Mbeki says countries raising debate on use of US dollar

Fulcrum29 said:
PPP is widely used, even in many Mybroadband/Daily Investor/BusinessTech articles. We had that Shisanyama Index article some days ago, but it is relevant to our country, looking at a curated basket applicable to a demographic. Now apply this to a global scale, where we are looking at multiple goods within multiple markets, and you will run into issues, some set out in a Wiki,

en.wikipedia.org

Purchasing power parity - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org



and that same article quotes the IMF, to quote the direct link (now archived),

China’s rise, America’s demise | beyondbrics | News and views on emerging markets from the Financial Times – FT.com

beyondbrics, from the Financial Times, brings news and comment from more than 40 emerging economies, headed by China, India, Brazil, Russia, Mexico, Indonesia and South Africa. We cover politics and economics, finance and business - everything that makes markets move.
web.archive.org web.archive.org



and they are right, and it is totally incomprehensible (or rather distorted), globally, when you apply standard(s) tests. GDP and GDP at PPP cannot be reasonably compared on a global scale. This is why we have simplistic PPP tools like the Big Mac Index (global test, single good) or the Shisanyama Index (domestic test, multiple goods).

In perspective, what happens when we are compared in GDP at PPP to China? Suddenly BRICS doesn't seem all too weighted, but the same will be seen with G7 nations. Overall, using GDP in PPP boosts your global marketability more than using regular GDP, but it's important to remember that it's not a reliable method to draw on conclusions. GDP (PPP) is sure a good tool to convince or sway opinion.

In this article it is being done too,

www.silkroadbriefing.com

The BRICS Has Overtaken The G7 In Global GDP - Silk Road Briefing

By Chris Devonshire-Ellis The India-based Megh Updates platform, one of the world’s largest online informational platforms in terms of views, has stated that BRICS countries have officially overtaken G7 in share of world PPP GDP, and that this trend can be expected to continue. The BRICS...
www.silkroadbriefing.com

mentioning PPP only once. BRICS will soon onboard Argentina too, quite the PPP boost right there.
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Thanks for the trouble.
 
Who is familiar with historians William Strauss and Neil Howe's work, which proposes that history follows a recurring cycle of four generational archetypes, or "turnings," that last approximately 20-25 years each. According to this theory, the current era (beginning around 2008) represents the "fourth turning," a period of crisis and upheaval that will fundamentally transform society?
 
Here is a summary of the current turnings:
  1. First Turning: The High - 1946 to 1964: This period followed the end of World War II and was characterized by economic growth, social stability, and a sense of national purpose.
  2. Second Turning: The Awakening - 1964 to 1984: This period was marked by the counterculture movements of the 1960s and 70s, as well as increasing social and political polarization and a sense of disillusionment with established institutions.
  3. Third Turning: The Unraveling - 1984 to 2008: This period was characterized by increasing individualism, social fragmentation, and a decline in institutional trust. It saw the rise of globalization, the internet, and the erosion of traditional social structures.
  4. Fourth Turning: The Crisis - 2008 to present: This period is marked by a sense of crisis and upheaval, as established institutions and social structures are challenged and new ones emerge. The specific events and outcomes of this period remain uncertain, but it is seen as a time of transformation and fundamental change.
 
I make a conscious effort to remain receptive to new ideas and perspectives, which leads me to consider the possibility that the US dollar may lose its dominance within the next decade, especially given the current state of affairs referred to as the fourth turning. However, upon reflection, I find it difficult to envision any other currency taking its place.

Maybe it will be a crypto.....
 
BBSA said:
I make a conscious effort to remain receptive to new ideas and perspectives, which leads me to consider the possibility that the US dollar may lose its dominance within the next decade, especially given the current state of affairs referred to as the fourth turning. However, upon reflection, I find it difficult to envision any other currency taking its place.

Maybe it will be a crypto.....
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What about the CBDCs that a number of central banks around the world are working on?
Edit: which IS crypto as you mention.
As they can be controlled and programmed, these would be the perfect solution for controlling spending etc (no tilfoil hat intended).
 
Paulsie said:
What about the CBDCs that a number of central banks around the world are working on?
Edit: which IS crypto as you mention.
As they can be controlled and programmed, these would be the perfect solution for controlling spending etc (no tilfoil hat intended).
Click to expand...
CBDCs are still centralised currencies issued by a central bank, I was thinking of the potential of decentralised currencies.
 
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Fulcrum29 said:
Investopedia has a good overview of GDP vs GDP (PPP),

www.investopedia.com

What Is Purchasing Power Parity (PPP), and How Is It Calculated?

