian Li PC-C60|250GB Samsung EVO|CM Silent Pro M2 850w

  6. #876
    Super Grandmaster ponder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brawler View Post
    Hi all.

    Really the worst time to be buying a GPU I know but I have just finished exams and would love to play a few games. I'm an AMD guy but know Rx580s ANYWHERE and guys are selling them second hand on carb for between 7 and 10k lol.

    My system is currently:
    i5 4670k, 8GB RAM, R9 270, 1920x1200 monitor

    I doubt I will upgrade my monitor to a higher res one until my current one breaks.

    Will a 1060 be a nice big upgrade? Stock seems to be an issue but this one looks quite good and cheap:
    http://www.landmarkpc.co.za/store/ev...9b34q9thah1394

    It doesn't look like there are any new cards on the horizon (next 3 months?)

    I mainly play Battlefield and would like to play on Ultra at good FPS.

    thanks/
    Do NOT buy a 3GB 1060.

    Ask Wootware when they getting stock of these,
    http://www.wootware.co.za/zotac-zt-p...hics-card.html
    http://www.wootware.co.za/galax-gefo...hics-card.html
    entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem

  7. #877
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    Quote Originally Posted by ponder View Post
    Do NOT buy a 3GB 1060.

    Ask Wootware when they getting stock of these,
    http://www.wootware.co.za/zotac-zt-p...hics-card.html
    http://www.wootware.co.za/galax-gefo...hics-card.html
    Too late :0. Cafe Viva had one in stock for R3600.

    Wootware said they would have next time this month and not keen on waiting.

    I'm not to perturbed. BF1 which is pretty much the only thing I play is silky smooth maxxed out.

  8. #878

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    What are your guys take on the RX64 vs 1080ti after the lastest AdoredTV review?
    i5-4670K|Air Cooled |16GB Kingston Beast Series Ram|Asus Maximus Impact VII|AMD Sapphire HD 7950|Lian Li PC-C60|250GB Samsung EVO|CM Silent Pro M2 850w

  9. #879

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    Quote Originally Posted by CamiKaze View Post
    What are your guys take on the RX64 vs 1080ti after the lastest AdoredTV review?
    Interesting question.

    First I'll preface my answer by saying I am an irrational AMD fanboy. I support AMD even in cases where they are the clear loser. Part of that is just a long history with the brand, part of it is because they often offer good price for performance, and part of it is because we need competition in any case.

    If you have a look at the functional units of Vega vs the functional units of the 1080Ti, you would expect Vega to be a lot closer. When you compare Vega 64 to the 1080Ti, the only thing it loses out on is the number of ROPs (96 vs 64) and the amount of memory (11GB vs 8GB). Otherwise, "on paper", it is equal to or superior.

    But, real world results show that the 1080Ti is faster in almost all cases. Nvidia just makes really, really good GPUs!

    However, I do think there is more to the story, and a number of things paint the RX Vega in a worse light than it perhaps deserves.

    I am fairly sure that the drivers for RX Vega are not ready. There are questions regarding whether new features such as the Draw Stream Binning Rasterizer and the Primitive Discard Accelerator are enabled with the current drivers. They may not be. Even without those, Vega is different enough to Polaris that I expect optimization to take some time. Every single AMD GPU released previously has improved over time with drivers. They look bad on review day, but 6-12 months later, they generally move up a level and are punching above their weight. There is no reason to expect anything different from Vega. I think, one day, that Vega 56 will be closer to a 1080 in performance and a Vega 64 will be closer to a 1080Ti in performance.

    Second... AMD needs Nvidia's voltage control magic. Search Google for AMD Vega undervolting and see what people are able to achieve with it. Massive reductions in power consumption for the same or better performance, because they reduce the voltage. Often from 1.2V to 1.0V, which is a huge reduction. But, you don't see people bothering to undervolt with Nvidia's cards, and the reason is because Nvidia has much better automatic voltage control which automatically selects the minimum voltage needed to sustain the particular performance state. This is one of the reasons they are so efficient and so fast. AMD sets a blanket voltage of 1.2V across ALL Vegas, Nvidia sets the voltage per graphics card and per performance state. They have much finer grained control. AMD has some level of automatic voltage control because it does go up and down a little, but nowhere near as good as Nvidia. This is also not something that drivers can fix, but if we are lucky, a future AMD product will have good voltage control.

    Lastly, Vega is bottlenecked somewhere - rumours have it that it could be either the memory or geometry performance. If you overclock a Vega 56 to the same clockspeeds as a Vega 64, they perform about the same. This is strange because you would expect a Vega 64 to be a lot faster than a Vega 56.

