24-70mm f/2?

[koffiejunkie]

This would be quite something!

www.canonrumors.com/2013/07/sigma-24-70-f2-os-hsm-coming-cr1/

Might need a trolley to move it around on...

 

[froot]

Trolley? No man. If your wife can carry your case of beers for you then she's good enough to carry your lens around for you

 

[bwana]

Maybe something to consider if/when my Sigma 24-70 f/2.8 breaks beyond economical repair.

 

[fvdbergh]

This would be quite something!

Indeed. Given how well the 18-35 f/1.8 DC turned out, I can easily believe that Sigma will be able to pull off such a lens. And I am willing to bet that it will come in at a price below the Canon 24-70 f/2.8 II --- ok, maybe a really small bet

The only possible concern I have is bokeh --- look at the images at the bottom of this lenstip review (or the "coma" section of same review). Will have to look at more real-world photos, but it seems as if there are some bothersome rings in the OOF highlights with the 18-35 f/1.8.

Still, f/2 zoom for FF. I hope Nikon and Canon are paying attention.

 

[koffiejunkie]

Trolley? No man. If your wife can carry your case of beers for you then she's good enough to carry your lens around for you

Maybe *your* wife will do that.

The only possible concern I have is bokeh --- look at the images at the bottom of this lenstip review (or the "coma" section of same review). Will have to look at more real-world photos, but it seems as if there are some bothersome rings in the OOF highlights with the 18-35 f/1.8.

I wouldn't be to bothered. The Sigma 30mm f/1.4 shows this too, and in real world use I cannot say it's ever bothered me.

 

[nanonyous]

If the OOF highlight björkéh balls bother you a whole lot, you can use an adjustment brush to go and reduce the clarity/sharpness on them in your raw module, turning them to butter. I'd be more concerned if there were pronounced doughnuts as some lenses present with.

As for the cost of the lens, I believe Sigma already announced that they expect to be able to bring the lens to market somewhere between the Canon 24-70mm f/2.8 and f/2.8 II's prices.
My primary point of interest for this is going to be whether or not it's weather sealed. The wedding I shot this past Saturday, I was glad I had the Canon 24-70mm f/2.8 (I) for use on a 7D, as I had to spend hours and hours out in the rain. An aperture of f/2.0 on such a range for a FF camera, or even crop, may be nice, but not if at the cost it's expected to come out it won't offer weather sealing. I think most people at that point may be inclined to simply look for a (used) Canon 24-70mm f/2.8 I

 

[fvdbergh]

If the OOF highlight björkéh balls bother you a whole lot, you can use an adjustment brush to go and reduce the clarity/sharpness on them in your raw module, turning them to butter. I'd be more concerned if there were pronounced doughnuts as some lenses present with.I

Nah, I am not too bothered about it --- I think it is just that a lens like the 18-35 mm f/1.8 is so close to perfect that I have to find something to complain about

But there is another angle to the whole f/2 lens that I think might be interesting: stopping down the f/2 lens to f/2.8 will probably give you a lens that is significantly sharper than the Nikon 24-70 f/2.8 at f/2.8. On the Canon side, there is very little room for improvement over the 24-70 f/2.8 II, but on something like a D800 this will make a marked difference. And we know it is only a matter of time until something like a D4x comes along with a ~36 MP sensor and a high burst rate ....

 

[fvdbergh]

... and another thing I just noticed on Nikon Rumors: Sigma are supposedly announcing a free mount conversion service. That should scare the daylights out of both Nikon and Canon --- well, maybe it will scare Canon a bit more

 

[bwana]

My primary point of interest for this is going to be whether or not it's weather sealed. The wedding I shot this past Saturday, I was glad I had the Canon 24-70mm f/2.8 (I) for use on a 7D, as I had to spend hours and hours out in the rain.

When I was in the market for a 24-70 I did consider the lack of weather sealing on the sigma but TBH the price difference between it and the canon was between R3-4k at the time and it just wasn't worth it. You can buy a whole lot of camera/lens rain gear for a tiny fraction of the difference.

