Israel says it has launched attack on Iran, as explosions reported in Tehran

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Cray said:
Do you really think the contracts entered into by undemocratic leaders should be treated as valid long after that political system has been overthrown?
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The contracts were extended by the prime minister who was democratically elected, so you have a moot point.

And I do think contract law and property rights are above the petty squabbles of regimes because those things are vital to prosperity and any regime that doesn't respect them is fundamentally illegitimate. So the government that nationalised them with no compensation became illegitimate.
 
konfab said:
The contracts were extended by the prime minister who was democratically elected, so you have a moot point.

And I do think contract law and property rights are above the petty squabbles of regimes because those things are vital to prosperity and any regime that doesn't respect them is fundamentally illegitimate. So the government that nationalised them with no compensation became illegitimate.
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Many governments are illegitimate then, by that definition, including the orange clown's administration.

What's more strange is that you give legitimacy to a puppet regime installed by means of a coup instead. 🤔
 
Fulcrum29 said:
Having a look at the EU statement:

ec.europa.eu

Leaders\' statement on the two-week ceasefire concluded between the United States and Iran*

This statement has been endorsed by President Macron, Prime Minister Meloni, Chancellor Merz, Prime Minister Starmer, Prime Minister Albanese, Prime Minister Carney, President Dan, acting Prime Minist
ec.europa.eu ec.europa.eu



Then to quote their High Representative on these policies.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2042177319310148008



That is an admittance that under their interpretation Lebanon is not included in the current truce. The rest being said is a position taken, but putting "should extend" on the record does highlight how the EU view the truce. Also, the EU isn't arguing against Israel, they only said that it is "hard to argue". The EU considers the blame to be on Hezbollah.

I have seen other EU representative related posts, blaming both Hezbollah and Lebanon. There is an message that the responsibility to disarm Hezbollah is on Lebanon. I don't see the EU turning on Israel, not as a collective, neither will France. All things are likely to come back to Iran, Hezbollah being their proxy. From my perspective, it is PR lines being drawn.

All in all, it does not seem that the EU considers Lebanon to be included in the 'points'.

JD Vance already said that Lebanon has nothing to do with Iran, meaning that the points covered does not include Lebanon. That would be the US's stance.

Israel's stance is obvious, I mean, it is observable.

I haven't seen Pakistan given any clarity since their PM's statement on the truce. All he has been doing since is thanking everyone being positive towards the truce. That is it, Lebanon is on their own until included by some proclamation.
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Israel's target was Hamas, and they ended up razing Gaza. Now their target is Hezbollah, and they're razing Lebanon. Next their enemy will be the Houthis, and they'll raze Yemen.

See the pattern? This has nothing to do with proxies. Proxies are just their excuse exterminate indiscriminately...
 
Mike Hoxbig said:
Israel's target was Hamas, and they ended up razing Gaza. Now their target is Hezbollah, and they're razing Lebanon. Next their enemy will be the Houthis, and they'll raze Yemen.

See the pattern? This has nothing to do with proxies. Proxies are just their excuse exterminate indiscriminately...
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Is there a common denominator or are they just doing it for a laugh?
 
Mike Hoxbig said:
Israel's target was Hamas, and they ended up razing Gaza. Now their target is Hezbollah, and they're razing Lebanon. Next their enemy will be the Houthis, and they'll raze Yemen.

See the pattern? This has nothing to do with proxies. Proxies are just their excuse exterminate indiscriminately...
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Funny that it's only enemies who attack Israel daily and who live and attack from among their people, who get retaliated against .... kinda makes your emotive bs claim about exterminate indiscriminately, weak.
 
Spizz said:
Is there a common denominator or are they just doing it for a laugh?
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The key is in the word indiscriminately. Civilians should be off limits without exception. Nobody can defend the kak that happened in Gaza, and currently happening in Lebanon. You don't burn your house down to kill roaches. If anything they are giving people an excuse to sympathise with the proxies, by being more destructive than they are. Just like what they did with Iran...
 
vigras rojara said:
Many governments are illegitimate then, by that definition, including the orange clown's administration.

What's more strange is that you give legitimacy to a puppet regime installed by means of a coup instead. 🤔
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Unlike you, I don't automatically give legitimacy to a regime on the basis it is "democratic". Legitimacy is based on how well they protect individual rights.

You should go and read on the evils that the evil Shah imposed on the hapless victims of Iran.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Revolution
 
konfab said:
Unlike you, I don't automatically give legitimacy to a regime on the basis it is "democratic". Legitimacy is based on how well they protect individual rights.

You should go and read on the evils that the evil Shah imposed on the hapless victims of Iran.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Revolution
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Unlike you, I don't believe that countries should just be able to spring coups on each other because we don't like their governments, and then conveniently forget that part of the history of the region.

You have interesting views on democracy though...😳
 
Fulcrum29 said:
I didn't tell you to trust anyone. I am communicating with sources that are on the record.
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You keep arguing that it's up to the US and Israel and I must defer to them. Are Do you mean in a realpolitik way... if so, well then yeah..no shït...you can just say whatever because nothing matters at that point.

Fulcrum29 said:
Forked tongues are common in such times. Perception management is the imperative.

For those who wish to save Lebanon, they could step in.
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Mmm, my favourite is that Kallas edited her tweet. I wonder what gave her this impression that Hezbollah agreed to something...

1775745914028.png
 
Mike Hoxbig said:
Israel's target was Hamas, and they ended up razing Gaza. Now their target is Hezbollah, and they're razing Lebanon. Next their enemy will be the Houthis, and they'll raze Yemen.

See the pattern? This has nothing to do with proxies. Proxies are just their excuse exterminate indiscriminately...
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Mind you, when I said that Israel started to act indiscriminately in Gaza I was told to be a propagandist, some here labelled me a stenographer. I had read walls upon walls, so much text.

Some celebrated the isles in Gaza being cleaned up.

When I look at matters like this, without being involved at any table, all I have to go with is what is being communicated to the public.

I used to see such things in business all the time. Politics, geopolitics, all the same.

Thus I will say again, those concerned with Lebanon, where are they? Why aren't they stopping what they consider to be hard to argue against?
 
Vorastra said:
You keep arguing that it's up to the US and Israel and I must defer to them. Are do you mean in a realpolitik way... if so, well then yeah..no shït...you can just say whatever because nothing matters at that point.


Mmm, my favourite is that Kallas edited her tweet. I wonder what gave her this impression that Hezbollah agreed to something...

View attachment 1899735
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Forked tongues.
 
konfab said:
The contracts were extended by the prime minister who was democratically elected, so you have a moot point.
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Um, what?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ali_Razmara

Ali Razmara, also known as Haj Ali Razmara (Persian: حاجعلی رزم‌آرا, romanized: Hāj'ali Razm-ārā; 30 March 1901 – 7 March 1951), was an Iranian military officer and politician who served as the prime minister of Iran from 1950 to 1951.
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Razmara was appointed prime minister by the Shah in 1950. His cabinet was inaugurated on 26 June.
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So yeah, elections controlled by the unelected dictator.... :rolleyes:

konfab said:
And I do think contract law and property rights are above the petty squabbles of regimes because those things are vital to prosperity and any regime that doesn't respect them is fundamentally illegitimate.
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In my view any capitalist that makes a deal with an unelected dictator knows exactly what he is getting himself into. Most normal people would agree that any agreement entered into by a dictator isn't worth the paper it's printed on.
 
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