  10. #880
    Super Grandmaster ponder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ancalagon View Post
    I
    If you have a look at the functional units of Vega vs the functional units of the 1080Ti, you would expect Vega to be a lot closer. When you compare Vega 64 to the 1080Ti, the only thing it loses out on is the number of ROPs (96 vs 64) and the amount of memory (11GB vs 8GB). Otherwise, "on paper", it is equal to or superior.

    But, real world results show that the 1080Ti is faster in almost all cases. Nvidia just makes really, really good GPUs!

    However, I do think there is more to the story, and a number of things paint the RX Vega in a worse light than it perhaps deserves.

    I am fairly sure that the drivers for RX Vega are not ready.
    Wendel(?) from level 1 techs mentioned vega64 was outperforming the 1080ti on linux and that was with vega using opensource drivers.

    I'll see if I can find the video.

    Edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jc7PDqmtJC4
    Last edited by ponder; 06-10-2017 at 11:52 AM.
    entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem

  11. #881

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    So the latest AdoredTV talks about Vega64 outperforming the 1080ti because AMD makes better use of a CPU bottlenecked system in comparison to Nvidia.
    I'm sure that if the bottleneck wasn't there, the 1080ti would outperform it in the tests that was performed in the video. But this also means that you have to buy an expensive CPU to reduce that bottleneck.

    So for the average user, there is no point in buying Coffeelake or a Threadripper just to gain a few frames over the other, due to the expense of a top end card and a top end cpu.
    Last edited by CamiKaze; 06-10-2017 at 12:35 PM.
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  12. #882

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    Quote Originally Posted by CamiKaze View Post
    So the latest AdoredTV talks about Vega64 outperforming the 1080ti because AMD makes better use of a CPU bottlenecked system in comparison to Nvidia.
    I'm sure that if the bottleneck wasn't there, the 1080ti would outperform it in the tests that was performed in the video. But this also means that you have to buy an expensive CPU to reduce that bottleneck.

    So for the average user, there is no point in buying Coffeelake or a Threadripper just to gain a few frames over the other, due to the expense of a top end card and a top end cpu.
    Just remember that it was an unusual case.

    At that resolution, the CPU is usually the limiting factor. The GPU is not really being strained. At least, RX Vega and a 1080Ti are not strained at 1080p.

    So, it is strange RX Vega to be performing well in CPU bottlenecked situations and I don't think anyone really knows what that means. It could be that Nvidia has driver issues in DX12 which are leading to higher CPU overhead than AMD.

  13. #883

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ancalagon View Post
    Just remember that it was an unusual case.

    At that resolution, the CPU is usually the limiting factor. The GPU is not really being strained. At least, RX Vega and a 1080Ti are not strained at 1080p.

    So, it is strange RX Vega to be performing well in CPU bottlenecked situations and I don't think anyone really knows what that means. It could be that Nvidia has driver issues in DX12 which are leading to higher CPU overhead than AMD.
    Yeah, I guess that what I am trying to add to this is that one can take advantage of the lesser card since it performs so well under the circumstances. Most people will be bottle-necked if they don't have a top end CPU, but the majority of people won't buy a top end CPU. Do you see a point in buying a 1080ti when playing at that resolution knowing that you will be bottlenecked, because you won't have that best CPU?

    I plan on playing games at 2k res (with settings on full) on my 4k TV, and since both these cards deliver above 60fps, there is no point in going for the 1080ti right?
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  14. #884

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    Quote Originally Posted by CamiKaze View Post
    Yeah, I guess that what I am trying to add to this is that one can take advantage of the lesser card since it performs so well under the circumstances. Most people will be bottle-necked if they don't have a top end CPU, but the majority of people won't buy a top end CPU. Do you see a point in buying a 1080ti when playing at that resolution knowing that you will be bottlenecked, because you won't have that best CPU?

    I plan on playing games at 2k res (with settings on full) on my 4k TV, and since both these cards deliver above 60fps, there is no point in going for the 1080ti right?
    At 2k resolution you really do not need a 1080Ti or Vega 64. You would be fine with a 580, 1070 or 1080.

    If you do plan to play at 4K in the future, then buy a 1080Ti.

    If you are comfortable with undervolting and overclocking a GPU, then you could consider buying Vega, but, I would still wait for third party RX Vega cards to come out. Third party cards will have better coolers, which will run cooler and quieter. I would not buy Vega at all until the third party cards come out, and even then, only if you are happy fiddling in order to get the best out of it. And, you have to accept the possibility that you would pay as much for Vega 64 as for a 1080Ti and it might never be as fast.

    Buying any Vega is essentially a gamble - it might pay off but it might not.

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