FWIW the 7D is fairly well weather sealed but if I'm spending time in the rain with it and any lens I'm going to use a rain sleeve - I'll use a rain sleeve if I'm shooting a 1D body in the rain with a sealed lens. All it takes is a failed seal somewhere and you're screwed - it's not so much the cost, I'm insured for that, but the time involved. Even though I'm a CPS member I'm still looking at a few days while I'm waiting for loaner gear to arrive.

My Nikon buddies are even worse off than me. I've seen their D3's crap out in a drizzle and you can make good money flogging them black bin bags.

 

[fvdbergh]

My Nikon buddies are even worse off than me. I've seen their D3's crap out in a drizzle and you can make good money flogging them black bin bags.

... or I saw (on Petapixel?) an umbrella with a through-hand style grip. That might help to keep raindrops off the front lens element too. Sure, you will look pretty stupid using such a geeky umbrella, but there's nothing fashionable about a black bin bag either ....

 

[bwana]

... or I saw (on Petapixel?) an umbrella with a through-hand style grip. That might help to keep raindrops off the front lens element too. Sure, you will look pretty stupid using such a geeky umbrella, but there's nothing fashionable about a black bin bag either ....

You mean something like this?





EDIT - sorry for the bad pic - Tapatalk stepped all over it!

 

[koffiejunkie]

But there is another angle to the whole f/2 lens that I think might be interesting: stopping down the f/2 lens to f/2.8 will probably give you a lens that is significantly sharper than the Nikon 24-70 f/2.8 at f/2.8.

This is what excites me too. I'm not really that fussed about the bigger apertures. I've found, since getting the 5D3, lack of DOF is the thing I'm fighting most. Even at f2.8, a head & shoulders type shot with the 50, focus on they eyes, I can see the nose being out of focus.

... and another thing I just noticed on Nikon Rumors: Sigma are supposedly announcing a free mount conversion service. That should scare the daylights out of both Nikon and Canon --- well, maybe it will scare Canon a bit more

That would be interesting! I wonder if they replace the circuitry inside? Or does all their lenses really understand all the different AF systems?

When I was in the market for a 24-70 I did consider the lack of weather sealing on the sigma but TBH the price difference between it and the canon was between R3-4k at the time and it just wasn't worth it. You can buy a whole lot of camera/lens rain gear for a tiny fraction of the difference.

It's easy to forget that rubber seals are not the best kind of seals. Tight fitting seams are far better, and our cameras are full of them. Both my 50D and 7D has sustained huge amounts of rain, and so did the non-weather-sealed 70-200mm f/2.8 IS USM (I didn't know).

My Nikon buddies are even worse off than me. I've seen their D3's crap out in a drizzle and you can make good money flogging them black bin bags.

... or I saw (on Petapixel?) an umbrella with a through-hand style grip.

This sounds cool! Until you have to shoot in portrait mode

 

[bwana]

It's easy to forget that rubber seals are not the best kind of seals. Tight fitting seams are far better, and our cameras are full of them. Both my 50D and 7D has sustained huge amounts of rain, and so did the non-weather-sealed 70-200mm f/2.8 IS USM (I didn't know).

Seals and seams are awesome… until they fail.

This sounds cool! Until you have to shoot in portrait mode

The rig I concocted above is totally flexible in that regard - the real problem is shooting in PE with any sort of umbrella!!

 

[koffiejunkie]

Seals and seams are awesome… until they fail.

Of course. I just trust seams more.

The rig I concocted above is totally flexible in that regard - the real problem is shooting in PE with any sort of umbrella!!

Ha ha! You should get one with holes in to let the air through.

Oh, wait...

 

[bwana]

Ha ha! You should get one with holes in to let the air through.

Oh, wait...

TBH the only time I'd use something like that is to protect me from the sun. Shooting the Sevens in December is a real bake-a-thon.

 

[bwana]

... and another thing I just noticed on Nikon Rumors: Sigma are supposedly announcing a free mount conversion service. That should scare the daylights out of both Nikon and Canon --- well, maybe it will scare Canon a bit more

When I first read about this I was immediately excited but now that I've given it some thought I can't help but wonder why it would worry Canon or Nikon? Sure, Sigma makes a few really good lenses but the phrase Oh I wish I could swap from Canon to Nikon but cant because of my Sigma... is something I've yet to hear a single photographer utter… ever.

