South Africa Bans Arms Sales to Poland in Support of Russian Interests

[NarrowBandFtw]

@NarrowBandFtw

Quick question for you, do you recognise that Crimea is part of Ukraine and not part of Russia?

wtf are you on about?!?

the majority Russian population settled that by vote ages ago

not to mention for the longest time in our history is was Russia anyway until some drunk gave it away on a whim

 

[Cosmik Debris]

wtf are you on about?!?

the majority Russian population settled that by vote ages ago

not to mention for the longest time in our history is was Russia anyway until some drunk gave it away on a whim

There was no box to tick to remain in Ukraine. The only votes available were to be included in the Russian federation.

You never mentioned that part:

The March 16 referendum's available choices did not include keeping the status quo of Crimea and Sevastopol as they were at the moment the referendum was held. The 1992 constitution accords greater powers to the State Council of Crimea, including full sovereign powers to establish relations with other states; therefore, many Western and Ukrainian commentators argued that both provided referendum choices would result in de facto separation from Ukraine.

2014 Crimean status referendum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Mirai]

There was no box to tick to remain in Ukraine. The only votes available were to be included in the Russian federation.

You never mentioned that part:

The March 16 referendum's available choices did not include keeping the status quo of Crimea and Sevastopol as they were at the moment the referendum was held. The 1992 constitution accords greater powers to the State Council of Crimea, including full sovereign powers to establish relations with other states; therefore, many Western and Ukrainian commentators argued that both provided referendum choices would result in de facto separation from Ukraine.

2014 Crimean status referendum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

A rigged referendum... say it ain't so.

 

[wingnut771]

View attachment 1504687

$1 = R2 during apartheid.

 

[Cosmik Debris]

$1 = R2 during apartheid.

And $1-00 in 1994 = R3-55.

 

[Dave]

wtf are you on about?!?

the majority Russian population settled that by vote ages ago

not to mention for the longest time in our history is was Russia anyway until some drunk gave it away on a whim

The last internationally accepted vote was in favour of remaining in Ukraine, you aren't referring to the illegal referendum that even the UN deemed to be unlawful, are you?

But the reason I asked, not even China now recognise Crimea is part of the Russia, they also don't recognise the other parts of Ukraine currently unlawfully occupied by Russia are part of Russia either.

"China does not recognise Crimea as Russian"

Did you not know that?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1643558407180353541

 

[Cosmik Debris]

The last internationally accepted vote was in favour of remaining in Ukraine, you aren't referring to the illegal referendum that even the UN deemed to be unlawful, are you?

Lying by omission seems to be the norm for Putin supporters. I decided to look up the referendum and find out what actually happened. It's not as @NarrowBandFtw narrative postulates it was.

 

[NarrowBandFtw]

The last internationally accepted vote was in favour of remaining in Ukraine, you aren't referring to the illegal referendum that even the UN deemed to be unlawful, are you?

/care

the UN refused to send observers that were invited to be on the ground at the time
the UN is not a legislative body and what it says about legality can be tossed in the nearest bin
the same UN is refusing to investigate Nordstream, it is a political club, nothing more

btw you should double check bullcrap you get from the blue bird, China has taken a neutral stance on the topic, never voting to condemn Russia for taking Crimea and never commenting on "recognition"

that is not the same as stating "we do not recognize Crimea as Russian", that is simply the press pretending their silence is opposition ... like they all forgot the expression that silence is consent ...

 

[Wut]

$1 = R2 during apartheid.

The Rand lost more than 100% of its value to the dollar in the 1980s. A convenient fact apartheid supporters leave out. That's the biggest loss of value in a 10 year period in its entire history.

 

[Wut]

And $1-00 in 1994 = R3-55.

So... should we thank the apartheid government for crashing the Rand in the 80s?

1980 - $1 was R0.89
1989 - $1 was R2.53

So the Rand lost 184% of its value because of the apartheid government. An actual crash!

Let's do some digging on the new government's losses.

1994 - $1 was R3.42
2004 - $1 was R6.71

So a 96% loss which was nearly half the loss the currency took under the old apartheid government. So the new government actually slowed the rate of the Rand devaluing (whoddathunk that?)

Since then, it's followed a similar trajectory with losses nowhere near the loss of value under the apartheid government. Just because the actual number seems higher doesn't mean it actually lost more value, Cozzie.

