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Thread: SAPS spent more than R52m on 169 torches

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by ambroseg1 View Post
    To solve crimes? Arent we the first to moan when the incompetents at SAPS aren't like CSI Miami?
    You're right.
    All the more reason to get them the cheapy flashlights.
    I mean, if they don't do their jobs right with expensive ones, what's the point right?
    Get them the cheapy ones and be done with it.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sl8er View Post
    Why do they need something that expensive?
    If they "misplace" guns at the rate that they do, I'd hate to think how many of these expensive flashlights they lose, probably, on a daily basis
    Hehe.

    As you know, a service pistol costs a few thousand rand. Issued to tens of thousands of cops.

    These are not ordinary flashlights. They are very specialised forensic tools operated by specially trained personnel who operate in teams.

    It's very likely that the procurement included extra things like training, support, services, extended warranty, etc, etc.
    Last edited by Arthur; 10-11-2017 at 08:46 AM.

  3. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sl8er View Post
    You're right.
    All the more reason to get them the cheapy flashlights.
    I mean, if they don't do their jobs right with expensive ones, what's the point right?
    Get them the cheapy ones and be done with it.
    Not sure if serious?

    Yes I agree, let them drive Yaris's like Chubb and NOT Golf GTi's. But surely giving these imbeciles normal flash lights and not proper forensic lights is like giving them toy water guns instead of proper firearms? I am no fan of a pig, but it still has a job to do and should be given the right/minium tools no?

    P.S. Glad everybody is ignoring my questions about where in the article it states the exact models that were bought and what those models out of tender. Shows that people are quick to jump on bull****. At least wait for facts before going DA on the problem.

  4. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arthur View Post
    Hehe.

    As you know, a service pistol costs a few thousand rand. Issued to tens of thousands of cops.

    These are not ordinary flashlights. They are very specialised forensic tools operated by specially trained personnel who operate in teams.
    Sarcasm noted.
    "For the ones who understand, no explanation is needed. For the ones who do not, no explanation is possible."

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arthur View Post
    Hehe.

    As you know, a service pistol costs a few thousand rand. Issued to tens of thousands of cops.

    These are not ordinary flashlights. They are very specialised forensic tools operated by specially trained personnel who operate in teams.
    Ooooooh, I see, I see.
    (It would help if I actually read the article instead of just browsing the excerpt )

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by ambroseg1 View Post
    Not sure if serious?

    Yes I agree, let them drive Yaris's like Chubb and NOT Golf GTi's. But surely giving these imbeciles normal flash lights and not proper forensic lights is like giving them toy water guns instead of proper firearms? I am no fan of a pig, but it still has a job to do and should be given the right/minium tools no?

    P.S. Glad everybody is ignoring my questions about where in the article it states the exact models that were bought and what those models out of tender. Shows that people are quick to jump on bull****. At least wait for facts before going DA on the problem.
    Haha! Yeah, I just realized that these aren't your normal "cop on the beat" flashlights
    My bad.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ɹǝuuᴉM View Post
    Sarcasm noted.
    No sarcasm.

    Facts are important. We don't know them all in this case.

    Until we know the facts, I refuse to rush to judgment - that's exactly what the current regime and other idiots do.
    Last edited by Arthur; 10-11-2017 at 08:53 AM.

  8. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arthur View Post
    Hehe.

    As you know, a service pistol costs a few thousand rand. Issued to tens of thousands of cops.

    These are not ordinary flashlights. They are very specialised forensic tools operated by specially trained personnel who operate in teams.

    It's very likely that the procurement included extra things like training, support, services, extended warranty, etc, etc.
    Thanks, good thing i did not add my ignorant 2 cents.
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  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by ɹǝuuᴉM View Post
    Of course. SAPS bought 169 Kits. And paid around R300.000-00 per Kit. But even if you order it privately (one kit only) you won't pay more than 200.000-00 Rand + another R1000-00 or so for UPS or FedEx. Someone made 169 x 100.000 = 16.900.000-00 Rand But in reality they should have scored more like R20.000.000 million from the deal because of the bulk order and transport!
    I don't know if that's the actual model they bought, but let's say it is.
    If you buy it at $14987 that comes to about R214k. You think you're only going to pay R1k for delivery? Lol...have you ever imported anything from overseas?

    If done properly add in insurance, duties, local profit at 30% etc and you're right up on 300k. You think Woolies only makes 1% profit on that R60 Cottage Pie meal they're selling you?