Purchasing power parity (PPP) compares currencies by using a common basket of goods to show differences in cost of living and standards of living across countries.
www.investopedia.com www.investopedia.com
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I used investopedia as a reference, and someone said investopedia is wrong

so what do we use to verify whether what investopedia states is right or wrong?
 
saturnz said:
I used investopedia as a reference, and someone said investopedia is wrong

so what do we use to verify whether what investopedia states is right or wrong?
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Their topic on PPP is not wrong. There is in essence nothing wrong with PPP, but to compare it in terms with BRICS and the G7 is pure marketing in order to elevate appeal. I don't know which data points they use, but the World Bank does provide PPP data, but also selective data.

I'm not sure what you're trying to convey. Could you explain why GDP (PPP) is a better metric than GDP when comparing groups?
 
Fulcrum29 said:
Their topic on PPP is not wrong. There is in essence nothing wrong with PPP, but to compare it in terms with BRICS and the G7 is pure marketing in order to elevate appeal. I don't know which data points they use, but the World Bank does provide PPP data, but also selective data.

I'm not sure what you're trying to convey. Could you explain why GDP (PPP) is a better metric than GDP when comparing groups?
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Take the below opinion. Mind you it's an extract from Quora so not sure if accurate, but if it is, then alll comparisons are useless as different standards are applied.

The U.S. GDP is calculated using the spending method. This means that America's GDP is not measured in terms of the real value of goods. In America, for example, all real estate is accounted for by rent, which accounts for 7% of GDP, whether it is actually rented out or used by the owner. America's legal system is overrepresented, with lawyers' fees alone amounting to 6% of GDP; The United States also spends 18 percent of its medical expenses; The financial sector accounts for 8.5% of GDP. All these services account for more than 81% of the economy; Less than 19 percent of the total was created by industry and agriculture, of which only 11 percent was created by manufacturing.

In 2021, China's GDP is already 77.5% that of the US, but if China were to use the US spending method, the figure would be at least 20% higher.

In addition, inflated service sector prices in the US also prove my point. Take medical care as an example. My friend's medical expenses in the United States are covered by medical insurance, and a CT examination alone costs $3,000. However, I had a 23-item physical examination in August 2021 in China, including a CT examination, and the total cost was 580 YUAN (about $91.2 according to today's exchange rate).

Of course, if the US included the underground arms and drug trade in its GDP, the situation would be very different. Given that the IRS now requires that theft proceeds be taxed, I believe it's not too far before these are added to GDP.
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Paulsie said:
Take the below opinion. Mind you it's an extract from Quora so not sure if accurate, but if it is, then alll comparisons are useless as different standards are applied.
Click to expand...
It is not complete correct as the US not only using the spending method they combine it with the production method and the income method to make it more accurate.
 
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Paulsie said:
Take the below opinion. Mind you it's an extract from Quora so not sure if accurate, but if it is, then alll comparisons are useless as different standards are applied.
Click to expand...

What Quora question is being answered there, they talk about US GDP and China GDP, what GDP is this? GDP is calculated by the respective nation's statistical agency. Whoever made that post, actually means expenditure GDP and aggregate demand. Then there is also the income approach. The World Bank uses market-based rates when determining their ratings in which they weigh GDP.

Again, measuring BRICS against G7 in PPP you are comparing low-income to high-income countries. This introduces a standard test. BRICS who is established to develop developing nations, who has developing nations as members will get a higher weight in PPP than using market rates. It is not an apples-to-apples comparison. India and China alone propel PPP to more developed nations. It is a weight issue.

Once these 'developing nations' achieve equilibrium with the nations they are being compared to, then they will also adopt market rates. Free market and all that, PPP is simply not attractive in that scheme.

In the end, people may use GDP or GDP (PPP), but you can't go and state on the record that BRICS have overtaken G7 in GDP. In the case that was true, then we would all, mostly, be rich.
 
buchanan8 said:
Interesting thread.
Has Macron woken up (albeit late)? I always thought he was a dedicated globalist, and therefore happy to take his orders from the US.
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he ran away from his country and realised his tour of Africa and China didn't go too well either, so now that he has to go back to his country in flames and he can't risk facing a literal guillotine
 
saturnz said:
he ran away from his country and realised his tour of Africa and China didn't go too well either, so now that he has to go back to his country in flames and he can't risk facing a literal guillotine
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There's actually tremendous opposition in countries like France, Germany and Italy to following Britain's example and becoming eternal US poodles. People who only consume mainstream media and who look at their current crop of globalist leaders may not realize that. But many French, Germans and Italians are yearning for more independence and less involvement in US causes like Ukraine, Taiwan, etc.
 
buchanan8 said:
There's actually tremendous opposition in countries like France, Germany and Italy to following Britain's example and becoming eternal US poodles.
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And you've spoken to all the people in France, Germany and Italy to be able to say this?
 
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