 

[wingnut771]

So... should we thank the apartheid government for crashing the Rand in the 80s?

1980 - $1 was R0.89
1989 - $1 was R2.53

So the Rand lost 184% of its value because of the apartheid government. An actual crash!

Let's do some digging on the new government's losses.

1994 - $1 was R3.42
2004 - $1 was R6.71

So a 96% loss which was nearly half the loss the currency took under the old apartheid government. So the new government actually slowed the rate of the Rand devaluing (whoddathunk that?)

Since then, it's followed a similar trajectory with losses nowhere near the loss of value under the apartheid government. Just because the actual number seems higher doesn't mean it actually lost more value, Cozzie.

Wasn’t the apartheid loss due to international sanctions?
What’s the ANC’s excuse while South Africa was the darling of the world?

You sound like an ANC voter.

 

[Wut]

View attachment 1504687

$1 = R2 during apartheid.

Wasn’t the apartheid loss due to international sanctions?
What’s the ANC’s excuse while South Africa was the darling of the world?

You sound like an ANC voter.

Yep, and that's why I posted that meme earlier, which you responded to. But those sanctions were imposed because of who? Oh! That's right, the apartheid government.

As for the comment on sounding like an ANC voter, I'm not one, but I do see how the apartheid government was way worse.

 

[Cosmik Debris]

/care

the UN is not a legislative body and what it says about legality can be tossed in the nearest bin

It is actually.

the UN refused to send observers that were invited to be on the ground at the time

Your usual lies by ommission:

Yes there were invitations made and a number of foreign observers came to the referendum.

Absents were the OSCE which refused to come on the ground that Crimea did not have the authority to invite them. As well as the UN Human Rights envoy had to cancel his trip as the situation allegedly did not permit him to travel there.

the same UN is refusing to investigate Nordstream, it is a political club, nothing more

The UN is not an investigation agency nor authority.

btw you should double check bullcrap you get from the blue bird, China has taken a neutral stance on the topic, never voting to condemn Russia for taking Crimea and never commenting on "recognition"

that is not the same as stating "we do not recognize Crimea as Russian", that is simply the press pretending their silence is opposition ... like they all forgot the expression that silence is consent ...

Like this guy?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1643558407180353541

 

[Cosmik Debris]

The Rand lost more than 100% of its value to the dollar in the 1980s. A convenient fact apartheid supporters leave out. That's the biggest loss of value in a 10 year period in its entire history.

More than 100%? So the Rand was worth less than nothing then?

 

[Cosmik Debris]

As for the comment on sounding like an ANC voter, I'm not one, but I do see how the apartheid government was way worse.

Yet the country was in far better shape? And you're off topic again.

 

[Wut]

More than 100%? So the Rand was worth less than nothing then?

Pretty much. Do you remember the hoops you had to jump through just to take some money out of SA when traveling then? Remember these stamps in your passport?

 

[Wut]

Yet the country was in far better shape? And you're off topic again.

Responding directly to a post does not mean a person is off-topic, Cozzie. And... who made you the forum police anyway?

Here's your badge...

 

[Mirai]

SA has no sanctions and still the Rand has gone from 3.552613 to the Dollar in 1994 to 18 now, despite there being NO SANCTIONS.

That's a 5x decline.

 

[Quicks]

So... should we thank the apartheid government for crashing the Rand in the 80s?

1980 - $1 was R0.89
1989 - $1 was R2.53

So the Rand lost 184% of its value because of the apartheid government. An actual crash!

Let's do some digging on the new government's losses.

1994 - $1 was R3.42
2004 - $1 was R6.71

So a 96% loss which was nearly half the loss the currency took under the old apartheid government. So the new government actually slowed the rate of the Rand devaluing (whoddathunk that?)

Since then, it's followed a similar trajectory with losses nowhere near the loss of value under the apartheid government. Just because the actual number seems higher doesn't mean it actually lost more value, Cozzie.

You are thinking like the ANC...

Let's blame Apartheid for everything, just because it happens...

 

[Mirai]

Damn apartheid Nats. While they did oppress black people and this is not in dispute and that was bad, they also built these mines, power stations, harbours, freeways and hospitals, which if not run down, are still the bulk of what SA has to this day.

Meanwhile since apartheid ended, SA has built 100s of new highways, hospitals, power stations etc.... NOT.

This is going off topic though.