  10. #40
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    I don't know why people are upset. If Desmond Tutu's white people tax from some years back had been implemented then the country could have broken even on this.

  11. #41

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    Please read the article link I posted on the first page of this thread, parts of which I quoted. I did not think it necessary to spell out exactly what is wrong with this deal, which some are now trying to justify!? https://www.dailymaverick.co.za/arti...eps-on-giving/

    Daily Maverick sent 13 questions to Keating, offering him a right to reply to questions related to the IPID investigation. We reprint the questions as well as his replies in the interest of clarity:

    1.Is it true that you were employed at the Information Systems of the SAPS and worked with a number of SAPS personnel responsible for the procurement of ROFIN/Forensic Light Sources (FLS) from FDA for SAPS?
    2.Do you have/did you have any shareholding and/or any involvement in ROFIN Australia? Please state percentage of such shareholding that you do / did own and the extent of any involvement.
    3.When did FDA acquire the sole distribution rights for ROFIN Forensic Light Sources (FLS)?
    4.When did FDA start supplying the SAPS with ROFIN FLSs?
    5.Does the SAPS procure ROFIN FLSs directly from FDA and if not, through which contracts are they supplied?
    6.How much does each ROFIN FLS cost the SAPS, i.e. what is the single unit cost (including maintenance and support) of a ROFIN FLS?
    7.How has FDA been able to remain the sole supplier of FLS to SAPS for more than a decade, when there are numerous other suppliers of FLS both locally and internationally?
    8.How many ROFIN FLSs have the SAPS procured from FDA and what is the total value of ROFIN FLSs supplied to the SAPS to date?
    9.What type of maintenance and support do the ROFIN FLSs, supplied by FDA, require and at what intervals?
    10.What has the maintenance and support of these FLS cost SAPS/State in the last financial year?
    11.In total, how much has SAPS paid FDA for the supply, maintenance and support of ROFIN FLSs?
    12.Is it true that EOH Abantu, a wholly owned subsidiary of EOH Holdings, bought a controlling interest in FDA and two other businesses of which you are a Director? And if so, what percentage interest have they bought and for how much?
    13.What other goods and/or services does FDA supply to the SAPS/State? Please state the products/services and the values of related contracts?

    To which Keating replied:
    •The allegations are viewed in a serious light. They are unfounded, untrue and I forthrightly refute them.
    •I left the police service 23 years ago.
    •Our relationship with Rofin is limited to FDA being a distributor of their
    •The sale of our business to EOH Abantu became over time commercially unviable for us, and we are now privately owned.
    •All contracts that FDA has worked on in relation to SAPS have been through an open tender process and subjected to all procurement regulations.
    •The details of these contracts are a matter of public record. Further details in relation to services and products can be directed to the client.

    In another universe – perhaps one of those fictional CSI series – the potential for the SAPS to solve crimes using such amazingly sophisticated and expensive equipment would be cause for celebration.

    Instead the release by SAPS of the annual crime statistics last month only served to confirm what South Africans already know. Crime in South Africa is rampant. Every day, 52 South Africans are murdered, there are 109 rapes and 45 hijackings. The depressing bit is we all know that these crimes are also under-reported.

    Even worse is the SAPS’s “incomplete” investigation track record which is currently at a 10-year high no matter whether SAPS members are using specialised torches which cost you and me R300,000 a pop.

  12. #42
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    Still waiting for SAPS forensics to come take finger prints since late 2014. These light sources must be for the year end Christmas party.
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  13. #43
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    Yes. That's the real scandal. Utter incompetence. Dereliction of duty. Jobs and contracts for pals. Public services and government institutions laid waste. And stealing on a scale we can barely grasp. Sickening.

    This FLS deal is the wrong fight to pick, I suspect.

  14. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arthur View Post
    Yes. That's the real scandal. Utter incompetence. Dereliction of duty. Jobs and contracts for pals. Public services and government institutions laid waste. And stealing on a scale we can barely grasp. Sickening.

    This FLS deal is the wrong fight to pick, I suspect.
    IMO corruption is the flip-side of incompetence and dereliction of duty. You can't send someone to jail for that since it is a political failure, but you can for corruption. You have to pick the fights you can win...

    All that time spent getting kickbacks, its a wonder some have any time to do actual work. As long as enough gravy flows to the right people, the laying waste will continue.

  15. #45

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    They weren't torches, they were light sabres.

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