If anything I can see this only hurting Sigma. I mean who wants to buy a new lens if there are now so many dual system compatible lenses suddenly available?

 

[koffiejunkie]

When I first read about this I was immediately excited but now that I've given it some thought I can't help but wonder why it would worry Canon or Nikon? Sure, Sigma makes a few really good lenses but the phrase Oh I wish I could swap from Canon to Nikon but cant because of my Sigma... is something I've yet to hear a single photographer utter… ever.

If we ignore the Sigma stigma, for the sake of the argument, I think being camera independent would be great. I know enough wedding photographers who shoot almost exclusively with some combination of a 35mm f/1.4, 50mm f/1.2-4 and 85mm f/1.2-4. Given that Sigma has these covered with very good to excellent lenses, I can see this making it possible to switch rather seemlessly between Canon and Nikon to whomever has the newest hottest cam for a particular role.

If anything I can see this only hurting Sigma. I mean who wants to buy a new lens if there are now so many dual system compatible lenses suddenly available?

That may be their loss leader, so to speak. It's a bold strategy, no question. But I know a few Canon shooters who own the EF 35mm f/1.4 and *all* of them are lusting after the Sigma.

 

[bwana]

If we ignore the Sigma stigma, for the sake of the argument, I think being camera independent would be great. I know enough wedding photographers who shoot almost exclusively with some combination of a 35mm f/1.4, 50mm f/1.2-4 and 85mm f/1.2-4. Given that Sigma has these covered with very good to excellent lenses, I can see this making it possible to switch rather seemlessly between Canon and Nikon to whomever has the newest hottest cam for a particular role.

Do you know many photographers who shoot sigma lenses exclusively? I don't.

I wouldn't sacrifice any of my current crop of canon lenses for the equivalent sigma. No matter how awesome I think my Sigma 24-70 is... their 70-200 can't touch my canon one. Do sigma make a 400mm f/2.8?

 

[koffiejunkie]

Do you know many photographers who shoot sigma lenses exclusively? I don't.

No, not pros. But I know many who lust after the other brand's new body and wished they could switch back and forth. My argument is, more people might be willing to buy Sigma glass, even if they see that as a trade-off, to gain the flexibility on the body side.

I wouldn't sacrifice any of my current crop of canon lenses for the equivalent sigma. No matter how awesome I think my Sigma 24-70 is... their 70-200 can't touch my canon one. Do sigma make a 400mm f/2.8?

Nope, unless you count the 200-500mm f/2.8 They have a 300mm f/2.8 though - wouldn't surprise me if they had a 400mm f/2.8 in the works.

I wouldn't trade any of my glass either, but then Sigma doesn't have an equivalent of my workhorse 24-105mm f/4 L. But the Siggy 35mm f/1.4 and 85mm f/1.4 have both been on my shopping list for a while...

 

[fvdbergh]

When I first read about this I was immediately excited but now that I've given it some thought I can't help but wonder why it would worry Canon or Nikon? Sure, Sigma makes a few really good lenses but the phrase Oh I wish I could swap from Canon to Nikon but cant because of my Sigma... is something I've yet to hear a single photographer utter… ever.

Well, the thing about both Nikon and Canon is that their main strength is their system, rather than a particular product in a system. Part of the success of a system is the fact that you accumulate lenses over time, which usually locks you into a particular brand, since it rarely makes sense to sell off all your gear just because Nikon released a D800 (and Canon is late to the party, maybe by about 2 years this time round), for example.

So Sigma's new mount-switching announcement is not that significant to photographers with bags full of gear, but it is definitely something that will (or at least should) affect your decision if you are just starting to assemble your kit. Your system could actually be planned around Sigma lenses, while remaining brand neutral w.r.t. the body.

Sigma's move certainly makes it harder for both Nikon and Canon to predict expected future sales of both bodies and lenses. Given that they have been accumulating obscene quantities of old stock (I still see 600Ds, D3100, D5100 on sale every week!), i.e., they are already struggling to produce accurate sales forecasts, it seems reasonable to suppose that Sigma just made things even harder for them.

This may not affect the pro market as much (as you pointed out regarding the lens choices at the exotic prime end of things), but it certainly impacts the enthusiast market, where sales volumes are arguably much larger.