South Africans want the rich to pay more taxes: survey

CataclysmZA said:
Do you really believe that most of the people standing in a queue for their SASSA payments are not working because they don't want to?

How do you know the details of the personal affairs of all those people that has led them to be standing in line for money from the government?

Are we trotting out the child care grant bullcrap again?

The CSG does not impact birth and fertility rates in the way everyone seems to think in this thread. I certainly don't, but maybe that's because I'm not being racist.

Women under 30 years who receive CSG support statistically are unlikely to fall pregnant or bring a pregnancy to full term a second time within a decade, while women over 30 who qualify for the grant do on average have more than one child whose birth and early development is supported by the CSG.


We don't have an explosion of babies being born because women choose, or are forced, to have more children to leech from the meagre R450 per month, per child, that CSG offers. CSG recipients have, on average, 0.28 more children than women who did not qualify for the grant, and there's a small mountain of paperwork and government oversight required to keep getting that money for mahala.

Without the CSG we would see birth rates start to fall because, you know, kids are expensive.

But you know what? To qualify for the grant, you need to be earning less than R4400 as a single mother, or R8800 together as a couple. CSG recipients may be getting those payments straight into a bank account, and many of them may be working adults who are either earning a minimum wage (currently R4270 per month), or are temporarily employed in an EPW programme that pays them a pittance as hourly workers.

But sure.

All the people queuing up for SASSA payments are there for the R350 COVID grant or collecting money for the ten children they have because they are "williewerkers" and "tikkoppe" and government leeches who are too lazy.

****ing racists.
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I dated a lady for a bit that worked as a social worker. It wasn't unusual for people to have children in order to get a social grant. They used it to buy alcohol or drugs. The kids got fed by the social programs. ie. the social workers were obligated to make sure the children had food. So all the social grant money was being used by the parents. Anything else was on the government to supply to them. Which they did and do.

Having children when you don't have the financial means shouldn't be incentivised in any way.
It's as simple as that.
There is a boom in children in this country whereas Rowanda has been able to reduce the number of children born to poor families by instead offering sex education and birth control.
I have no doubt you believe you are correct but the data speaks for itself. Our country's policies are leading to poor having more children. There aren't really excuses for data, it just speaks for itself.

And because our country is making poor dependent on these handouts, the day it comes crashing down will be a harsh reality.
That is how EVERY single revolution in history was fueled.
Your currency crashed, people who relied on "grants" can no longer buy anything with that grant.
Country is burned to the ground.

Not a single revolution in history has been good in the short and medium term.
France was an absolute disastrous dictatorship after the French revolution.
And had France gone a more moderate path, they would have recovered much faster

So I don't agree with anything you say, because you rely on race politics, and your emotions when you should be focusing on what works and how history has played out before.
But like all these hopeful saffers, no doubt you think THIS time it'll be different.
 
Most taxpayers cannot stomach another tax hike, more so in the current climate we find ourselves in. I would like to see a government that better spends the money it receives by investing into things people care & want (solving the energy crisis, reduce poverty, etc.). Sadly, money is lost through corruption and junk projects that benefit no one.
Gnome said:
"Problem" with "rich" people are that they can do math.
And the tax rate vs return on investment for taxes pay equation doesn't add up.
If you pay as much tax in SA as you do in Europe, why not live in Europe. <insert country name instead of Europe if you want>
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I would like to think that emigration (in general) is not an easy decision to make, even for the wealthy. I can agree that the taxes paid in SA (for those who make a good amount of money) is very similar to what is paid in some developed nations; I remember looking into this sometime last year and was amazed.
 
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itareanlnotani said:
No, just stop after the 2nd one.

Actually, I'd be up for a childless grant. If you don't have a child and are under 21, an extra R200 a month.
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Fsck no.

You know how many baby daddies slam one in the oven of their side girl and then bugger off in this country?!?!?
 
Raising the tax brackets for the wealthy is pointless. It would rather be better to make sure nobody can completely negate their taxes through various deductibles and credits. And especially politicians who enjoy fiddling around with tax law in a way that makes sure they get more from other people's taxes than they themselves pay in taxes. If anything. I bet if they barred deductions into the last 10% of taxes SARS would be rolling in it. It wouldn't surprise me if more than half of the Charity, non-profit and NGO activity in our country is nothing more than tax evasion and SARS milking scams.

Also:

“We are the only African country giving almost half its population grants. No other country in Africa takes care of its people as we do in South Africa,”
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I'll just say it. It's a little embarrassing that our president seems to think saying that sounds good. In reality the economy is suffering for it, generating less jobs AND it's not even enough to live a dignified life from. As the economy gets worse - So the degree to which the grants are insufficient only worsens. And the worst thing... The longer it goes on, the more difficult it will be to get out of it.
 
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A culture where people fall pregnant to get more grants what can u do, all talk here is useless as those with their brain in the knees are taking taking decisions for the voters. No one really cares about the tax payer. Do they?
 
CataclysmZA said:
Casual racism by the MyBroederbond, as expected. There's a lot of "**** you, got mine" in here too.

Man, you guys really suck.
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This has sweet fck all to do with racism, people are fed up of paying exorbitant amounts of tax and getting nothing in return while seeing others queue up to receive free money whilst getting nothing in return.

Meanwhile those paying tax towards these leeches are tired and burned out from working their butts off. And then these same leeches votes to tax the rich more not realizing that for sly politicians that mean fck the middle class even more, not the actual rich.
 
CataclysmZA said:
We don't have an explosion of babies being born because women choose, or are forced, to have more children to leech from the meagre R450 per month, per child, that CSG offers. CSG recipients have, on average, 0.28 more children than women who did not qualify for the grant, and there's a small mountain of paperwork and government oversight required to keep getting that money for mahala.

Without the CSG we would see birth rates start to fall because, you know, kids are expensive.
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You've admitted that CSG does make women have more children. There are nearly 24 million black women in South Africa and over 73% of CSG recipients are black (2018 figures) so that probably means around 17.5 million black women are receiving a CSG?

According to your post CSG recipients have additional children by a factor of 0.28 per woman (28%) so that's about an additional 4.9 million black children as a result of CSG?! That's an aweful lot of extra mouths to feed in a country where most people live in poverty and the bulk of the taxpayers are hanging on by a thread and a prayer. This is a totally unsustainable situation. We need to stop breeding ourselves into poverty.
 
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Question is, does ordinary middle or upper middle class tax payer gets anything for tax paid?
Security, you can not rely on police so you have to use security companies.
Healthcare, have to use private,
Education, either private or old c model schools where monthly payments are also significant.

These are three most important bits of "social" contract which are not fulfilled by government.

You also have plenty of other stealth taxes, any more will simply kill middle class.
Really wealthy made a plan long tome ago.
 
The poor should unbreed themselves out of poverty. Or else they should be shipped to Marion island.
 
CataclysmZA said:
Do you really believe that most of the people standing in a queue for their SASSA payments are not working because they don't want to?

How do you know the details of the personal affairs of all those people that has led them to be standing in line for money from the government?

Are we trotting out the child care grant bullcrap again?

The CSG does not impact birth and fertility rates in the way everyone seems to think in this thread. I certainly don't, but maybe that's because I'm not being racist.

Women under 30 years who receive CSG support statistically are unlikely to fall pregnant or bring a pregnancy to full term a second time within a decade, while women over 30 who qualify for the grant do on average have more than one child whose birth and early development is supported by the CSG.


We don't have an explosion of babies being born because women choose, or are forced, to have more children to leech from the meagre R450 per month, per child, that CSG offers. CSG recipients have, on average, 0.28 more children than women who did not qualify for the grant, and there's a small mountain of paperwork and government oversight required to keep getting that money for mahala.

Without the CSG we would see birth rates start to fall because, you know, kids are expensive.

But you know what? To qualify for the grant, you need to be earning less than R4400 as a single mother, or R8800 together as a couple. CSG recipients may be getting those payments straight into a bank account, and many of them may be working adults who are either earning a minimum wage (currently R4270 per month), or are temporarily employed in an EPW programme that pays them a pittance as hourly workers.

But sure.

All the people queuing up for SASSA payments are there for the R350 COVID grant or collecting money for the ten children they have because they are "williewerkers" and "tikkoppe" and government leeches who are too lazy.

****ing racists.
Click to expand...
The words in bold were all I got from your post and I had a lekka chuckle.:laugh:
Maybe next time try educate me without resorting to claims of racism.
It's just plain lazy.
 
CataclysmZA said:
Do you really believe that most of the people standing in a queue for their SASSA payments are not working because they don't want to?
Click to expand...
Yes. When you vote, you have a choice. And if you vote for a corrupt and incompetent government, you have made your choice.
 
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CataclysmZA said:
Do you really believe that most of the people standing in a queue for their SASSA payments are not working because they don't want to?

How do you know the details of the personal affairs of all those people that has led them to be standing in line for money from the government?

Are we trotting out the child care grant bullcrap again?

The CSG does not impact birth and fertility rates in the way everyone seems to think in this thread. I certainly don't, but maybe that's because I'm not being racist.

Women under 30 years who receive CSG support statistically are unlikely to fall pregnant or bring a pregnancy to full term a second time within a decade, while women over 30 who qualify for the grant do on average have more than one child whose birth and early development is supported by the CSG.


We don't have an explosion of babies being born because women choose, or are forced, to have more children to leech from the meagre R450 per month, per child, that CSG offers. CSG recipients have, on average, 0.28 more children than women who did not qualify for the grant, and there's a small mountain of paperwork and government oversight required to keep getting that money for mahala.

Without the CSG we would see birth rates start to fall because, you know, kids are expensive.

But you know what? To qualify for the grant, you need to be earning less than R4400 as a single mother, or R8800 together as a couple. CSG recipients may be getting those payments straight into a bank account, and many of them may be working adults who are either earning a minimum wage (currently R4270 per month), or are temporarily employed in an EPW programme that pays them a pittance as hourly workers.

But sure.

All the people queuing up for SASSA payments are there for the R350 COVID grant or collecting money for the ten children they have because they are "williewerkers" and "tikkoppe" and government leeches who are too lazy.

****ing racists.
Click to expand...
Lol...this one can like to be triggered...
 
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